Arsenal FC | 2022/23 Season

[Amjid Javed]

Relax. It is just a bit of banter. )

Banter is why you say some thing back in regards to a comment a other fab has made. You just made a nonsical statement about Arsenal in Europe, which no Arsenal fan has ever made. Huge difference.

 

[topspin]

Ramsdale is an awful keeper when it comes to penalties, didn't expect him to save any. He should have actually saved 2 of them.

It's definitely his biggest weakness. If we still had Martinez as our backup keeper we would've won if he was out there keeping the pens.

Arsenal have a lot of work to do in the transfer window during the summer. To not even get to a Europa final is unacceptable. Arteta has to take most of the blame for that.

 

[topspin]

Banter is why you say some thing back in regards to a comment a other fab has made. You just made a nonsical statement about Arsenal in Europe, which no Arsenal fan has ever made. Huge difference.

Agreed. Also he claims Arsenal have no "no European history" which is factually incorrect.

 

[Firebat]

Poor performance tonight, but to be honest it's a blessing in disguise to be out of this competition. We have full focus now to achieve something special which will erase this game from everyone's minds, this was not the case against Olympiacos or Villarreal.

Onto Palace. A Jesus special on the cards hopefully.

 

[Firebat]

Mikel Arteta backs Arsenal to recover from Sporting Lisbon loss against Crystal Palace but Gunners sweating on injuries

Mikel Arteta urged his Arsenal side to focus on their 11 remaining "finals" in the Premier League, starting with their home game against Crystal Palace on Sunday, after they were knocked out of the Europa League by Sporting Lisbon.

Arsenal were beaten 5-3 on penalties at the Emirates Stadium after a sensational long-range goal from Pedro Goncalves cancelled out Granit Xhaka's opener, levelling the tie 3-3 on aggregate in a second-leg clash in which the hosts were second best for long periods.

The manner of the defeat capped a bitterly frustrating night for Arsenal, who also lost Takehiro Tomiyasu and William Saliba to first-half injuries, with the former leaving the Emirates Stadium on crutches with what Arteta described as a "serious" issue.

"Huge blow," Arteta said of the result afterwards. "We really wanted to go through and fight in the competition and go for it and today we tried for 120 mins and penalties and it wasn't enough.

"First of all, congratulations to Sporting Lisbon for going through. Looking at ourselves, the game started difficult, we lost Tomi early in the game, then we lost Saliba and that left us with really difficult game management because we only had that window to make subs and a few players could not play the 90 minutes.

"But still, we didn't find our rhythm and our flow and we allowed too many spaces and didn't win enough duels, and then we gave the ball away many, many times, sometimes time after time.

"Then, the last 20 minutes, we got the flow, the momentum and created three big chances, but we didn't score."

On the injuries to Tomiyasu and Saliba, he added: "Tomiyasu looks pretty serious from his reaction straight away and what he said to me, but it's very early and very difficult to know.

"Willy, I don't know. He had some discomfort and he could not carry on, so we had to take him out."

Arteta will hope to be able to call on Saliba when the Premier League leaders face Crystal Palace on Sunday but, after comments from Manchester United boss Erik ten Hag in which he claimed Arsenal had benefitted from a clean bill of health this season, he stressed they have already managed injuries and backed them to continue in the same way - despite their European exit.

"We've been carrying injuries throughout the season," he said.

"We had Emile out for four months, we had Gabriel Jesus out for four months, Alex [Oleksandr Zinchenko] for two and a half months, Thomas [Partey] for a month and a half, Eddie [Nketiah] for a month and a half.

"We had quite a lot of injuries already but we dealt with that.

"The disappointment is not going to go away. The disappointment is there now, but it brings clarity. There are 11 Premier League games to play and the next final is against Crystal Place.

"We have to recover and put all our energy and focus there, play better than today and put the same effort as today and win."

https://www.skysports.com/football/...ystal-palace-but-gunners-sweating-on-injuries

 

[Amjid Javed]

Last night showed Arsenal are nowhere near ready for CL football next season, losing to a CL drop out team. Last night also just showed how poor our midfield is without Partey and oddegard. Teams in Europe are usually very good technically and Arsenal without the ball in midfield are atrocious, Vieira / xhaka were poor on ball recoveries, there passing slow and kept giving ball away. Jorginho kept having to make Last ditch tackles because other 2 were useless.

At the back Rob holding disappeared a few times, the Edwards chance was a long ball over top and holding was no where to be seen. We got cut up like that in 1st leg as well when paulina missed a sitter at 2-1.

Arsenal better pray saliba, partey and oddegard stat fit for rest of season.

We played 2 half decent sides in EL in PSV and sporting and looked average in both games. Unless Arsenal spend well in summer the CL next season will be seeing a group stage exit. 3 Cup defeats this season and all exposing fact when changes are made to strongest 11 the team is found wanting.

A Trophyless season now will be disappointing, making just top 4 ain't a trophy.

 

[Mamoon]

Not a big deal. It allows Arsenal to focus all their energies on the league. Europa League is an insignificant trophy in the long-term.

Its only purpose is to help achieve qualification for the UCL which Arsenal have secured already.

Nevertheless, in spite of the lack of significance, you would still prefer to win it than get eliminated in this fashion.

It is not good for the morale of the team. I was sure the head down merchant Martinelli was going to bottle it.

Very soft penalty but expected from him. He will never be that guy, he will never be a top player and someone you would want as a permanent starter in the team in the long-term if you are truly aiming to establish yourself as a top team and not just peak for one season.

Tremendous option on the bench but he should not be a guaranteed starter. I have said this before and I will say this again - he is the most likely player among the regular starters to have a stinker, he is the least reliable player among all the regular starter and the most likely to go through prolonged periods of poor form.

He will continue to be inconsistent and you would never know which Martinelli would turn up because his technical ability and intelligence/game awareness are not at a very high level.

He brings a lot of pace and energy and can stretch defenses which is why he is a great option from the bench.

Fans like [MENTION=16]Amjid Javed[/MENTION] can disagree but they are the same fans who were adamant that Arteta should be sacked because he will never improve the team.

