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Will minorities ever get fair treatment in Pakistan?

Will minorities ever get fair treatment in Pakistan?


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MenInG

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The recent shameful events in Pakistan seem to be posting a dark picture for the future of minorities.

But are these fears over-exaggerated or are minorities doomed in Pakistan?
 
Minorities will never be accepted by Pakistanis.

Jo hai, sau hai
 
Its only a matter of time when majority Sunnis will also fight against each other. Pakistanis are nose deep into the religious mess.
 
Only when Pakistan has truest form of democracy, political stability and economic stability. All of these factors will improve education of a common man, better understanding of religion, rights of minorities and civil criticism of religious groups.

The elite thrive on sectarian violence, have used it for political engineering, I wouldn't surprise if the ongoing violence against the Christian minorities are engineered to divert the attention. Elite of Pakistan has no bottom of barrel.
 
Efforts to promote education and awareness about religious and cultural diversity can contribute to a more inclusive society.
 
when u are used to building identities around group traits rather than individual merits you will always have a situation of us and them, the idea that Pakistani society will somehow evolve into believing non-muslims in Pakistan have any merit in holding those beliefs is unlikely to happen in our lifetime.
 
when u are used to building identities around group traits rather than individual merits you will always have a situation of us and them, the idea that Pakistani society will somehow evolve into believing non-muslims in Pakistan have any merit in holding those beliefs is unlikely to happen in our lifetime.
As younger generations grow up in more connected and globalized environments, they tend to have broader perspectives. They might be more open to understanding and appreciating differences among individuals.
 
As younger generations grow up in more connected and globalized environments, they tend to have broader perspectives. They might be more open to understanding and appreciating differences among individuals.
the largest groups in pakistan demographically, more than half the population is under 23, they grew up in this millennium with internet and are globally connected, if the younger generation were any different we would have seen the difference already. those who are more open like this are invariably better educated, and better resourced, and leave the country the first chance they get.
 
The majority arent getting fair treatment in Pakistan right now.

The state of minorities isnt anywhere near as bad as its in near countries, as there is no policy from government to abuse/attack them but are living in poor conditions with attacks by background criminals.
 
the largest groups in pakistan demographically, more than half the population is under 23, they grew up in this millennium with internet and are globally connected, if the younger generation were any different we would have seen the difference already. those who are more open like this are invariably better educated, and better resourced, and leave the country the first chance they get.
Elite of Pak will never allow vast majority

the largest groups in pakistan demographically, more than half the population is under 23, they grew up in this millennium with internet and are globally connected, if the younger generation were any different we would have seen the difference already. those who are more open like this are invariably better educated, and better resourced, and leave the country the first chance they get.
Internet in every kids hand isn't going to change anything rather an education system which is a derivative of a stable economy and politics, and will of the people in powerful position. The Elite of Pakistan is in no mood of improving the lifes of a common Pakistani rather improve enough so they can afford 2 meals a day.
 
A holistic education system that fosters critical thinking, creativity, and problem-solving is crucial for nurturing well-rounded individuals who can contribute meaningfully to society.
 
The only positive thing regarding all this is it has raised some awareness in Pakistan regarding poor treatment of minorities which is shame as it has come at the expanse of so many lives. Every thing else is damning about it. Unless Islamic education is centralized, there is no going forward. Almost all the countries treat minorities poorly though.
 
Pakistan can never be at peace with itself

We have fighting in politics, in religion and even within in our own families!
 
The majority arent getting fair treatment in Pakistan right now.

The state of minorities isnt anywhere near as bad as its in near countries, as there is no policy from government to abuse/attack them but are living in poor conditions with attacks by background criminals.
Of course you would say that
 
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well pakistani muslims do not treat each other well let alone minorities. The day a minority member becomes the prime minsiter of Pakistan I would change my statement.
however they have the audacity to pass on lectures about everything wrong is with the rest of the world and everyone has a conspiracy against them. Come on, focus on fixing your house first then think about what happens in India or in any other place. The universities are becoming brothels for teachers; killing innocent people on fake blasphemy allegations and what not. Paksitan biggest downfall is obsession with India. Different parameters. Compare yourself with a country of the same size with the same resources why with India.
education is so biased research level is like they ask questions from astrolgers and what not.
Pakistan fate is decided by Pakistani people on how many "inshallahs" they say in a day.

yes, we are not the only muslim country in the world; and i do not see such nonsense of attackign churches and all in other islamic countries.
 
It's important to acknowledge that interactions and relationships within any community can be complex and diverse. While it's true that conflicts and tensions can arise between different groups, it's also crucial to avoid making broad generalizations that may not accurately represent every individual's beliefs, behaviors, or attitudes.
 
ISLAMABAD: The interim government on Tuesday decided to organise a ‘national conference’ on interfaith harmony next week, as Caretaker Prime Minister Anwaarul Haq vowed to propagate the “true ideology and spirit” of the country during his government’s brief stint in power.

The decision to organise a moot to promote interfaith harmony came in the backdrop of the Jaranwala violence which caused the destruction of dozens of churches and houses belonging to the Christian community. According to the Prime Minister’s Office (PMO), Mr Kakar has decided to hold a national inter-faith harmony conference next week in which religious scholars will be invited from across the world.

During the meeting, the cabinet condemned the Jaranwala violence in strong words. Mr Kakar who visited Jaranwala on Monday and met the ill-fated families apprised the cabinet members about the situation in the city.

Furthermore, ‘Diyat’ amount for the financial year 2023-24 was increased to Rs6.775 million (equivalent to 30,630 grams of silver). In the last fiscal year, the compensation amount was Rs4.318 million.

 
Forget about minorities, subcontinental people are one of the biggest racist and discriminator people on earth.
Especially in pakistan, the dark complexion people are treated badly in our society. They put lot of racist remarks on someone with dark skin, handicapped etc.
Even the top comedians of pakistan build their comedy career by throwing racist remarks/comedy punch lines on the minorities, dark skinned people and handicapped etc.
 
