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India vs England | India win 5th Test against England by an innings and 75 runs in Chennai

Ashwin needs control from the other end (or scoreboard pressure) to succeed.

With England batting first on a flat pitch and Umesh and Mishra leaking runs, that wasn't the case here. Shami and Jayant were hard to score off for England.

At this moment, Jadeja would still be my first choice spinner in SA/Aus/NZ for me.

Don't know man. Ash (even before he had upped his game) looked better than Jaddu in England. Jaddu did play in NZ and was just tight but did nothing else. Jaddu is an excellent 2nd spinner (anywhere in the world) but never a good number 1 spinner.

Ash would be my number 1 choice for overseas tours unless Kuldeep exhibits some insane talent.

We really need to fast track Kuldeep.

Mishra is pure trash.
 
Amit Mishra has everything as a legspinner , i don't know why he doesn't get more wickets. Love to watch him bowl.

Amir mishra is a more complete leggie than yasir. Yasir has better brains.

Absolutely not true.

You are looking at it from a turn, flight point of view only.

Mishra's speed is too slow.
He doesn't have the fizz in his bowling (call it zip or whatever).
He is either too short or too full (coupled with his slow speed makes it super easy for batsmen to rock back or go in front to play him off).
He doesn't get the dip too. Atleast I haven't seen him foxing batsmen with that many a times.

Yasir while not a leggie in the Warne, Macgill, Gupte mould....has several things going for him.

Accuracy, speed, fizz, drift...maybe gets some dip but he has to flight more which he doesn't.
 
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They are showing the surf point of Chennai,I'm somewhat near that location and has some awesome festivals and surfing is amazing there,although thing with Jhonty looks fake as I know he has been there already before as well.
 
What does inside out field mean?

Also what does 6-3 field offside....6-3 field legside mean?

Does that mean the 3 fielders are on offside/legside?

6-3 leg side

6 fielders on leg side

And vice Versa

I removed MoYo had 9-1 offside in the 2009 Sydney test vs Aus :))
 
Seems there is very low interest in this match
 
Rahul should make the most of this opportunity and score big here (good for team cause as well!)
 
Don't know man. Ash (even before he had upped his game) looked better than Jaddu in England. Jaddu did play in NZ and was just tight but did nothing else. Jaddu is an excellent 2nd spinner (anywhere in the world) but never a good number 1 spinner.

Ash would be my number 1 choice for overseas tours unless Kuldeep exhibits some insane talent.

We really need to fast track Kuldeep.

Mishra is pure trash.

I would be tempted to play Jadeja as the lone spinner and use him to keep things tight. Ashwin needs to develop his batting further or figure out a way to get wickets on non-turning pitches if we want to play him in Aus/SA/NZ. England is a different matter which is why I often don't include them in the same group.

Mishra is a complete waste of a spot.
 
Good little session of play here for England - 19 balls without a run now and India's batting depth isn't that deep with no Jayant or Bhuvi.
 
Absolutely not true.

You are looking at it from a turn, flight point of view only.

Mishra's speed is too slow.
He doesn't have the fizz in his bowling (call it zip or whatever).
He is either too short or too full (coupled with his slow speed makes it super easy for batsmen to rock back or go in front to play him off).
He doesn't get the dip too. Atleast I haven't seen him foxing batsmen with that many a times.

Yasir while not a leggie in the Warne, Macgill, Gupte mould....has several things going for him.

Accuracy, speed, fizz, drift...maybe gets some dip but he has to flight more which he doesn't.

There was a discussion yesterday as well on how while delivering the "ball" his body position and movement is so slow that its easy for the batsmen to play him,which is somewhat different incase of Jadeja.
 
There was a discussion yesterday as well on how while delivering the "ball" his body position and movement is so slow that its easy for the batsmen to play him,which is somewhat different incase of Jadeja.

Jadeja was unplayable in one of his spells in the last test match's 3rd innings. That's why he is such a value! Glad that he developed his bowling to such an extent that he can be considered even for overseas test matches! He developed/matured his cricket at the right moment, he has loads of years left (Good that he made into international reckoning at younger age!)
 
Jaddu's bowling is just the same. He was always effective right from his first test in Nagpur.

Hasn't developed his bowling or anything. In fact, I was concerned it dipped last series against NZ but he has done very well in the current English series impact wise.
 
Make or break innings for Nair. Rahul has cemented his position with this innings and also because of the vacant opener slot (and his impressive start to LOIs and great IPL year)
 
215/3 should be a gun position.

But we don't have Jayant or Vijay.....debutant Nair is there now. Rahul is unpredictable.
 
Rahul is going to become a serious threat.

Plays too many risky shots. Needs to go back to how he was 2 years back before the IPL.

Had solid technique, and also played risk free cricket. He used to be a bit nervous, but that has been replaced by overconfidence/complacency now.
 
Plays too many risky shots. Needs to go back to how he was 2 years back before the IPL.

Had solid technique, and also played risk free cricket. He used to be a bit nervous, but that has been replaced by overconfidence/complacency now.

True...bizarre it is.

Why the hell would you risk your career due to overconfidence is beyond me?

Some of the shots he plays makes me want to execute him.
 
Plays too many risky shots. Needs to go back to how he was 2 years back before the IPL.

Had solid technique, and also played risk free cricket. He used to be a bit nervous, but that has been replaced by overconfidence/complacency now.

Exactly right! Probably he should speak to Rahul Dravid about temperament issues (in test matches).
 
Leave tea.

First we gotta save this match.

Need to match English total.

Yeah. But we need to bat till Lunch tomorrow, at least for a draw.

If we batted till tea tomorrow. We could have been in a position to win the game. But with Kohli and Pujara not scoring this innings, we will do well survive till close of play today.
 