If you don’t know football you don’t know football, and you will always be late to catch up.

I hope Edu and Arteta are keeping tabs on Kvaratskhelia. What a brilliant signing he would be. The type of player you want to as your permanent starter at LW with Martinelli covering for him. It doesn’t get better than that.

It will be difficult to prize him away this summer because Napoli have walked the Italian league and so many major clubs will be in for him as well, but Arsenal have a lot of pulling power now and the fact that they would win the PL this season means that it will be very difficult for a lot of these players to say no.

 

[Kianig89]

Europe league not a concern for Arsenal, Arteta the disciple on his way to pip his master

 

[topspin]

I hope CP don't bounce back on Sunday with the new manager bounce after going 12 games without a win. We saw what happened at Goodison Park in Dyche's first game in charge of Everton against us.

Arsenal will need to play well.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Banter is why you say some thing back in regards to a comment a other fab has made. You just made a nonsical statement about Arsenal in Europe, which no Arsenal fan has ever made. Huge difference.

Utd and Arsenal fans stop, there are only one Kings of Europe. LFC

Its first match I've seen in full this season. Arsenal are a well tuned , organised team. All the players know the plan, their positioning is excellent on the pitch. Their physical levels are very good too. Arteta has done an excellent job with players who are not world class but some with potential to be.

If Arsenal had a striker, someone who scores a lot of goals, the team would be even better. Jesus being fit is a major boost.

The problem is injuries, a couple of the better players down and the title could dissapear.

 

[Amjid Javed]

I hope CP don't bounce back on Sunday with the new manager bounce after going 12 games without a win. We saw what happened at Goodison Park in Dyche's first game in charge of Everton against us.

Arsenal will need to play well.

Palace have been are bogey team at the Emirates over last few seasons they are unbeaten in last 4 visits

2-3, 2-2, 0-0, 2-2

Palace don't conceed many goals so We need to score early and need to stop gifting opposition chances on Sunday. We need 3 points going into international break.

 

[topspin]

Palace have been are bogey team at the Emirates over last few seasons they are unbeaten in last 4 visits

2-3, 2-2, 0-0, 2-2

Palace don't conceed many goals so We need to score early and need to stop gifting opposition chances on Sunday. We need 3 points going into international break.

Looks like Tomiyasu's injury will result in a long term absence. Who should cover Ben White if God forbid he gets injured? Has to be Tierney right?

 

[Amjid Javed]

Arsenal's cup performances barring FA Cup win vs Chelsea, have been poor and pathetic. That needs to drastically improve going forward, some of fan base continously making excuses after each exit (this cup dont matter, its a mickey mouse cup etc..).

Reality is People only remember Trophys won each season.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Looks like Tomiyasu's injury will result in a long term absence. Who should cover Ben White if God forbid he gets injured? Has to be Tierney right?

Yeah I was thinking about this before and pretty much we have to hope and pray that White stays fit now, I don't think Tierney is going to get much game time between now and end of season unless Zinchenko is injured. Yeah Tierney could play at RB, but seems Arteta doesn't want to pick him.

From a training and attitude point of you everyone knows Tierney is 1st class, Zinchenko offers an extra man in midfield but he can't defend but Arteta seems to pick him no matter what.

I think if white was unavailable I think you would probably end up seeing us play a back 3.

If I was Tierney I'd leave in summer, Tavares ain't good enough. I'd also get rid of Tomiyasu as the guy can't stay fit. The club will have end up spend money on new full backs, when priorities should be 2 midfielders, yet every window club has to address areas of team which shouldn't need to.

In summer following should be sold
Tierney (reluctant sell)
Tavares
Tomiyasu
Lakonga
Vieira
Xhaka

We need to be replacing the midfielders with 2 top class midfielders.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Europe league not a concern for Arsenal, Arteta the disciple on his way to pip his master

Not a concern?

- Arsenal record in Europe is pathetic to say the least
- This is a Trophy, yet fans are making excuses like Arsenal have been winning loads of trophies every season and not winning this don't matter. Same excuses we're made with League Cup and FA Cup exits this season and last season. Its a dumb mentality to say the least
- Any successful team over a sustained period of time usually tried to win the vast majority of trophies available each season
- At start of season various Arsenal players oddegaard, xhaka, Ramsdale all said they wanted to win Europa league and make top 4, but now fans saying it's not important. It's embarrassing to say the least.
- Fans just coming up with excuses after every Cup defeat. There is just this big fascination that making CL is so important, the way Arsenal have been humbled continuously in last few seasons in EL, they will get slapped in CL most games next season.

 

[Firebat]

Not a concern?

- Arsenal record in Europe is pathetic to say the least
- This is a Trophy, yet fans are making excuses like Arsenal have been winning loads of trophies every season and not winning this don't matter. Same excuses we're made with League Cup and FA Cup exits this season and last season. Its a dumb mentality to say the least
- Any successful team over a sustained period of time usually tried to win the vast majority of trophies available each season
- At start of season various Arsenal players oddegaard, xhaka, Ramsdale all said they wanted to win Europa league and make top 4, but now fans saying it's not important. It's embarrassing to say the least.
- Fans just coming up with excuses after every Cup defeat. There is just this big fascination that making CL is so important, the way Arsenal have been humbled continuously in last few seasons in EL, they will get slapped in CL most games next season.

Come on AJ. If Arsenal win the league this season, no one will ever remember this game again. If we were just fighting for top 4, people would care more. When we were knocked out by Villarreal I was devastated. When we got whooped by Chelsea in Baku, I was there and it was devastating. These games had huge negative reactions from fans.

But when we are on the cusp of winning a league title for the first time in 19 years, I can promise you nobody cares about this. Most the fans I know were begging to be eliminated so it can be less of a distraction, they are angrier than you because it took so long. You can rant about I'm making excuses or whatever, honestly this is the reality, take it or leave it.

Of course in the team vacuum, the players and managers want to win every single game. That's why they are where they are. They will be disappointed, but as fans, the majority do not care this season about any other competition than the league. Once we win that, we can start worrying about how to be a successful team over a sustained period of time. But the trophies people remember are not League Cups and Europa Leagues. United won it in 2017, I've never heard it mentioned except by Mourinho mentioning it alongside the Community Shield. Chelsea won in 2019, again same thing. This is the reality.