The answer is a resounding NO. If you look the the mob that attacjed the churches and Christian houses most of them were teenagers or in early 20s which is basically the future generation of Pakistan. If this is the mindset of the young generation how can anyone be hopeful for the minorities in the future. forget madrassa educated children, even children in regular schools are taught to hate anyone other than muslims so such incidents are not one-off situation. Pakistan first needs to scrap laws that prevent non-muslims from holding high positions. Anyways its not like if they scrap these laws any hindu, sikh or christain will become a PM or President as they collectively account for just 2-3% of the population. Lastly, blasphemy law needs to be abolished as its more often than not misused. The Prophet SWAS even forgave a woman who used to throw garbage on him on a daily basis. I am sure he would forgive if someone abuses him too. Its funny the clerics forget this and are blood thirsty with the Sar Tan Se Juda slogan.
 
Chief of Army Staff General Asim Munir has said that Islam and civilized society have no room for intolerance and extremism.

In the recent past, several incidents of attacks on the Christian community have been reported. A violent mob of hundreds ransacked and torched nearly two dozen churches and attacked the residences of members of the Christian community following an alleged incident of blasphemy in Jaranwala town of Faisalabad district on August 16.

Matters of mutual interest, religious and inter-faith harmony were discussed during the meeting, according to a statement issued by the Inter-Services Public Relations.

The army chief stressed the need for promoting greater interfaith harmony in society to follow Quaid-I-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah’s “true vision of a united and progressive Pakistan”.

While expressing respect for the Christian community, COAS Munir lauded their contributions to the national development, promotion of quality education, healthcare, philanthropy, and defense of the motherland.

The Christian community delegation acknowledged the Pakistan Army’s efforts in combating terrorism and providing a secure environment for the minorities in the country.

The military’s media wing said that the delegation appreciated the army chief’s gesture as an “inspiration” for Pakistani minorities to take a more active part in nation-building and in restoring their faith in a cohesive and tolerant society.

Source: AAJ News
 
The answer is no.

Majority of Pakistanis dont care about giving them equal status from what I've noticed. They're more interested in the plight of muslims in other countries.
 
Minorities unfair treatment will be there as long as uneducated people are in Pakistan. Minority mistreatment is in first world countries as well and prejudice even educated people hold for minority tends to be there, if not always visually but closet ones are always there. One can notice from posts on social media as social media has exposed many closet racists all across.

Overall general population doesn't detest minority group of other faiths in Pakistan. I personally have heard nothing but good comments from many Pakistanis how we should always give equal rights to all our minorities Christian, Hindu, Sikh etc.
 
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Pakistan doesn’t have minorities. It has ultra minorities which do not have any political or constitutional representation

It is an overwhelming Muslim
Majority which through its constitution has declared the Muslims superior to other religious groups.
 
The Prophet SWAS even forgave a woman who used to throw garbage on him on a daily basis.
This is widely reported but I have not found it in Siha-Sitta (6 most authentic books of Ahadees). Can you please cite some authentic source?

Assuming above widely reported event is true, does it give any 3rd person right to forgive?
If someone abuses your mother, only She has the right to forgive. Neither her husband, nor you or your siblings or other relatives/friends can forgive that abuser on her behalf.
Let's say you are my friend. We are in public space with other friends. Someone from outside our circle says some pervert/strict words about you. Natural reaction of your friends' would be replying with interest. They will only stop if you forgive that person.
 
Minorities in Pakistan?

The vast majority of Pakistani's (irrespective of their religion) are now minorities or at least treated like minorities.
 
The answer is no.

Majority of Pakistanis dont care about giving them equal status from what I've noticed. They're more interested in the plight of muslims in other countries.
I genuinely believe, and my interaction with vast majority of Pakistani, particularly a educated newer generation, once the economic and education situation improves in Pakistan then majority would uphold minorities right same as theirs.

Currently the minority in Pakistan is the elite, who has ruined Pakistan, not just economically but morally, everyone else is majority, trying to find ways to get one meal a day.
 
This is widely reported but I have not found it in Siha-Sitta (6 most authentic books of Ahadees). Can you please cite some authentic source?

Assuming above widely reported event is true, does it give any 3rd person right to forgive?
If someone abuses your mother, only She has the right to forgive. Neither her husband, nor you or your siblings or other relatives/friends can forgive that abuser on her behalf.
Let's say you are my friend. We are in public space with other friends. Someone from outside our circle says some pervert/strict words about you. Natural reaction of your friends' would be replying with interest. They will only stop if you forgive that person.
oh bhai, dont know who you are, but in a civilized world, you cannot kill a person even if they commit blasphemy. Simple as that.
 
Gujjar Khan Church Incident: Arson Suspected in Pre-Easter Inferno

A fire damaged a church in Gujjar Khan, Rawalpindi, less than 24 hours before Easter services were due to begin.

The Presbyterian church caught fire around 3am between Friday night and Saturday morning. The fire destroyed fixtures, fittings and items stored inside the church for Easter.

The parish claimed that the inferno was the result of arson by unidentified miscreants. They pointed to how the church had been facing challenges from the builder of a multi-storey plaza adjacent to the church.

However, police said an initial investigation suggested that a short circuit probably caused the fire, though the fire department would conduct a detailed investigation to ascertain the reason for the fire.

The local Christian community claimed that Reverend Adeem Alphonse, the pastor in charge of the church, had been involved in tensions with the owner of an under-construction plaza adjacent to the church.

The root cause of the tensions between the church administration and the plaza owner stems from the blockage of an access street leading from the church to the plaza. The church had blocked this access street for security reasons for Good Friday and Easter services. The conflict boiled to the point where police had to intervene and resolve the conflict.

After Good Friday services, the church was locked, and the parishioners went home. But at around 3 am on Saturday, locals found the church ablaze.

The Christian community complained to the police about the fire. Despite their belief that miscreants were responsible for torching the church, they claimed that police inserted in the FIR that a short circuit caused the fire, a statement not contained in the original application.

The Christian community later staged a protest outside the church against the fire and demanded an impartial investigation and compensation for the damage suffered.

 

FIR registered in Toba Tek against member of Ahmadi community for sacrificing goat on Eidul Azha​

A member of the Ahmadi community was booked in Gojra, Toba Tek Singh district on Monday, at the complaint of an official of Tehreek-i-Labbaik Pakistan (TLP), for sacrificing a goat on Eidul Azha.

