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Day 4 of 2nd Test abandoned after Pakistan make an early breakthrough, leaving England on 7/1

I think people need to appreciate more how well Babar and Rizwan batted. These are horrendous conditions to bat in.
 
Gullycricket said:
Still better than many of our so called proper batsman. He is giving his all
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Ab Fan said:
Okay then. But loved his game awareness in this match. He has all the qualities of a world class keeper batsmen, ala, BJ Watling level.

1)Game awareness
2)Astute
3)Excellent behind gloves

He is 29 now so given that Pakistan don't have any option apart from Babar for captaincy, it shouldn't be a bad call IMO. Pak need to move on from Azhar.

What's your take, [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]?
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I don’t like WK as captain, too clumsy & rowdy job, where you are busy for every ball. A sharp WK is always the first go to guy for Captain, but that hot seat is often too much for WK. Babar is the obvious choice, as long as Captaincy doesn’t get better of his batting.

Personally, I like a bowler or all-rounder or at least a batting all-rounder like Mushtaq/Asif for PAK Captaincy, which should keep batsmen free; but there is no one as such now; Shaheen may be in future but now it has to be Babar or Shan.
 
Even with limited time, Pakistan would have been a strong position if they had picked Amir and Shadab instead of Fawad and Yasir.

Imagine Amir in these conditions!
 
Shows how well Pakistan did in these conditions, that are alien to many of them, against Broad and Anderson to get to 236
 
Imagine Amir bowling a yard short swinging the ball, missing the edge and being unlucky.....
 
Shaheen sending Burns back for a duck:

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if ever there was pitch and weather for fourth pacer, this was it, soahail or even Fahim for fawad was need of the hour, this single decision alone will and can cost us any chance we have of winning. Man how can you screw that misbah. [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] i think playing with jis is a three pacers is criminal here and yasir will be completely useless atleast in first three innings.
 
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All inswing from Shaheen, need to set them up for one that goes away or holds the line
 
We manged an hour but now the players are off again.
 
This is unbelievable.

Would they have suspend play had England been batting comfortably? This is just plain B S. I have no words.
 
Gullycricket said:
Still better than many of our so called proper batsman. He is giving his all
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Zeshan547 said:
if ever there was pitch and weather for fourth pacer, this was it, soahail or even Fahim for fawad was need of the hour, this single decision alone will and can cost us any chance we have of winning. Man how can you screw that misbah. [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] i think playing with jis is a three pacers is criminal here and yasir will be completely useless atleast in first three innings.
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I definitely would have played Sohail here; twice after the weather forecast. I think, Misbah himself is under tremendous pressure- didn’t have the guts to drop Yasir, who’ll struggle to grip the ball here. Fawad probably was picked to fail, otherwise they would have played him at home series last winter.
 
A one innings shoot out would be real fun to watch.
Pakistan have a very decent score for these conditions
 
Titan24 said:
What did I miss?
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I’ll give you one example...

He says Shaheen could be bowling even fuller.
He then does ball a lot fuller and Holding says something like “that’s it just play late and straight”...

Earlier they show montage of English bowlers and how ball is moving and holding says ideal conditions... but even Knight says English bowlers were bowling wider...

Lots of little things like that
 
JibranAnsari said:
inexperience is shown in shaheens bowling , too eager. Needs to stick to a length.
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Its his 10th match, will need an year or so (7-10 more tests) to become more mature in test cricket. Its the most difficult format to master and he has all the potential to succeed in it.
 
God not this bad light nonsense again. For crying out loud ICC change the ball color to pink. The play should never stop for bad light, during the day on a ground with floodlights.
 
Junaids said:
Even with limited time, Pakistan would have been a strong position if they had picked Amir and Shadab instead of Fawad and Yasir.

Imagine Amir in these conditions!
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You mean if amir had not RETIRED. You cannot pick a retired player who doesn't want to play
 
fasihulhaq94 said:
True. No mention of unplayable conditions when the pak tail was batting
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Exactly...
We had two days of it and if anything in even more humid conditions...

I have always liked Holdjng’s commentary but maybe he’s having horse racing withdrawal symptoms
 
MMHS said:
I definitely would have played Sohail here; twice after the weather forecast. I think, Misbah himself is under tremendous pressure- didn’t have the guts to drop Yasir, who’ll struggle to grip the ball here. Fawad probably was picked to fail, otherwise they would have played him at home series last winter.
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You cant drop Yasir after his performance last match. I beloeve both teams thought conditions may improve in the match , so a spinner would have a role,but of course now we know that is not the case.
 