If we bottle the league, no one will be consoled a little bit by an FA Cup or Europa League. No one will say that this was a failed season because we didn't win the League Cup. In this position right now, only the league matters. Next season will be a different story with CL, and we will have to vastly improve European form to do well in that.

 

[Kianig89]

Not a concern?

- Arsenal record in Europe is pathetic to say the least
- This is a Trophy, yet fans are making excuses like Arsenal have been winning loads of trophies every season and not winning this don't matter. Same excuses we're made with League Cup and FA Cup exits this season and last season. Its a dumb mentality to say the least
- Any successful team over a sustained period of time usually tried to win the vast majority of trophies available each season
- At start of season various Arsenal players oddegaard, xhaka, Ramsdale all said they wanted to win Europa league and make top 4, but now fans saying it's not important. It's embarrassing to say the least.
- Fans just coming up with excuses after every Cup defeat. There is just this big fascination that making CL is so important, the way Arsenal have been humbled continuously in last few seasons in EL, they will get slapped in CL most games next season.

Arsenal winning that elusive PL title with a tom and jerry squad will be some achievement

 

[Amjid Javed]

Come on AJ. If Arsenal win the league this season, no one will ever remember this game again. If we were just fighting for top 4, people would care more. When we were knocked out by Villarreal I was devastated. When we got whooped by Chelsea in Baku, I was there and it was devastating. These games had huge negative reactions from fans.

But when we are on the cusp of winning a league title for the first time in 19 years, I can promise you nobody cares about this. Most the fans I know were begging to be eliminated so it can be less of a distraction, they are angrier than you because it took so long. You can rant about I'm making excuses or whatever, honestly this is the reality, take it or leave it.

Of course in the team vacuum, the players and managers want to win every single game. That's why they are where they are. They will be disappointed, but as fans, the majority do not care this season about any other competition than the league. Once we win that, we can start worrying about how to be a successful team over a sustained period of time. But the trophies people remember are not League Cups and Europa Leagues. United won it in 2017, I've never heard it mentioned except by Mourinho mentioning it alongside the Community Shield. Chelsea won in 2019, again same thing. This is the reality.

If we bottle the league, no one will be consoled a little bit by an FA Cup or Europa League. No one will say that this was a failed season because we didn't win the League Cup. In this position right now, only the league matters. Next season will be a different story with CL, and we will have to vastly improve European form to do well in that.

All the eggs are now in one basket now, just like last season and the club finished with egg on its face last season. If the club wins the title then fair enough.However the poor record in Europe needs to be addressed and also the record in cups is a shambles.

Top clubs go out to try and win all competitions that they are in thats the mentality which breeds longterm success.

Arsenal won the FA Cup under Arteta, following season we see a weak side put out vs Southampton and lose, 3 days later we put out a strong team in league vs Southampton when we are 11th in the league.

Last season we went out of both cups, yet we weren't in Europe. We heard the excuses "oh we need to focus on top 4, cups are a distraction" then when we bottled top 4 the excuses changed to "oh well clubs target was get into europe"

Every time Arsenal fail in Cup or league there is a new excuse.

Again this season out of all the cups and its now down to the league. If we finish 2nd the new excise will be "oh we werent expected to win the league, target was top 4". Some fans are already using that excuse.

Winning trophies helps gain a winning culture and mentality, it also partly contributes to how a season is viewed as a success or a failure.

Yet a lot of are fan bases for last few seasons dismiss cups as nothing once we get knocked out.

Look at some of the most successful teams in last 35 years in English football and its usually started with a cup win which has then been built upon after.

Let me give you plenty of examples of that below

1) Arsenal were a mediocre side for the early 1980s then George Graham took over and built a good young side, their 1st trophy a league cup win in 1987 vs a strong Liverpool side, the manager and players all say now that 1st trophy gave them belief to they could win more. 2 league titles, FA Cup and league Cup double and a European trophy followed after that

2) Man united back in 1990 Fergie was looking at the sack if they lost an FA Cup tie vs Notts forest, they won the game went on to win the FA Cup, Cup winner Cup following year and then numerous titles

3) Chelsea 2005, Mourinho has openly said that the league Cup win that season helped the team get over the mental hurdle of previous failures in previous cups and tgeb help them go and win 2 titles in a row.

4) Man united 2006, United went through a rebuild phase where they were not winning as many league titles as usual. Arsenal (2) and Chelsea (2) meant united won 1 title in 5 seasons, the rebuild team including Ronaldo, Rooney won their 1st trophy in 2006 in league Cup, that team then went on to win 3 PL titles in a row, and a CL.

5) Man City 2011, City won the FA Cup their first trophy in 40+ years, the mental barrier of beating united in semi finals, then winning it gave the club winners mentality and they then win league following season.

6) Man City 2015/16 - Pep 1st trophy as city manager was a league cup, that help the squad then go on to win numerous trophies after that.

Yes the league is the most important, but Arsenal dismissing cups as mickey mouse, not important, bigger fish to fry nonsense is pathetic and hilarious at same time. Whilst all trophies are the same in prestige they can help a team get over mental barriers and help start of a period of sustained success.

You chose to give a weak example of united fans don't care about europa league and league Cup. I've given at least 6 example of where "irrelevant cups" have helped a team kick on and do well.

Any manager / club creating legacy is based on what you win over a certain period of time.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Correction: Whilst all trophies arent the same in prestige they can help a team get over mental barriers and help start of a period of sustained success

 

[Firebat]

All the eggs are now in one basket now, just like last season and the club finished with egg on its face last season. If the club wins the title then fair enough.However the poor record in Europe needs to be addressed and also the record in cups is a shambles.

Top clubs go out to try and win all competitions that they are in thats the mentality which breeds longterm success.

Arsenal won the FA Cup under Arteta, following season we see a weak side put out vs Southampton and lose, 3 days later we put out a strong team in league vs Southampton when we are 11th in the league.