The first information report (FIR), a copy of which is available with Dawn.com, was registered under Section 298-C of the Pakistan Penal Code (PPC).

Section 298-C of the PPC elaborates on the penalty for a person of the Ahmadi group calling themselves a Muslim or preaching or propagating their faith.

In the FIR, the complainant stated that he was informed that a person of Ahmadi faith was sacrificing a goat at a village in Gojra.

Upon reaching the village, the FIR states, the complainant found that the person was indeed sacrificing the animal “at his home”.

“When he was warned,” the complainant said, “he stood firm and called himself a Muslim.”

The FIR said that the suspect had “hurt the sentiments of Muslims by sacrificing an animal and claiming to be a Muslim”.

“The suspect has committed severe abuse by following the rituals of Islam while pretending to be a Muslim,” it said.

According to Amir Mehmood, a spokesman for the Jamaat Ahmadiyya in Pakistan, religious freedom was denied to the community due to alarming reports of harassment and violence reported across Punjab on the sacred day of Eid.

“Shocking reports of police and extremists raiding Ahmadi homes, confiscating meat. What kind of Eid celebrations is this for Ahmadis in Pakistan?” the spokesperson questioned, adding that the Supreme Court (SC) clear orders were ignored.

A 2022 Supreme Court judgement ruled that obstructing non-Muslims from practising their religion within the confines of their place of worship was against the Constitution.

At least nine FIRs have been registered across Punjab against the Ahmadi community, he stated.

Data collected by the spokesperson claimed that three FIRs were filed in Sheikhupura, while one each was filed in Gujranwala, Rahim Yyar Khan, Toba Tek Singh and Sargodha.

Two members of the Ahmadiyya community were shot dead in Punjab’s Mandi Bahauddin earlier this month.

The FIRs were similar to the five registered across Punjab last ear against the Ahmadi community for sacrificing animals.

SC order
A 2022 judgement of the Supreme Court, penned by Justice Mansoor Ali shah, stated that “to deprive a non-Muslim (minority) of our country from holding his religious beliefs, to obstruct him from professing and practicing his religion within the four walls of his place of worship is against the grain of our democratic Constitution and repugnant to the spirit and character of our Islamic Republic”.

The written order stated: “It also deeply bruises and disfigures human dignity and the right to privacy of a non-Muslim minority, who like all other citizens of this country enjoy the same rights and protections under the Constitution.

“Bigoted behaviour towards our minorities paints the entire nation in poor colour, labelling us as intolerant, dogmatic and rigid. It is time to embrace our constitutional values and live up to our rich Islamic teachings and traditions of equality and tolerance.”

The judgement was issued in connection with a case registered against an individual from an Ahmadi community for “styling their place of worship as a mosque and displaying Shaair-i-Islam on the walls inside their place of worship”.

Source: DAWN
 

FIR registered in Toba Tek against member of Ahmadi community for sacrificing goat on Eidul Azha​

A member of the Ahmadi community was booked in Gojra, Toba Tek Singh district on Monday, at the complaint of an official of Tehreek-i-Labbaik Pakistan (TLP), for sacrificing a goat on Eidul Azha.

The first information report (FIR), a copy of which is available with Dawn.com, was registered under Section 298-C of the Pakistan Penal Code (PPC).

Section 298-C of the PPC elaborates on the penalty for a person of the Ahmadi group calling themselves a Muslim or preaching or propagating their faith.

In the FIR, the complainant stated that he was informed that a person of Ahmadi faith was sacrificing a goat at a village in Gojra.

Upon reaching the village, the FIR states, the complainant found that the person was indeed sacrificing the animal “at his home”.

“When he was warned,” the complainant said, “he stood firm and called himself a Muslim.”

The FIR said that the suspect had “hurt the sentiments of Muslims by sacrificing an animal and claiming to be a Muslim”.

“The suspect has committed severe abuse by following the rituals of Islam while pretending to be a Muslim,” it said.

According to Amir Mehmood, a spokesman for the Jamaat Ahmadiyya in Pakistan, religious freedom was denied to the community due to alarming reports of harassment and violence reported across Punjab on the sacred day of Eid.

“Shocking reports of police and extremists raiding Ahmadi homes, confiscating meat. What kind of Eid celebrations is this for Ahmadis in Pakistan?” the spokesperson questioned, adding that the Supreme Court (SC) clear orders were ignored.

A 2022 Supreme Court judgement ruled that obstructing non-Muslims from practising their religion within the confines of their place of worship was against the Constitution.

At least nine FIRs have been registered across Punjab against the Ahmadi community, he stated.

Data collected by the spokesperson claimed that three FIRs were filed in Sheikhupura, while one each was filed in Gujranwala, Rahim Yyar Khan, Toba Tek Singh and Sargodha.

Two members of the Ahmadiyya community were shot dead in Punjab’s Mandi Bahauddin earlier this month.

The FIRs were similar to the five registered across Punjab last ear against the Ahmadi community for sacrificing animals.

SC order
A 2022 judgement of the Supreme Court, penned by Justice Mansoor Ali shah, stated that “to deprive a non-Muslim (minority) of our country from holding his religious beliefs, to obstruct him from professing and practicing his religion within the four walls of his place of worship is against the grain of our democratic Constitution and repugnant to the spirit and character of our Islamic Republic”.

The written order stated: “It also deeply bruises and disfigures human dignity and the right to privacy of a non-Muslim minority, who like all other citizens of this country enjoy the same rights and protections under the Constitution.

“Bigoted behaviour towards our minorities paints the entire nation in poor colour, labelling us as intolerant, dogmatic and rigid. It is time to embrace our constitutional values and live up to our rich Islamic teachings and traditions of equality and tolerance.”

The judgement was issued in connection with a case registered against an individual from an Ahmadi community for “styling their place of worship as a mosque and displaying Shaair-i-Islam on the walls inside their place of worship”.

Source: DAWN
Here's a clip.