IMMY69 said:
I’ll give you one example...

He says Shaheen could be bowling even fuller.
He then does ball a lot fuller and Holding says something like “that’s it just play late and straight”...

Earlier they show montage of English bowlers and how ball is moving and holding says ideal conditions... but even Knight says English bowlers were bowling wider...

Lots of little things like that
Click to expand...

Yes I also heard the first part regarding Shaheen should be bowling a little fuller, I dont think he was wrong though. When he did bowl bit fuller Sibley played it decently and then I think he shifted his commentary from bowler’s perspective to batsman’s.
 
It’s a four day Test now with one completely washed out day - what’s the follow on margin? I believe for a game reduced by day(s) at toss has following margins

5 or more: 200
4 days: 175
3 days: 150
2 days: 125
1day: 100.

That one day one sounds funny, but in 19th century, they played FC cricket for 8 hours playing fine and sometimes over 170 overs were bowled in a day - games washed out for first two days had follow on margin of 100..... and Cambridge did win one such FC game in a day over Oxford!!!!!!
 
Titan24 said:
Yes I also heard the first part regarding Shaheen should be bowling a little fuller, I dont think he was wrong though. When he did bowl bit fuller Sibley played it decently and then I think he shifted his commentary from bowler’s perspective to batsman’s.
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I think I’m just sick of listening to him...
 
PakPremi said:
You cant drop Yasir after his performance last match. I beloeve both teams thought conditions may improve in the match , so a spinner would have a role,but of course now we know that is not the case.
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True, I won’t have dropped Yasir; but I would have played five bowlers here - Sohail for Shadab. One extra batsman isn’t much of a benefit here, but Sohail could have been unplayable with his away swingers.
 
That was not fair on England batsman. Good they came off. Abbas was about to torture them.
5 plays and misses in first 7 balls ( when Abbas was just getting into his work)

37 ao was on
 
IMMY69 said:
Absolutely disgusted with Holding’s biased commentary
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He was disappointing — “these conditions are not ideal for batting”
The conditions DO NOT need to be ideal — just playable with no risk of physical injury.
Increasingly I feel it’s time for him to be pensioned of, a la Gower and Botham
 
Abdullah said:
That was not fair on England batsman. Good they came off. Abbas was about to torture them.
5 plays and misses in first 7 balls ( when Abbas was just getting into his work)

37 ao was on
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Yup, that's it. The umpires couldn't bare seeing English batsmen having a tough time. The bias during this series has been unbelievable.
 
Shaheen: My bowling on point here, folks!

Rain: Allow me to re-introduce myself..
 
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Just spoke to some friends who live In Southampton— absolutely chucking it down.
That’s it for the day.....
 
Atherton, Ward and Akram talking about how England owe an overseas tour to Pakistan, and how big a boost that Test cricket would get should a Pakistan-India series take place.
 
Firebat said:
Atherton, Ward and Akram talking about how England owe an overseas tour to Pakistan, and how big a boost that Test cricket would get should a Pakistan-India series take place.
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They have been going on saying that but nothing happening before 2022.
 
Firebat said:
Atherton, Ward and Akram talking about how England owe an overseas tour to Pakistan, and how big a boost that Test cricket would get should a Pakistan-India series take place.
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No one owes Pakistan cricket anything. They are talking nonsense as usual.
 
Indiafan said:
You mean if amir had not RETIRED. You cannot pick a retired player who doesn't want to play
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Amir is not in Siberia or Timbuktu.

He’s sitting in the pavilion. He’s practising in the nets with the team every day.

I’m sure if he was asked nicely he’d help out his country.
 
just checked the weather forecast in Southampton on Met office website Looks Clear from 3pm onwards
 
MMHS said:
I definitely would have played Sohail here; twice after the weather forecast. I think, Misbah himself is under tremendous pressure- didn’t have the guts to drop Yasir, who’ll struggle to grip the ball here. Fawad probably was picked to fail, otherwise they would have played him at home series last winter.
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Misbah and Waqar are at the ground. It’s seaming and swinging as much on Day 4 as Day 1.