Last season we went out of both cups, yet we weren't in Europe. We heard the excuses "oh we need to focus on top 4, cups are a distraction" then when we bottled top 4 the excuses changed to "oh well clubs target was get into europe"

Every time Arsenal fail in Cup or league there is a new excuse.

Again this season out of all the cups and its now down to the league. If we finish 2nd the new excise will be "oh we werent expected to win the league, target was top 4". Some fans are already using that excuse.

Winning trophies helps gain a winning culture and mentality, it also partly contributes to how a season is viewed as a success or a failure.

Yet a lot of are fan bases for last few seasons dismiss cups as nothing once we get knocked out.

Look at some of the most successful teams in last 35 years in English football and its usually started with a cup win which has then been built upon after.

Let me give you plenty of examples of that below

1) Arsenal were a mediocre side for the early 1980s then George Graham took over and built a good young side, their 1st trophy a league cup win in 1987 vs a strong Liverpool side, the manager and players all say now that 1st trophy gave them belief to they could win more. 2 league titles, FA Cup and league Cup double and a European trophy followed after that

2) Man united back in 1990 Fergie was looking at the sack if they lost an FA Cup tie vs Notts forest, they won the game went on to win the FA Cup, Cup winner Cup following year and then numerous titles

3) Chelsea 2005, Mourinho has openly said that the league Cup win that season helped the team get over the mental hurdle of previous failures in previous cups and tgeb help them go and win 2 titles in a row.

4) Man united 2006, United went through a rebuild phase where they were not winning as many league titles as usual. Arsenal (2) and Chelsea (2) meant united won 1 title in 5 seasons, the rebuild team including Ronaldo, Rooney won their 1st trophy in 2006 in league Cup, that team then went on to win 3 PL titles in a row, and a CL.

5) Man City 2011, City won the FA Cup their first trophy in 40+ years, the mental barrier of beating united in semi finals, then winning it gave the club winners mentality and they then win league following season.

6) Man City 2015/16 - Pep 1st trophy as city manager was a league cup, that help the squad then go on to win numerous trophies after that.

Yes the league is the most important, but Arsenal dismissing cups as mickey mouse, not important, bigger fish to fry nonsense is pathetic and hilarious at same time. Whilst all trophies are the same in prestige they can help a team get over mental barriers and help start of a period of sustained success.

You chose to give a weak example of united fans don't care about europa league and league Cup. I've given at least 6 example of where "irrelevant cups" have helped a team kick on and do well.

Any manager / club creating legacy is based on what you win over a certain period of time.

You give good examples here, but I can equally give examples when successful sides didn't need these cups to win. Liverpool broke a 7-year trophy drought with a CL, not an FA Cup or League Cup. Conte's Chelsea, Leicester, Mourinho's Chelsea 2.0, Wenger's Arsenal. They won big trophies before winning small ones.

Look at it the other way. How many FA Cup winners, League Cup winners, Europa League winners have gone on to do special things in recent times? Man City are the only team in the last 13 years that have won anything big immediately following an FA Cup. Arsenal won 3 FA Cups in 4 years, did it give us a winning mentality? What about Mourinho's United? What about 2018 Chelsea? What about Wigan? What about Leicester? Arteta won an FA Cup in 2020, we can see from your posts in the Arteta thread that it did not endear you to him one bit. We followed with back to back 8th place finishes. Liverpool won both domestic cups last year, they won't even make CL this year. Rangers, Frankfurt and Villarreal have won the last 3 ELs. Done nothing after it.

These cups are nice to win don't get me wrong, and you're right that many successful sides have won them. This is a correlation between how great these teams were and how much they won. But it is not causation. The vast majority of these sides did not win the big trophies because they won the small ones. They won these trophies in whatever order because they were great teams. Guardiola was always going to dominate this league whether they won the League Cup or not, because he is a brilliant manager.

The only time I'll concede that it has helped is examples like 2005 Chelsea or 2011 City, when they are breaking a long mental barrier. Newcastle would need to win a domestic trophy before winning a big one I reckon. Arsenal have won FA Cups recently, it did nothing and people don't care anymore. Arsenal's long mental barrier is with the Premier League, not with these other cup competitions.

Of course all the eggs are in one basket, it's the league title! Why do you think title-cup doubles are rare and celebrated, because it's very hard to juggle different competitions at the end of the season when you are fighting to win them all. Chelsea "put all their eggs in one basket" in 2017, Liverpool "put all their eggs in one basket" in 2020.

The examples you are giving are teams that were performing average but used the cups as a stepping stone to bigger things in subsequent seasons. Thus, these criticisms would be valid of last year's Arsenal. This year, we are already in the title race, we are already fighting at the top, we have made the step without it. At this stage, any other competition only serves as more matches and more possibilities to distract and detract from that goal, especially competitions like FA Cup and EL that will add even more tough games to our run in.

We are in a league title race and the only thing that will make or break this season is this title.

 

[Amjid Javed]

[MENTION=138771]Firebat[/MENTION] - so all of Arsenal's pathetic Cup exits since FA Cup win are acceptable to you then are they? What did the Cup exits achieve last season? Did less games get it us top 4? No it didn't.

Again in hearing same Lame excuses that extra cups games are a hindrance this season? If all these cups are then it shows how poor Arsenal squad is if they can't handle balancing all the competitions they enter in.

If we finish 2nd at end of season let's see what the change of excuses are, because we supposedly dropped out of cups because league was only thing that was important, same as last season when team bottled top 4 and were playing one game a week for most of last season. Same excuses we're used last year about to many games, which you confidently ignored and choose not to address when I mentioned it before.

Like I said before look at most dominant sides in English football and they look to take most completions they are in seriously.

 

[Amjid Javed]

The only time I'll concede that it has helped is examples like 2005 Chelsea or 2011 City, when they are breaking a long mental barrier. Newcastle would need to win a domestic trophy before winning a big one I reckon. Arsenal have won FA Cups recently, it did nothing and people don't care anymore. Arsenal's long mental barrier is with the Premier League, not with these other cup competitions.

Why you picking just a 13 year period? Is that how long you have watched football for? Funny how you ignore the 2 examples I gave for man united and Arsenal In 1987.