 

FIR registered in Toba Tek against member of Ahmadi community for sacrificing goat on Eidul Azha​

A member of the Ahmadi community was booked in Gojra, Toba Tek Singh district on Monday, at the complaint of an official of Tehreek-i-Labbaik Pakistan (TLP), for sacrificing a goat on Eidul Azha.

The first information report (FIR), a copy of which is available with Dawn.com, was registered under Section 298-C of the Pakistan Penal Code (PPC).

Section 298-C of the PPC elaborates on the penalty for a person of the Ahmadi group calling themselves a Muslim or preaching or propagating their faith.

In the FIR, the complainant stated that he was informed that a person of Ahmadi faith was sacrificing a goat at a village in Gojra.

Upon reaching the village, the FIR states, the complainant found that the person was indeed sacrificing the animal “at his home”.

“When he was warned,” the complainant said, “he stood firm and called himself a Muslim.”

The FIR said that the suspect had “hurt the sentiments of Muslims by sacrificing an animal and claiming to be a Muslim”.

“The suspect has committed severe abuse by following the rituals of Islam while pretending to be a Muslim,” it said.

According to Amir Mehmood, a spokesman for the Jamaat Ahmadiyya in Pakistan, religious freedom was denied to the community due to alarming reports of harassment and violence reported across Punjab on the sacred day of Eid.

“Shocking reports of police and extremists raiding Ahmadi homes, confiscating meat. What kind of Eid celebrations is this for Ahmadis in Pakistan?” the spokesperson questioned, adding that the Supreme Court (SC) clear orders were ignored.

A 2022 Supreme Court judgement ruled that obstructing non-Muslims from practising their religion within the confines of their place of worship was against the Constitution.

At least nine FIRs have been registered across Punjab against the Ahmadi community, he stated.

Data collected by the spokesperson claimed that three FIRs were filed in Sheikhupura, while one each was filed in Gujranwala, Rahim Yyar Khan, Toba Tek Singh and Sargodha.

Two members of the Ahmadiyya community were shot dead in Punjab’s Mandi Bahauddin earlier this month.

The FIRs were similar to the five registered across Punjab last ear against the Ahmadi community for sacrificing animals.

SC order
A 2022 judgement of the Supreme Court, penned by Justice Mansoor Ali shah, stated that “to deprive a non-Muslim (minority) of our country from holding his religious beliefs, to obstruct him from professing and practicing his religion within the four walls of his place of worship is against the grain of our democratic Constitution and repugnant to the spirit and character of our Islamic Republic”.

The written order stated: “It also deeply bruises and disfigures human dignity and the right to privacy of a non-Muslim minority, who like all other citizens of this country enjoy the same rights and protections under the Constitution.

“Bigoted behaviour towards our minorities paints the entire nation in poor colour, labelling us as intolerant, dogmatic and rigid. It is time to embrace our constitutional values and live up to our rich Islamic teachings and traditions of equality and tolerance.”

The judgement was issued in connection with a case registered against an individual from an Ahmadi community for “styling their place of worship as a mosque and displaying Shaair-i-Islam on the walls inside their place of worship”.

Source: DAWN
But what's wrong if they sacrificed the goat?
 
But what's wrong if they sacrificed the goat?
I was thinking the same. How does a non Muslim sacrificing an animal account to blasphemy? Could it be that that person sacrificed the goat according to Islamic rituals?
 
Could it be that that person sacrificed the goat according to Islamic rituals?
Yes. They cannot do that because they are not Muslims. They are also not allowed to build mosques for themselves to portray themselves as Muslim.

They cannot do anything that Muslims do as in Islam.
 
I was thinking the same. How does a non Muslim sacrificing an animal account to blasphemy? Could it be that that person sacrificed the goat according to Islamic rituals?
Those who objected are probably 5th fail. This is what happens when you follow local Moulvis blindly.
 
Yes. They cannot do that because they are not Muslims. They are also not allowed to build mosques for themselves to portray themselves as Muslim.

They cannot do anything that Muslims do as in Islam.

The state can deem a community non Muslims but they cannot legislate against individual acts of worship. Going into people's home and punishing them for individual acts can create anarchy.

Even from a purely religious lens going into someone's home to observe them committing a 'crime' violates the Sharia.
 
Yes. They cannot do that because they are not Muslims. They are also not allowed to build mosques for themselves to portray themselves as Muslim.

They cannot do anything that Muslims do as in Islam.
So individuals are persecuted and prosecuted for simply following their belief system ? Pakistan is a failed country and idea at this point then
 
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So individuals are persecuted and prosecuted for simply following their belief system ? Pakistan is a failed country and idea at this point then
I think the issue is that no one has the guts to call out this insanity. Everyone silently criticizes these crazy laws behind the closed doors.
 
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So individuals are persecuted and prosecuted for simply following their belief system ? Pakistan is a failed country and idea at this point then
This act was wrong , but the matter as a whole is not that light , I do not think you have enough research on this matter.
 
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How is the act wrong?
Bro, Simple thing.

This minority community is restricted under the law that they cannot do any Islamic rituals because they are not Muslim. That is why the act was wrong.

Not promoting extrmisism here but you cannot do all this stuff under law so that is why he was arrsted.
 
Bro, Simple thing.

This minority community is restricted under the law that they cannot do any Islamic rituals because they are not Muslim. That is why the act was wrong.

Not promoting extrmisism here but you cannot do all this stuff under law so that is why he was arrsted.
hmm, I would say the law is against Sharia principles that I frequently hear that there is no compulsion of religion.
The law itself is unIslamic by countering the basic tenants.

and honestly sounds like Casteism in India where Brahmins dictated what rituals could be performed by other castes
 
hmm, I would say the law is against Sharia principles that I frequently hear that there is no compulsion of religion.
The law itself is unIslamic by countering the basic tenants.

and honestly sounds like Casteism in India where Brahmins dictated what rituals could be performed by other castes
Yes you are right there is no restriction in matter of religion , but there is restriction in fraud.
Ahmeddiya can practice there own religion , no issue , follow there own prophet and his books , but you cannot use the name of Islam and propagate own ideology.