I think out of this 29 man squad I’d have fielded here - not Old Trafford - the following:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Abid Ali
3. Shan Masood (c)
4. Babar Azam
5. Asad Shafiq
6. Mohammad Rizwan
7. Shadab Khan
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Sohail Khan
10. Mohammad Abbas
11. Shaheen Shah Afridi

I think that’s the team most likely to win this Test on this pitch in these conditions.
 
Junaids said:
Amir is not in Siberia or Timbuktu.

He’s sitting in the pavilion. He’s practising in the nets with the team every day.

I’m sure if he was asked nicely he’d help out his country.
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If Mohammed Amir was dropped from the Test team, you could do that. He retired. He does not want to play Test cricket for Pakistan. He is entirely uncommitted to it. Are we really going to start begging players to play who have no desire to do so? Unless he comes out of his retirement, he is over in Tests. Time to move on.
 
Firebat said:
If Mohammed Amir was dropped from the Test team, you could do that. He retired. He does not want to play Test cricket for Pakistan. He is entirely uncommitted to it. Are we really going to start begging players to play who have no desire to do so? Unless he comes out of his retirement, he is over in Tests. Time to move on.
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How many times did Imran Khan make himself unavailable or retire?

And he was never as good as Amir in these conditions.
 
I just checked the weather there is no rain after 3 means Atleast 4 hours of play may be 3.30 hours and tomorrow there won't be any rain interruptions if some how pakistan all out england today and come to bat tomorrow and go all blazing and give the target of Atleast 200 or 180 to England and with Atleast 50 overs with such conditions may be there is a chance then if not win Atleast the match will be mouth watering and it will give some belief that with such interruptions still there is a chance to win and with this no captain will take these interruptions lightly
 
raashidkhan89079 said:
I just checked the weather there is no rain after 3 means Atleast 4 hours of play may be 3.30 hours and tomorrow there won't be any rain interruptions if some how pakistan all out england today and come to bat tomorrow and go all blazing and give the target of Atleast 200 or 180 to England and with Atleast 50 overs with such conditions may be there is a chance then if not win Atleast the match will be mouth watering and it will give some belief that with such interruptions still there is a chance to win and with this no captain will take these interruptions lightly
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You're overthinking.
This is a draw.
 
raashidkhan89079 said:
I just checked the weather there is no rain after 3 means Atleast 4 hours of play may be 3.30 hours and tomorrow there won't be any rain interruptions if some how pakistan all out england today and come to bat tomorrow and go all blazing and give the target of Atleast 200 or 180 to England and with Atleast 50 overs with such conditions may be there is a chance then if not win Atleast the match will be mouth watering and it will give some belief that with such interruptions still there is a chance to win and with this no captain will take these interruptions lightly
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There is no way England will be all out easily with such a lengthy batting line up including the all rounders and broad. Their seniors are notas hopeless as ours.
 
All i can say with the weather playing spoiler that i am gutted to have lost the first match as out of 7 days so far we have been the better team just few bad sessions
 
Mamoon said:
No one owes Pakistan cricket anything. They are talking nonsense as usual.
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Actually this is incorrect. The ECB was facing financial ruin. The Hundred had been cancelled, several counties were about to declare bankruptcy. TV rights for international cricket pay for the entire ECB infrastructure (from school development to counties). Sky made it clear — no international cricket, no money.
The ECB made a significant request to WI and Pakistan to tour.
This, for any rationale mind, does create an expectation of reciprocity.
 
Omer2002 said:
All i can say with the weather playing spoiler that i am gutted to have lost the first match as out of 7 days so far we have been the better team just few bad sessions
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Pakistan has actually done better than I expected despite few passangers and defensive captain.
 
gibsyhesperis said:
Actually this is incorrect. The ECB was facing financial ruin. The Hundred had been cancelled, several counties were about to declare bankruptcy. TV rights for international cricket pay for the entire ECB infrastructure (from school development to counties). Sky made it clear — no international cricket, no money.
The ECB made a significant request to WI and Pakistan to tour.
This, for any rationale mind, does create an expectation of reciprocity.
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But common man you too know this england will not tour to Pakistan
And we have so soft people that they will not even say a second word to England about why they won't come there answers to media will be same as wasim khan
We toured England just for the sake of resuming cricket not for any leverage and all will be normal till the next tour date
 
So looks like this Test will be a washout, which leaves the possible series results reading as follows:

2-0 to England
1-0 to England
1-1 tie
 
Odd how this murk is sitting over Southampton for days. I am 150 miles away and have had sun and at worst high cloud.
 
gibsyhesperis said:
Actually this is incorrect. The ECB was facing financial ruin. The Hundred had been cancelled, several counties were about to declare bankruptcy. TV rights for international cricket pay for the entire ECB infrastructure (from school development to counties). Sky made it clear — no international cricket, no money.
The ECB made a significant request to WI and Pakistan to tour.
This, for any rationale mind, does create an expectation of reciprocity.
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Interesting. This will read as harsh but it might be no bad thing for English cricket. If some of the clubs were to merge there would be more competition for places.
 