All 3 of those examples has sustained success.

Arsenal's only mental block is the PL? So what's the excuse for the pathetic performances in Europe? Something again which I mentioned and you ignored. You going to tell me Arsenal fans don't care about European football? Fans are getting gassed up about being CL again after 7 years. Getting Top 4 was a supposed big thing last season because club had to be in the CL. when the clubs performances in Europe are a disgrace.

Finally how exactly is the club going to have sustained success when it can handle more then being in 1 competition, whilst there are no guarantee on winning trophies the club's is embarrassing itself in Cup competitions over last few years in particular

 

[Firebat]

[MENTION=138771]Firebat[/MENTION] - so all of Arsenal's pathetic Cup exits since FA Cup win are acceptable to you then are they?

Alright please quote me where I said this. This should be good.

these criticisms would be valid of last year's Arsenal

When we were knocked out by Villarreal I was devastated. When we got whooped by Chelsea in Baku, I was there and it was devastating.

Can't wait for your response.

 

[topspin]

Arsenal winning that elusive PL title with a tom and jerry squad will be some achievement

What do you mean by "tom and jerry" squad?

 

[Firebat]

Why you picking just a 13 year period? Is that how long you have watched football for? Funny how you ignore the 2 examples I gave for man united and Arsenal In 1987.

All 3 of those examples has sustained success.

Arsenal's only mental block is the PL? So what's the excuse for the pathetic performances in Europe? Something again which I mentioned and you ignored. You going to tell me Arsenal fans don't care about European football? Fans are getting gassed up about being CL again after 7 years. Getting Top 4 was a supposed big thing last season because club had to be in the CL. when the clubs performances in Europe are a disgrace.

Finally how exactly is the club going to have sustained success when it can handle more then being in 1 competition, whilst there are no guarantee on winning trophies the club's is embarrassing itself in Cup competitions over last few years in particular

You gave a number of examples from the last 36 years. If you read my post, I actually called them "good examples". I then gave double the number of counter examples just from the last 13 years of either sides that started winning big without winning small, or winning small did absolutely nothing to help them win big. Thus, the correlation is weak to say that successful teams have to win small cups to win big cups. I can't make it any clearer.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Alright please quote me where I said this. This should be good.





Can't wait for your response.

Fair enough you seem them as not acceptable, thats all i wanted to see with an answer.

 

[Amjid Javed]

You gave a number of examples from the last 36 years. If you read my post, I actually called them "good examples". I then gave double the number of counter examples just from the last 13 years of either sides that started winning big without winning small, or winning small did absolutely nothing to help them win big. Thus, the correlation is weak to say that successful teams have to win small cups to win big cups. I can't make it any clearer.

My point isnt just about small or big cups, my main point i was trying to get across is Arsenal nor the fans are in a position to dismiss any cup competition. This isnt just something about the last few years, i use to hate when wenger would put weakened teams out in the FA cup, in order to try and so called win CL or just to finish Top 4, its a poor mentality. Elite sport is about winning.

Anyways - good debate!

 

[Firebat]

My point isnt just about small or big cups, my main point i was trying to get across is Arsenal nor the fans are in a position to dismiss any cup competition. This isnt just something about the last few years, i use to hate when wenger would put weakened teams out in the FA cup, in order to try and so called win CL or just to finish Top 4, its a poor mentality. Elite sport is about winning.

Anyways - good debate!

Fair, good debate.

Thoughts on tomorrow's game? We've a poor record at home to Palace recently but we beat them well in the return fixture. I'll be there, it's a shame about Vieira as I was hoping to see him. I don't think we'll suffer that new manager bounce though like at Everton, they don't have anyone in yet.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Fair, good debate.

Thoughts on tomorrow's game? We've a poor record at home to Palace recently but we beat them well in the return fixture. I'll be there, it's a shame about Vieira as I was hoping to see him. I don't think we'll suffer that new manager bounce though like at Everton, they don't have anyone in yet.

Palace have drawn 3 and won 1 out of last visits, whilst they havent been in great form they dont conceed many goals and at moment we seem to also be more open at home and gifting teams chances. We cant afford to be sloppy an gift a goal away tomorrow.

I do think if we get an early goal tomorrow we will win comfortable. I just hope Saliba is fit, because if not i can see us leaking goals with Holding playing.

Tomorrow is must win, as is leeds after international break.

We need to make sure that we are 11 Points clear by time City play liverpool.

 

[topspin]

I do think if we get an early goal tomorrow we will win comfortable. I just hope Saliba is fit, because if not i can see us leaking goals with Holding playing..

According to L'Equipe, it's not good news. They claim he'll be out for several weeks.

If I was Arteta, move Ben White to RCB and have Tierney playing as a RB.

We can't have Holding playing as CB especially against Liverpool (if Saliba remains unavailable).

 

[Amjid Javed]

According to L'Equipe, it's not good news. They claim he'll be out for several weeks.

If I was Arteta, move Ben White to RCB and have Tierney playing as a RB.

We can't have Holding playing as CB especially against Liverpool (if Saliba remains unavailable).

Yeah Holding at CB vs Liverpool would see us get the usual hammering at anfield. I doubt Arteta will play Tierney.

Issue is city have clicked into gear and dropping points could now be fatal in title race.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

The finishing needs to be more clinical

 

[Amjid Javed]

Zaha hits the post for Palace, that's a warning for Arsenal on the break already.

Can't afford sloppiness here

 

[Amjid Javed]

Palace cut open Arsenal again and Ramsdale makes a good save. 2nd warning, every home game we are poor defensively.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Martinelli gives Arsenal the lead, 13th Goal of season. Not bad for a bottle job player

 

[Amjid Javed]

2-0 Saka, that was a much needed 2nd goal

 

[Amjid Javed]

3-0 xhaka, need to get GD up to city's or even past it.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Palace pull one back, hows that not handball? *

 

[Amjid Javed]

Palace still creating chance, this is poor defensively

 

[Amjid Javed]

Saka scores from a good Tierney pull back

 

[Kroll]

Mamoon busy this weekend ordering the unday and tamaatar but the fixture list will be more difficult now after a very easy March.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Mamoon busy this weekend ordering the unday and tamaatar but the fixture list will be more difficult now after a very easy March.