For example , I am free to start a business of soft drinks , but I cannot use the name Coca cola , use the same packaging and sell my drink , I will not be allowed that.
 
The discussion on Ahmadiyyat has been discussed ad nauseam... I don't think this needs to devolve into another conversation there. The discussion should revolve around whether any individual can practice their faith and it sounds like an absolute no in Pakistan. Whats the crime if this guy slaughtered an animal in the name of Allah ? Thats illegal ??? If so, that is absolutely disgraceful
 
The discussion on Ahmadiyyat has been discussed ad nauseam... I don't think this needs to devolve into another conversation there. The discussion should revolve around whether any individual can practice their faith and it sounds like an absolute no in Pakistan. Whats the crime if this guy slaughtered an animal in the name of Allah ? Thats illegal ??? If so, that is absolutely disgraceful
The individual was not ordinary individual but belonged to a certain cult , I am not sure , but I have read somewhere that Pakistan has laws that are against them practicing rituals of Islam.
 
Yes you are right there is no restriction in matter of religion , but there is restriction in fraud.
Ahmeddiya can practice there own religion , no issue , follow there own prophet and his books , but you cannot use the name of Islam and propagate own ideology.

For example , I am free to start a business of soft drinks , but I cannot use the name Coca cola , use the same packaging and sell my drink , I will not be allowed that.
He was sacrificing in his own home. It's not like he was carrying out sacrifices in the public while claiming Mirza is a Prophet.

You cannot stop individual people practicing. Religion is not a brand with copy right otherwise we Muslims would have infringed the copyright of the Christians.
 
I hope in my lifetime we see minorities given respect and dignity. But as we Pks are also treated as rubbish by the Junta and their mafia, this could be a long wait
 
The discussion on Ahmadiyyat has been discussed ad nauseam... I don't think this needs to devolve into another conversation there. The discussion should revolve around whether any individual can practice their faith and it sounds like an absolute no in Pakistan. Whats the crime if this guy slaughtered an animal in the name of Allah ? Thats illegal ??? If so, that is absolutely disgraceful
I agree this is a separate topic about how the state can object to someone carrying out religious practices in private.

It opens up a whole philosophical and diplomatic can of worms. The state cannot legislate in individual acts of worship. Even if we put Ahmadis to the side most of the religious leaders in Pakistan consider the other sects as Kaffir or Mushrik or deviant. Will they be allowed to file cases?

For instance some people are against urs and pirs etc and call those that practice those things Mushrik. Can they now file a case against them?
 
The individual was not ordinary individual but belonged to a certain cult , I am not sure , but I have read somewhere that Pakistan has laws that are against them practicing rituals of Islam.
your not making sense bud... I'm arguing that any individual has the right to practice what they believe, no matter if its a cult or establish Abrahamic faith.. Its ludicrous for an individual to be arrested for this. If Pakistan supports this thru its legal system, judiciary and politics then Pakistan is a lost cause.
 
He was sacrificing in his own home. It's not like he was carrying out sacrifices in the public while claiming Mirza is a Prophet.

You cannot stop individual people practicing. Religion is not a brand with copy right otherwise we Muslims would have infringed the copyright of the Christians.
If he knows that according to law of that country he is not allowed he should have been extra careful. He is in trouble because someone must have seen him in this act. He does not need to claim Mirza is a prophet , he believes in that , that is why he is Ahmeddiya. This belief is not hidden , it is printed.

No , no copyright infringement by Muslims or even Christians because Muslims do not claim to be Christians , they separate themselves from them , same Christians do not claim to be Jews.

That is exactly what I wrote above , if an Ahmeddiya calls himself what he is and not hide behind Islam , all issues will be resolved. No Muslim will be bothered whether they call Mirza Ghulam to be prophet or God.
 
I hope in my lifetime we see minorities given respect and dignity. But as we Pks are also treated as rubbish by the Junta and their mafia, this could be a long wait
Off course , but for that those minorities need to stop cheating and pretending. It is causing a lot of harm to Islam. Just be what you are, how hard is this?
 
your not making sense bud... I'm arguing that any individual has the right to practice what they believe, no matter if its a cult or establish Abrahamic faith.. Its ludicrous for an individual to be arrested for this. If Pakistan supports this thru its legal system, judiciary and politics then Pakistan is a lost cause.
I repeat again , everyone has the right to practice what they believe , not hijack others faith and misrepresent that across the globe.
 
Off course , but for that those minorities need to stop cheating and pretending. It is causing a lot of harm to Islam. Just be what you are, how hard is this?
I am not sure what you mean by cheating and pretending. Each community has black sheep but that doesn't give the majority to beat the crap out of them.
 
I am not sure what you mean by cheating and pretending. Each community has black sheep but that doesn't give the majority to beat the crap out of them.

Read all my comments , I am not talking about individuals but whole group. If they are Ahmeddiya and belief in Mirza Ghulam to be prophet , they should stick to that , why hide behind Islam , use its resources and then propagate own ideologies in the name of Islam.

For example Bahais , they have own prophet Bahullah , they clearly say that and follow him , they never misguide others about Islam. Thus there has never been any issue with them. Bahaullah also claimed same as Mirza Ghulam , or technically even more. But never any Muslim had problem. Problem is not what they believe in or practice , problem is the misguidance regarding Islam they are spreading.
 
Read all my comments , I am not talking about individuals but whole group. If they are Ahmeddiya and belief in Mirza Ghulam to be prophet , they should stick to that , why hide behind Islam , use its resources and then propagate own ideologies in the name of Islam.

For example Bahais , they have own prophet Bahullah , they clearly say that and follow him , they never misguide others about Islam. Thus there has never been any issue with them. Bahaullah also claimed same as Mirza Ghulam , or technically even more. But never any Muslim had problem. Problem is not what they believe in or practice , problem is the misguidance regarding Islam they are spreading.
Whether they believe this or that, they don't lose their right to beliefs( as wrong as it may seem to us main stream Muslims) and they certainly don't lose their human rights and the right to dignity.
 
Whether they believe this or that, they don't lose their right to beliefs( as wrong as it may seem to us main stream Muslims) and they certainly don't lose their human rights and the right to dignity.