Lol everyone getting hyped at Shaheen taking a wicket in the easiest possible conditions.
 
gibsyhesperis said:
Actually this is incorrect. The ECB was facing financial ruin. The Hundred had been cancelled, several counties were about to declare bankruptcy. TV rights for international cricket pay for the entire ECB infrastructure (from school development to counties). Sky made it clear — no international cricket, no money.
The ECB made a significant request to WI and Pakistan to tour.
This, for any rationale mind, does create an expectation of reciprocity.
Click to expand...

That is not correct.

Pakistan and West Indies were scheduled to tour long before COVID. Their tours simply coincided with the pandemic.

Let’s not give the impression that we volunteered to tour during the pandemic. All we and West Indies did was honor a predetermined commitment.

And both Pakistan and West Indies are not in a position to say no to a big 3 tour because we already get to play very little cricket again the big 3.

India is not interested in playing us, Australia have downgraded us from 3 Tests to 2 Tests, and that leaves ECB as the only big 3 board who is keen to play regularly with us.

In the last 4 years, we have played 9 Tests in England. Are we really in a position to say no to England and **** off the only big board that gives a toss about us these days?

It would have been a favor and ECB would have owed us something if Pakistan were not scheduled to tour this summer and would have volunteered to do so because the scheduled team would have refused to play.

So this whole narrative of PCB doing a favor and now ECB is bound to reciprocate is just nonsense.
 
Mamoon said:
That is not correct.

Pakistan and West Indies were scheduled to tour long before COVID. Their tours simply coincided with the pandemic.

Let’s not give the impression that we volunteered to tour during the pandemic. All we and West Indies did was honor a predetermined commitment.

And both Pakistan and West Indies are not in a position to say no to a big 3 tour because we already get to play very little cricket again the big 3.

India is not interested in playing us, Australia have downgraded us from 3 Tests to 2 Tests, and that leaves ECB as the only big 3 board who is keen to play regularly with us.

In the last 4 years, we have played 9 Tests in England. Are we really in a position to say no to England and **** off the only big board that gives a toss about us these days?

It would have been a favor and ECB would have owed us something if Pakistan were not scheduled to tour this summer and would have volunteered to do so because the scheduled team would have refused to play.

So this whole narrative of PCB doing a favor and now ECB is bound to reciprocate is just nonsense.
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This is simply not true.
I am a member at Middlesex CCC. Despite being one of the larger and richer counties it would have been a real challenge this year (we rely on ECB handouts, like all counties). There are significant restrictions on how Lords can be used (and is actually owned by the MCC not Middlesex).
Neither WI or Pak were obliged to tour, they knew they would not get much out of it and I know for a fact that high level representation was made to both boards by the ECB to get them to tour.
You may have your own bias on the issue but it is not borne out by reality.
Of course, an expectation does not always lead to a result and I do not think that England will tour in 2022.
So on that we do agree.
 
So, England's undefeated streak lives on (most likely).

They haven't lost a home Test series since 2014.
 
raashidkhan89079 said:
But common man you too know this england will not tour to Pakistan
And we have so soft people that they will not even say a second word to England about why they won't come there answers to media will be same as wasim khan
We toured England just for the sake of resuming cricket not for any leverage and all will be normal till the next tour date
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Yes, you are right and I agree with you.
There is an obligation now on England to tour, but they won’t. And we will not do or say anything as a consequence
 
Play has been abandoned for the day. It will take 2.5 - 3 hours to get the field fit to play and the outfield longer as it is extremely wet.
 
MenInG said:
Play has been abandoned for the day. It will take 2.5 - 3 hours to get the field fit to play and the outfield longer as it is extremely wet.
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What a shame! If only they had full covers Aka Eden Gardens then we would have 3.30 hours session
don't think Full ground covers cost much
 
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