Only person to predict Arsenal were going to win league at start of season was MIG.

Since we lost to City, we have won 6 out of 6, Leeds next after international break.

Everyone knows we have tough fixtures in April, one game at a time.

 

[topspin]

Good win today.

I just hope Saliba is back for us in time for the Liverpool game. In his absence, we should be okay for the next game against Leeds.

If we can get 21 points in the last 10 games and avoid defeat to City we'll win the league, unless City win all their other games, in which case they'll win the league by 1 point.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Good win today.

I just hope Saliba is back for us in time for the Liverpool game. In his absence, we should be okay for the next game against Leeds.

If we can get 21 points in the last 10 games and avoid defeat to City we'll win the league, unless City win all their other games, in which case they'll win the league by 1 point.

We need to avoid defeat at Anfield and the Eithad, I can't see us winning those games but we could get draws. We will have to cut out the silly defensive mistakes. I think we will have to win 8 out of last 10 for title

 

[MenInG]

Arsenal back in business after European disappointment

For Arsenal manager Mikel Arteta, this was a perfect response after his side lost on penalties to Sporting Lisbon in the last 16 of the Europa League on Thursday.

Once Martinelli put them ahead with his 13th goal of the season, there only looked to be one winner, with Palace powerless to stop Arsenal.

Saka's goal, confirmed by the video assistant referee following a check for offside, made it 2-0, with Xhaka adding a third in the 55th minute.

Palace got a goal back, but it was no surprise that Saka soon scored again to take his total to 13 for the campaign.

Arteta will also be delighted with the character his team have shown as they have bounced back from setbacks.

This victory was their sixth in a row in the league since a 3-1 home loss to City threatened to derail their title hopes.

But they have recovered in style and go into the international break in pole position.

 

[topspin]

We need to avoid defeat at Anfield and the Eithad, I can't see us winning those games but we could get draws. We will have to cut out the silly defensive mistakes. I think we will have to win 8 out of last 10 for title

So you don't think 90 points will be enough for Arsenal?

 

[hitthestump]

It is a huge blessing for Arsenal that they have been knocked out of the Europa League. It is a harmful distraction when an unlikely league title beckons after so long.

Manchester City may have unrivalled squad depth but competing on multiple fronts will take its toll on anyone. You can rest assured that despite any amount of rotation there will still be occasions where the team simply do not turn up on the day. This places Arsenal as clear favourites for the league now.

Arsenal just have to hope for the best in terms of injuries. There are still several key areas where they cannot afford a drop off in personnel. The Europa League has proved that Arsenal second string is a totally different animal to their first XI.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

So much salt it's unbelievable. Arsenal in today's world are basically doing a Leicester.

This team's got balls

 

[KingKhanWC]

It is a huge blessing for Arsenal that they have been knocked out of the Europa League. It is a harmful distraction when an unlikely league title beckons after so long.

Manchester City may have unrivalled squad depth but competing on multiple fronts will take its toll on anyone. You can rest assured that despite any amount of rotation there will still be occasions where the team simply do not turn up on the day. This places Arsenal as clear favourites for the league now.

Arsenal just have to hope for the best in terms of injuries. There are still several key areas where they cannot afford a drop off in personnel. The Europa League has proved that Arsenal second string is a totally different animal to their first XI.

Its simple for Arsenal, if they dont lose their main players to injuries, they will win the league. 2 or more injured in the next 2-3 games, City are then favs for me.

 

[Amjid Javed]

So you don't think 90 points will be enough for Arsenal?

I have said all along numerous times in this thread and title predictions thread 90 points would be needed by who ever wins the league.

Right now yes the 21 points you mentioned would equate to us getting 90 points, but it would depend on where we're get those points from. If we win 7 out of our last 10 games, but lose to City the 90 points may not be enough then, the form city in at moment the Liverpool game and Arsenal game are ones where they could drop points, I think they could easily win all their other fixtures.

This is why I think If Arsenal get draws at Liverpool and City that will help massively. Also now because Man city are in the FA Cup semi final, they will have to have another one of their fixtures re-arranged. Which could see a situation towards end of season where we may end up playing 2 or 3 PL fixtures extra before City, so points on board will be huge as man city need to re-arrange Leicester, West ham and Brighton fixtures.

 

[topspin]

I have said all along numerous times in this thread and title predictions thread 90 points would be needed by who ever wins the league.

Right now yes the 21 points you mentioned would equate to us getting 90 points, but it would depend on where we're get those points from. If we win 7 out of our last 10 games, but lose to City the 90 points may not be enough then, the form city in at moment the Liverpool game and Arsenal game are ones where they could drop points, I think they could easily win all their other fixtures.

This is why I think If Arsenal get draws at Liverpool and City that will help massively. Also now because Man city are in the FA Cup semi final, they will have to have another one of their fixtures re-arranged. Which could see a situation towards end of season where we may end up playing 2 or 3 PL fixtures extra before City, so points on board will be huge as man city need to re-arrange Leicester, West ham and Brighton fixtures.

In that case we're thinking along the same lines. 21 points without losing to City is enough for us to win the league.

If we lose to City however then I agree we need to win 8 of the other 9 games remaining.

 

[Firebat]

Arsenal 4-1 Crystal Palace: Mikel Arteta calls on his players to 'give a little bit more' to withstand Man City

Mikel Arteta has called on his Arsenal players to "give a little bit more" in their final 10 remaining Premier League games as the Gunners close in on a first league title since 2004.

Arsenal became the first side in English Football League history to win nine London derbies in a single league season - and their latest success means they head into the international break with an eight-point buffer over their title rivals Manchester City, albeit having played a game more.

Bukayo Saka once again starred in Sunday's 4-1 win over Crystal Palace, scoring twice and set up the opener for Gabriel Martinelli, becoming the first Premier League player this season to reach double figures for both goals and assists.

Four years on since he swore at his own fans when his substitution in this fixture was cheered, Granit Xhaka's fine season continued when he turned home the third after the interval.