There right to belief is not an issue , they can believe whatever they want to , but they cannot impersonate others and spread mischief.

If for example I have full rights to manufacture softs drinks and sell them in the market , but if I use the name coca cola on my bottle and use the same package , and sell my soft drink my my ingredients. When the Coca cola objects can I say it is my human right to sell whatever I want ?

In common parlance people generally use the word " kafir " for them. But they are not only that but zindeeq. Because a disbeliever openly announce there aqeedah , Islam has no issue with that , whether one is Hindu , sikh , Christian , Jain etc , they all have right to practice there religion. They do not impersonate or hid behind Islam. But zindeeq are those who use your resources , impersonate and then from inside spread false ideologies.

Human dignity and rights are not absolute. Yes , they have right to live , educate , get all other amenities , but not right to propagate false theologies. They have full rights to spread own ideology and preach that and debate about that .
 
I repeat again , everyone has the right to practice what they believe , not hijack others faith and misrepresent that across the globe.

There right to belief is not an issue , they can believe whatever they want to , but they cannot impersonate others and spread mischief.

If for example I have full rights to manufacture softs drinks and sell them in the market , but if I use the name coca cola on my bottle and use the same package , and sell my soft drink my my ingredients. When the Coca cola objects can I say it is my human right to sell whatever I want ?

In common parlance people generally use the word " kafir " for them. But they are not only that but zindeeq. Because a disbeliever openly announce there aqeedah , Islam has no issue with that , whether one is Hindu , sikh , Christian , Jain etc , they all have right to practice there religion. They do not impersonate or hid behind Islam. But zindeeq are those who use your resources , impersonate and then from inside spread false ideologies.

Human dignity and rights are not absolute. Yes , they have right to live , educate , get all other amenities , but not right to propagate false theologies. They have full rights to spread own ideology and preach that and debate about that .
You specifically write "but not right to propagate false theologies."

My point of contention is anyone and everyone should be allowed to propagate whatever false beliefs they have. That is exactly what Allah states in the Quran.
 
You specifically write "but not right to propagate false theologies."

My point of contention is anyone and everyone should be allowed to propagate whatever false beliefs they have. That is exactly what Allah states in the Quran.

According to Quran all the beliefs other than Islam are false. Now , Allah swt lets you practice and propagate whatever you want. I no where disagreed with that. propagate what YOU believe in as your OWN belief .

Do you see the difference ?

The Ahmeddiya are doing that. They are propagating own beliefs in the NAME of ISLAM not as Ahmeddiyya belief.
 
According to Quran all the beliefs other than Islam are false. Now , Allah swt lets you practice and propagate whatever you want. I no where disagreed with that. propagate what YOU believe in as your OWN belief .

Do you see the difference ?

The Ahmeddiya are doing that. They are propagating own beliefs in the NAME of ISLAM not as Ahmeddiyya belief.
Bro your argument is so weak... Let the Ahmadiyya propagate whatever they believe, YOU as an individual or the Government or the Mullahs don't need to dictate who can propagate what message. They claim to be muslim, let them believe that. It is for Allah to decide one day not YOU.

This exact specific thought process has killed numerous innocent individuals and is the disease that riddles the minds of so many Pakistanis now.
 
Bro your argument is so weak... Let the Ahmadiyya propagate whatever they believe, YOU as an individual or the Government or the Mullahs don't need to dictate who can propagate what message. They claim to be muslim, let them believe that. It is for Allah to decide one day not YOU.

This exact specific thought process has killed numerous innocent individuals and is the disease that riddles the minds of so many Pakistanis now.
Except this becomes a direct assault on Islam, and Muslims are supposed to defend their faith.
I will give you an analogy why this is a problem and it may seem crass but I am trying to show the relevance here, so here goes:

You have a brand name and a certain standard to uphold. Then someone different comes along with similar ideas but puts his own spin on it and tries to market it as the same product? Will you not feel aggrieved?
Maybe it’s a knock-off, maybe it’s substandard or maybe it’s just not worse or better but different. Point being it’s not the same vision you had anymore. Do you simply accept it?
 
Bro your argument is so weak... Let the Ahmadiyya propagate whatever they believe, YOU as an individual or the Government or the Mullahs don't need to dictate who can propagate what message. They claim to be muslim, let them believe that. It is for Allah to decide one day not YOU.

This exact specific thought process has killed numerous innocent individuals and is the disease that riddles the minds of so many Pakistanis now.

Again I am saying , the issue is not what they believe , issue is they are propagating that as Teachings of Islam. Suppose tomorrow I go out and speak on behalf of a company as there spokesman , even though I am not there spokesperson. And I give out false information , will I be tolerated by that company? Belief is not the issue , it is misrepresentation.

Allah swt has already decided through his messengers. The companions waged war and killed the person who claimed to be prophet.
 
Minority Rights March set to take place tomorrow in Karachi after approval granted

The organisers of Minority Rights March have been granted permission again to hold a demonstration at Karachi’s Frere Hall on Sunday against issues faced by minorities in society after the city government earlier rescinded its approval.

Minority Rights March was held for the first time at Frere Hall on August 11 last year where hundreds of people from all walks of life gathered on the occasion of National Minority Day to campaign against issues faced by minorities in society.

The organisers of the march had called a press conference at the Karachi Press Club on Thursday to announce that they would be coming out again at the same place on Sunday. However, the Karachi Metropolitan Corporation had on Tuesday cancelled its earlier permission to use the venue for the event citing “unavoidable security threats” in the city.

Today, Advocate Luke Victor told Dawn.com that permission was granted for the event after a meeting with Karachi Mayor Murtaza Wahab on Friday. He said the event would be held at 3pm at Frere Hall.

Victor said the August 6 notification was withdrawn and the permission was granted.

South Deputy Inspector General of Police Syed Asad Raza similarly told Dawn.com: “We have allowed them and issued the security plan.”

A letter from his office to the Karachi commissioner a day ago said: “This office has no objection if the permission is granted to the organisers of Minority March as per rule and policy. This office will issue a comprehensive security order to ensure foolproof security for the event to avoid any untoward incident.”