"I'm really happy and really pleased with the way we started the game and how we reacted to Thursday," said Arteta in reference to the Europa League penalty shootout exit at the hands of Sporting Lisbon.

"We took any question mark away from it. We showed a lot of determination and a lot of purpose in the way we played. I'm really happy with the way we played after playing 120 minutes, after losing two players [William Saliba and Takehiro Tomiyasu], I'm really pleased with what we showed.

When asked if Saka is the best player in the Premier League on current form, Arteta responded: "The team did really well, and of course we then have very good individuals who excel at the level that we want. But he was again really good today and he really affected the result with his contribution, especially in the opponent's box."

Tomiyasu left the Emirates having watched the game from the stands in a knee brace and with crutches. The Japan international is expected to undergo surgery which is likely to rule him out for the rest of the season.

It is a time for Arsenal to show their depth once more in a season where key personnel have been missing at regular intervals.

"We don't know," added Arteta when asked if Tomiyasu could miss the rest of the season. "The doctor is going to assess him. We've had one assessment and there will be another one tomorrow [Monday]. It's not looking good, that's for sure. He's not someone who likes to exaggerate things so we know it is serious. He was concerned straight away and we are concerned.

"We hope that it's going to be better news for William [Saliba]. We have to wait until tomorrow to have a better picture. We've lost players already this season. We've lost Gabby [Gabriel Jesus] for four months, Thomas Partey for one-and-a-half months, Oleksandr Zinchecnko for one-and-a-half months, we've lost Mohamed Elneny for six to eight months.

https://www.skysports.com/football/...-give-a-little-bit-more-to-withstand-man-city

 

[Amjid Javed]

In that case we're thinking along the same lines. 21 points without losing to City is enough for us to win the league.

If we lose to City however then I agree we need to win 8 of the other 9 games remaining.

Liverpool will play a pivotal part in the Title race, they have been abysmal away from home but do tens to raise the game vs City. So If CIty drop points vs Liverpool it gives Arsenal a bit more of a buffer if we didn't get anything at Anfield.

However if City beat Liverpool, I think we are going to then have to take at least a point at anfield and avoid losing to City.

Next game is Leeds and we can't afford sloppiness defending, it was there in palace game as well as others and Leeds are better going forward then palace.

Once we've been to Anfield, there will 8 games left and we need to still have a 5 point lead I after that game.

 

[Rana]

Liverpool will play a pivotal part in the Title race, they have been abysmal away from home but do tens to raise the game vs City. So If CIty drop points vs Liverpool it gives Arsenal a bit more of a buffer if we didn't get anything at Anfield.

However if City beat Liverpool, I think we are going to then have to take at least a point at anfield and avoid losing to City.

Next game is Leeds and we can't afford sloppiness defending, it was there in palace game as well as others and Leeds are better going forward then palace.

Once we've been to Anfield, there will 8 games left and we need to still have a 5 point lead I after that game.

I think Arsenal have no choice but to beat one of Liverpool and City away

Which is fair. Would rather be PL champions beating these two immense sides at their home ground instead of just hanging on to points accumulated against lesser teams

 

[Amjid Javed]

I think Arsenal have no choice but to beat one of Liverpool and City away

Which is fair. Would rather be PL champions beating these two immense sides at their home ground instead of just hanging on to points accumulated against lesser teams

The Liverpool game is a huge worry as we have pretty much been battered in every game an Anfield since we last won their in 2012, the games haven't even been competitive most of the time.

We need Saliba back for that game, Also their is the issue at LB that Zinchenko can't defend and Salah will destroy us if he's left with loads of space in behind. Arteta nullified salah at Emirates by picking Tomiyasu, but now he's injured.

Liverpool have won 9, drawn 3, lost 1 at Anfield in PL, scoring 34 and conceding only 9. So to get even a draw will be tough with out Abysmal record there. City, United nor Chelsea even scored a goal away to Liverpool this season.

Would be one of best wins ever if we win at Anfield or eithad this season.

 

[WengerOut]

Both city and Arsenal have Brighton away and home respectively. More than tricky.

 

[Kroll]

I think Arsenal have no choice but to beat one of Liverpool and City away

Which is fair. Would rather be PL champions beating these two immense sides at their home ground instead of just hanging on to points accumulated against lesser teams

Liverpool are there for the taking, but with Haaland scoring goals like he's in the school playground, that's a different story.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Liverpool are there for the taking, but with Haaland scoring goals like he's in the school playground, that's a different story.

As bad as Liverpool have been this season, they have still been very good at Anfield in the league.

 

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Just Oleksandr Zinchenko LOVING Arsenal's win over Crystal Palace &#55357;&#56834; <a href="https://t.co/iy70zrwjZf">pic.twitter.com/iy70zrwjZf</a></p>— Sky Sports Premier League (@SkySportsPL) <a href="https://twitter.com/SkySportsPL/status/1637728567789342720?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 20, 2023</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[MenInG]

How many points will win us the league?

I hear the number 90 bandied about

 

[Amjid Javed]

How many points will win us the league?

I hear the number 90 bandied about

I have said 90 all along for title winners.

Arsenal 69 - maximum possible = 99 points
Man city 61 - maximum possible = 94 points

If Arsenal got 90 points, it means City would need to take 29 from a possible 33 to get same number.

Both me and [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] agree that if we avoid defeat vs City, then another 21 points should be enough

 

[Firebat]

PL top scorers:

1. Haaland (22) - 28
2. Kane (29) - 21
3. Toney (27) - 16
4. Rashford (25) - 14
5. Martinelli (21) - 13
6. Saka (21) - 12

....

11. Odegaard (24) - 10

 

[Firebat]

Arsenal are ready to offer Norway playmaker Martin Odegaard, 24, a new deal to keep him at the club until 2030. (Football Transfers)

 

[Amjid Javed]

PL top scorers:

1. Haaland (22) - 28
2. Kane (29) - 21
3. Toney (27) - 16
4. Rashford (25) - 14
5. Martinelli (21) - 13
6. Saka (21) - 12

....

11. Odegaard (24) - 10

"Poor mans rashford" one goal behind Rashford

 

[Rana]

How many points will win us the league?