Source: Dawn News
 
We have to bring them back.

Willing to give away 10 million Muslims to Pakistan in return for even 1 million Hindus.
 

President, PM extend solidarity towards minorities, urge coexistence​


President Asif Ali Zardari has said the government is committed to protect the religious rights and freedoms of minorities in Pakistan, as the country observes Minorities’ Day today.

The president, in his special message for the occasion on Sunday, said: "On this day, we reaffirm our commitment to the promise made by Quaid-i-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah, on August 11, 1947, to the country’s minorities to protect their rights and religious freedoms.

The president added that the government has taken a number of steps for the political, social and economic empowerment of minorities.

He said that Islam, too, fully recognises and advocates the protection of the rights of minorities.

President Zardari went on to say that the government has allocated a 5% quota for minorities for jobs and separate seats in both houses of parliament to encourage them to play an effective role in the political and national development of the country.

Additionally, he said steps are being taken to provide financial assistance to poor and deserving individuals, marriage grants, scholarships to students from minority communities for their education, besides the provision of funds for the repair/maintenance of their worship places.

He said Pakistan was committed to ensuring the protection of religious, social, political and economic rights of its minorities, adding that every Pakistani has the right to live according to their faith, irrespective of their religion, caste, colour or creed.

“I urge all segments of society, including the religious scholars, representatives of minorities and the media to educate the people about their rights and work for promoting interfaith harmony, the spirit of love, tolerance, brotherhood and unity to make Pakistan a strong country.”

PM Shehbaz lauds minorities' outstanding role in Pakistan's development​


Prime Minister Shehbaz Sharif, on the occasion, paid tribute to minorities for their outstanding role in the country's development and prosperity.

He said that the purpose of celebrating the day is to express solidarity with the minorities living in Pakistan and to acknowledge their services for the state of Pakistan.

PM Shehbaz said that the minority community played a key role in the Pakistan Movement and since the creation of Pakistan, has been contributing immensely to the nation building.

Alluding to the historic speech of Quaid-i-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah on August 11, 1947, PM Shehbaz said that complete religious freedom has been given to minorities.

He expressed commitment to protect the rights of minorities and their overall development and prosperity.

Military leadership acknowledges role of minorities​


Meanwhile, the armed forces of Pakistan, the chairman joint chiefs of staff committee, and the services chiefs also extended warm felicitations to the minority communities of Pakistan on their dedicated day, acknowledging their indispensable contributions to the nation's progress, prosperity, and rich cultural heritage.

A statement released by the Inter-Services Public Relations (ISPR) read that this occasion serves as a poignant reminder of the diversity, inclusivity, and harmonious coexistence that are the hallmarks of our great nation.

"The minority communities are an integral and vital part of our social fabric, and their rights and freedoms are sacrosanct, as enshrined in the Constitution and Islam," the statement stated.

It added that minorities, throughout Pakistan's history, have played a significant role in shaping the country's cultural identity, contributing to its development, and strengthening its social foundations.

"From the Quaid's visionary ideals to the present day, minorities have been an integral part of the nation-building process, and their sacrifices and contributions are deeply valued," the ISPR said.

The communique further maintained that the country's armed forces honour the unwavering commitment, dedication, and sacrifices of the minority communities, recognising their unshakeable loyalty to the nation and their invaluable role in fostering a cohesive and pluralistic society.

"We celebrate their spirit and reiterate our commitment to protecting and promoting their rights, freedoms, and welfare," it added.

Govt trying to promote social harmony, says Mohsin Naqvi​


Interior Minister Mohsin Naqvi, in his message on the occasion, said minorities have a key role in the development and prosperity of Pakistan.

The minister paid tribute to minority communities in Pakistan for playing a positive role in the country's development, stressing that their role cannot be ignored.

"The government is trying to eliminate discrimination and promote social harmony," he added.

 

Temple brawl case: Hindu community demands arrests​


Members of the Hindu community from New Aliabad Colony, Hyderabad, held a protest in front of the Hyderabad Press Club, and later in front of the SSP office, along with women and children, against the failure to arrest the suspects involved in the alleged attack on the Rama Pir Temple in the colony, which left four people injured.

A case has been registered against 11 people under other provisions including attempted murder for the attack on the Rama Pir Temple on Halanaka Road and the firing and violence.

An FIR was registered at Hatri police station on the complaint of Shiv Lal Meghwar, a resident of Aliabad Colony, Halanaka, against Mahesh, Waqar, Sohail Jatoi, Rafi Banglani, Jameel, Ihsan Baledi, and others.

At the protest, Ashok Kumar, Gangu Ram, Teso Lal, and others alleged that a religious ceremony was taking place at the Rama Pir Temple when a fight broke out among some young men from the Hindu community.

Afterward, some youths from outside the colony also joined the fight, and more than 10 young men attacked the temple. They assaulted men, women, and children attending the religious ceremony, and opened fire.

As a result of the violence, four young men-Rohit Kumar, Sawai Kumar, Ramesh Kumar, and Teso Lal-were injured.

The said that the police were immediately informed, but no arrests have been made so far, causing fear and anxiety among the members of the Hindu community.

They appealed to the DIG and SSP Hyderabad to arrest the other accused including Mahesh who were involved in the attack on the temple and injured four people and provide protection and justice to the Hindu community.

Rama Pir festival in Tando Allahyar

Over the weekend, people from the Hindu community began arriving at the Rama Pir temple in Tando Allahyar from various areas of Mirpurkhas district on foot Members of the Hindu community believe that those who reach the Rama Pir temple by foot have all their wishes fulfilled.

 

SBP honours Baba Guru Nanak by unveiling commemorative coin​


KARACHI (Dunya News) - The State Bank of Pakistan (SBP) has unveiled a commemorative coin of Rs55 to mark the 555th birth anniversary of Baba Guru Nanak.

The SBP has issued a coin on the directives of the federal government to pay tribute to Baba Guru Nanak.

The coin made of copper, nickel, and bronze has 13.5 gram weight. It features a crescent moon and a five-pointed star on the obverse side, with the inscription "Islamic Republic of Pakistan" above it.