I hear the number 90 bandied about

74 should secure CL first

 

[Firebat]

"Poor mans rashford" one goal behind Rashford &#55358;&#56611;&#55358;&#56611;

21 year old Martinelli 1 goal behind prime form-of-his-life Rashford

 

[IMMY69]

Also, and although shockingly we've only had two penalties all season, Martineli is not our penalty taker...

 

[The_KING]

"Poor mans rashford" one goal behind Rashford

21 year old Martinelli 1 goal behind prime form-of-his-life Rashford

Rashford has 27 goals in all competitions this season. Martinelli has just 13.

But I completely forgot that Arsenal are “Bigger Fish To Fry” FC. Only the league matters.

 

[Firebat]

Rashford has 27 goals in all competitions this season. Martinelli has just 13.

But I completely forgot that Arsenal are “Bigger Fish To Fry” FC. Only the league matters.

The point is not that Martinelli is as consistent as Rashford, it's to show how impressive it is that, in his first full season as a starter, Martinelli is 1 league goal behind one of the world's prime in-form wingers Rashford, who's in his 7th season as a starter. It's to counter a certain Arsenal poster who is constantly disparaging Martinelli.

And I completely remember why a United fan is keen to downplay the league, considering Arsenal finished above United 6 times out of 9 since Ferguson left (soon to be 7/10). And in that time, "Bigger Fish To Fry" FC have still won the same number of trophies as United. Except we did it against title-winning Chelsea and title-winning City, not Villa Burnley Charlton Forest and Newcastle

 

[Amjid Javed]

Rashford has 27 goals in all competitions this season. Martinelli has just 13.

But I completely forgot that Arsenal are “Bigger Fish To Fry” FC. Only the league matters.

My comments were aimed at a certain person who said Martinelli is a

"poor man's rashford"

"Martinelli is weakest link in starting 11"

"Bottle job"

"He's not developed as much as saka"

So I tounge in cheek made the rashford comparison on PL goals.

I'm sure a copy paste response its on its way

 

[Kianig89]

It's been an age when Arsenal last won ePL title,there was no social media no high speed Internet no Fortunner and PTI was a tanga party.
Gunners XI from that invincible champions

------------Lehmann
Lauren Toure Campbell Cole
Vieira Gilberto
Reyes Ljungberg Pires
Henry

Subs Bergkamp Edu Cygan Keown Alliadere

 

[topspin]

Rashford has 27 goals in all competitions this season. Martinelli has just 13.

But I completely forgot that Arsenal are “Bigger Fish To Fry” FC. Only the league matters.

If you followed the posts, you’d realise the comment was made in response to the harsh criticism aimed at Martinelli when he was referred to as a “poor man’s Rashford”.

Rashford is better but Martinelli isn’t far behind. One could argue the latter is a higher ceiling when you consider their age difference.

 

[Rana]

Saka’s value has risen to. £110m apparently

Great development

 

[MenInG]

Arsenal will be without defender Takehiro Tomiyasu for the rest of the season after he underwent knee surgery

 

[Amjid Javed]

Saka’s value has risen to. £110m apparently

Great development

Ability wise I think saka if he fulfils his potential he could be as good as Gareth Bale was a player. I'm not talking about Trophies wise, just on possible performances as a footballer in the future.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Arsenal will be without defender Takehiro Tomiyasu for the rest of the season after he underwent knee surgery

Needs to be sold in summer, the guy has been here 2 season slightest of physicality and the guy gets injured.

 

[Rana]

Ability wise I think saka if he fulfils his potential he could be as good as Gareth Bale was a player. I'm not talking about Trophies wise, just on possible performances as a footballer in the future.

Tbh they are too different players

Saka is technically very good and reads the attack really well.

Peak Bale was one of the most direct wingers I have seen in the game. Phenomenal athlete. Scary player

Martinelli is the big deal IMO, if he peaks like Bale then he would become that £150m+ player

 

[The_KING]

If you followed the posts, you’d realise the comment was made in response to the harsh criticism aimed at Martinelli when he was referred to as a “poor man’s Rashford”.

Rashford is better but Martinelli isn’t far behind. One could argue the latter is a higher ceiling when you consider their age difference.

Personally speaking, I don't think neither Rashford nor Martinelli are world class. Both are very good, but I think both of them are a tier or two below world class.

 

[The_KING]

The point is not that Martinelli is as consistent as Rashford, it's to show how impressive it is that, in his first full season as a starter, Martinelli is 1 league goal behind one of the world's prime in-form wingers Rashford, who's in his 7th season as a starter. It's to counter a certain Arsenal poster who is constantly disparaging Martinelli.

And I completely remember why a United fan is keen to downplay the league, considering Arsenal finished above United 6 times out of 9 since Ferguson left (soon to be 7/10). And in that time, "Bigger Fish To Fry" FC have still won the same number of trophies as United. Except we did it against title-winning Chelsea and title-winning City, not Villa Burnley Charlton Forest and Newcastle

I don't even rate Rashford that highly. He is having a great second half of the season, but it remains to be seen if he can consistently do it season after season, or if this is just a purple patch. Martinelli is a very good player, but I don't think he is world class, just like I don't think Rashford is world class.

Bro, it doesn't matter if you finish 2nd or 4th. All that matters is winning the league, in my eyes.

And besides, if we finish 3rd this season, and we win either the FA cup or Europa League, to add to the league cup that we already have won, then we would have had a better season than Arsenal, should the Gunners finish second and not win the league.

History books don't remember who you beat to win your trophies. History books only remembers the winners. And it isn't our fault that Arsenal, Liverpool, Man City, Tottenham and Chelsea (so called big teams) all lost early in the League Cup. We beat teams that beat them.

Man United have massively underperformed in the last decade. Every United fan accepts that. But in spite of that, we won the Europa League in the last decade, a trophy that Arsenal have never won.

 

[James]

City are bashing most teams at home but will drop some more away points. Arsenal even if they lose at Anfield (they won’t) just have to avoid defeat in the game up at City and the title is as good as sewn up. Arsenal deserve to win the league this season, they’ve answered every question at each difficult juncture and been absolutely brilliant.