On the reverse side, there is an image of Baba Guru Nanak Dev Ji's monument with the inscription of the words "555th Birthday Celebrations." At the base of the coin, the years 1469-2024 are engraved.

The SBP said that the state of Pakistan is the heir to diverse religious identities.

Guru Nanak, the founder of the Sikh faith tradition, was born on the land that is now part of Pakistan. The tradition has millions of adherents worldwide. Its holy shrines are located in Pakistan.

The Central Bank has announced that the coin will be available at its field office exchange counters on Monday.

The birth anniversary celebration of Baba Guru Nanak Dev Ji concluded on Wednesday. A report says around 10,000 Sikhs visited Pakistan to participate in the celebrations.

Source: Dunya News
 

Meet the first Hindu PSP officer in Pakistan​


In a first-of-its-kind news, Rajender Meghwar has become the first Hindu officer in the Police Service of Pakistan (PSP) after cracking the CSS examination.

Meghwar has been posted as Assistant Superintendent of Police (ASP) in Faisalabad Police, Gulberg, and hailed from Badin - an impoverished area in Sindh.

After his appointment as an officer in the police department, ASP Meghwar stated that he is extremely glad his dream has materialized.

He said he could perform valuable services for his community in the police department which, he mentioned, he could not do in other cadres.

"By being in the police department, we can resolve issues of people on the ground, which we cannot do in the other departments," Meghwar added.

Meanwhile, police officials also expressed optimistic about having a Hindu youth as an ASP in Faisalabad for the first time since the establishment of the Punjab Police.

Police officials said that Meghwar would help maintain law and order as well as solve the problems of minorities.

"We are fortunate to have a Hindu officer. His inclusion will prove to be highly beneficial in Faisalabad. This will boost the concept of inclusivity in the police.”

 
Welfare of minorities among topmost priorities: PM Shehbaz

Prime Minister (PM) Shehbaz Sharif said that the welfare and prosperity of minorities in Pakistan are among the topmost priorities of the government.

Addressing a special Christmas ceremony at Prime Minister House, PM Shehbaz called for promoting peace and brotherhood, and ending discrimination and divides.

He said that the holy birthplace of Hazrat Isa (AS) is mired in war and bloodshed and emphasised joint action to put an end to war in Gaza.

He said in line with Hazrat Isa’s (AS) mission of peace and tolerance, Christians across the world should play their role for ceasefire in Gaza.

PM Shehbaz said Christian community in Pakistan has always lived with peace and brotherhood, and have been rendering valuable sacrifices since the country’s independence.

“Let us work together for the progress of our country which is a homeland for all communities,” he added.

PM Shehbaz also commended the choir of young girls who performed a beautiful Christmas carol at the ceremony.

The prime minister quoted Quaid-e-Azam’s statement saying, “Protection and promotion of minorities rights has been our top priority. You all are the proud citizens of Pakistan. Your equal development and progress is the basic point of our fundamental agenda. I extend you the felicitations of Christmas and ensure that your protection, security and prosperity is not only dear to us but our responsibility.”

Earlier, addressing the event, Minister for Information and Broadcasting Attaullah Tarar paid rich tribute to the Christian community for their contributions in the progress and development of the country.

He said the Christian community has always upheld the honour of Pakistan’s national flag both through their dedicated services and noble sacrifices.

Attaullah Tarar spoke with great reverence for martyr Haroon William of Pak Army who sacrificed his life for the cause of the country and was laid to rest with full honours, draped in the national flag.

The minister especially eulogized Brigadier Helen Marry Roberts, the first female Christian Brigadier of Pakistan Army and said she is an epitome of the meritorious services of Christian community to the country.

He mentioned with pride the three athletes-Sohail sisters, who won twenty two medals for Pakistan in international competitions.

Attaullah Tarar said he represents a constituency of over 70,000 Christians in the National Assembly and has received immense love from them. He vowed to make all out efforts for the welfare of the minorities.

 

Ahmadi worship place in Sialkot built by ex-FM Zafarullah Khan razed​

LAHORE: The local administration in Daska has demolished a historical place of worship, built by the country’s first foreign minister Zafarullah Khan, terming it an encroachment.

The demolition, carried out on Jan 16, followed a notice issued two days earlier under the Punjab Local Government Act, claiming that an extension of the structure was illegal as it encroached 13 feet onto a public road.

Zafarullah Khan, an Ahmadi by faith, served as Pakistan’s first foreign minister from 1947 to 1954. A prominent lawyer in colonial India, he was a key advocate for the Ahmadi cause in landmark judgements.

The worship place in question, constructed by Mr Khan in his native town of Daska, Sialkot, predated Pakistan’s independence in 1947.

According to members of the Ahmadiyya community, efforts were made to comply with the notice by removing the marked 13 feet on Jan 15.

Despite this, Daska Assistant Commissioner Maham Mushtaq, accompanied by police, proceeded with the demolition later that evening, they said. The operation lasted from 7pm to 11pm, during which electricity to the worship place and surrounding areas was also cut off.

The demolition is the latest in a series of actions targeting the Ahmadi community. Data shows that at least 22 of their worship places were demolished across Punjab in 2024.

Members of the community expressed frustration and disappointment, alleging that state institutions were complicit in vandalising their places of worship instead of protecting vulnerable groups from extremist elements.

Aamir Mahmood, spokesperson for Jamaat Ahmadiyya Pakistan, accused the local administration of continuously targeting the community’s properties and ignoring their grievances.

He claimed that the demolished structure, built by Zafarullah Khan’s family before Pakistan’s creation, had not been altered or extended since its original construction.

He urged the government to take immediate action to protect their places of worship and prevent such acts in the future, highlighting that these acts constituted criminal offences and should be dealt with according to the law.

Civil society groups, human rights organisations and various religious leaders have expressed solidarity with the Ahmadiyya community and called for the protection of their rights.

The Lahore High Court, in a 2023 ruling, clarified that Sections 298-B and 298-C of the Pakistan Penal Code, which criminalise specific acts of the Ahmadiyya community, do not authorise the demolition of structures built before these provisions were introduced through a 1984 ordinance.

Source: DAWN
 
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