If there is a collapse now, England can almost register a win here if they can seal the opportunity.
 
Exactly right! Probably he should speak to Rahul Dravid about temperament issues (in test matches).

The fix is simple.

Someone needs to tell him to shut the hell up and play like a proper bat or face consequences.

Talking to Dravid would be useless cos his issues ain't technical or even mental (as in lack of confidence issue).

His issue is that he wants to dominate everyone in every pitch EVEN if it means he will play away from his body and use super risky shots.

The crazy part is that this is not how he came up the ranks. Its one thing to want to dominate and another to play shots that would get him out any ball.
 
Make or break innings for Nair. Rahul has cemented his position with this innings and also because of the vacant opener slot (and his impressive start to LOIs and great IPL year)

Hows Nair playing so far?

I've switched to the Aus Pak game now so not following Nair's batting.
 
England's match to win with Ishant and Mishra coming in. Rahul, Nair and Parthiv are also weak links / injury selections. As easy as it gets for a touring side with the toss win as well.

"weak links" Rahul, Nair and Parthiv at 119*, 9* and 71. Every fan must wish their country had such "weak links"!
 
I would be tempted to play Jadeja as the lone spinner and use him to keep things tight. Ashwin needs to develop his batting further or figure out a way to get wickets on non-turning pitches if we want to play him in Aus/SA/NZ. England is a different matter which is why I often don't include them in the same group.

Mishra is a complete waste of a spot.

That was exactly how Dhoni planned his team for overseas matches in the past. He always wanted control and he was someone who would lose it if the bowlers kept going for runs, eventhough he wouldn't show it in outwardly emotions. Hence he always preferred line and length bowlers like Bhuvi, Mohit and even Vinay Kumar sometimes rather than a bit erratic but express pace bowlers like Yadav and Aaron. It was the same with the spinners, he played Jadeja as the first choice spinner in the overseas tours than Ashwin who could go for some runs. That Jadeja strengthened the batting more also made Dhoni to select him as the lone spinner. That sort of tactic might result in more draws and prevent defeats, but you'll never win games with that formation.

Our problem overseas has always been picking up 20 wickets. Batting has stood up most times (barring the 2md half of the England tour) but it is the bowling which has always impacted us. So we should never compromise on the bowling front and always give us our best chance of picking up wickets, even if they're a bit expensive. Picking up line and length trundlers and spinners who stop the run flow will do no good for our chances. We need 5 genuine bowlers in the team for that, our 5 best bowlers.


Our team combination overseas should be

Vijay
Rahul
Pujara
Kohli (c)
Rahane
Parthiv/Saha (wk)
Ashwin
Pandya
Bhuvi/Ishant
Shami
Yadav

This is the only way we can win matches overseas. Pandya is the most important player here because he lends that balance overseas, a bit like Jayant Yadav in India.
 
If we can bowl them out before lunch tomorrow, should be a lead of 70 and a half-decent chance of winning the game.

But frankly a draw is looking the most likely result on what has sadly been, as far as this series goes, the flattest pitch of the lot.
 
Little too harsh on Rahul at this point imo . Let's not forget this is his 4th come back already and every time he's had this pressure to prove himself which makes batsmen play differently . He jus needs to play 10 innings on a trot for India , everything about his game will settle down .

Also some of his shots for e.g. The reverse sweep are pretty safe shots at least the way he plays and so are some of the big shots he plays for spinners , I have seen him play like this in domestic much before his IPL success .
 
Ok thanks. What is inside out field? This is inside out?

Ring around the batsman with a scoring area open. Depending on which side you're trying to force the batsman one or two men patrol the 30 to stop the singles, the rest surround the boundary.

It's done to ask the batsman to play risky shots but avoiding the risk of boundaries.
 
Ring around the batsman with a scoring area open. Depending on which side you're trying to force the batsman one or two men patrol the 30 to stop the singles, the rest surround the boundary.

It's done to ask the batsman to play risky shots but avoiding the risk of boundaries.

Also as a wicket taking option with the short ball
 
Little too harsh on Rahul at this point imo . Let's not forget this is his 4th come back already and every time he's had this pressure to prove himself which makes batsmen play differently . He jus needs to play 10 innings on a trot for India , everything about his game will settle down .

Also some of his shots for e.g. The reverse sweep are pretty safe shots at least the way he plays and so are some of the big shots he plays for spinners , I have seen him play like this in domestic much before his IPL success .

Rahul is an incredible talent.

I think his domination or aggression is fine...even encouraged.

But seen him play way too many risky shots right from NZ series...to both spinners and pacers....shots that weren't well struck. Taking balls on the up without accounting for swing and just going through with it. Needs to settle down.

Will be a huge boost to Indian batting when he does.
 
Ring around the batsman with a scoring area open. Depending on which side you're trying to force the batsman one or two men patrol the 30 to stop the singles, the rest surround the boundary.

It's done to ask the batsman to play risky shots but avoiding the risk of boundaries.

Makes sense. Thanks.

That was exactly how Dhoni planned his team for overseas matches in the past. He always wanted control and he was someone who would lose it if the bowlers kept going for runs, eventhough he wouldn't show it in outwardly emotions. Hence he always preferred line and length bowlers like Bhuvi, Mohit and even Vinay Kumar sometimes rather than a bit erratic but express pace bowlers like Yadav and Aaron. It was the same with the spinners, he played Jadeja as the first choice spinner in the overseas tours than Ashwin who could go for some runs. That Jadeja strengthened the batting more also made Dhoni to select him as the lone spinner. That sort of tactic might result in more draws and prevent defeats, but you'll never win games with that formation.

Our problem overseas has always been picking up 20 wickets. Batting has stood up most times (barring the 2md half of the England tour) but it is the bowling which has always impacted us. So we should never compromise on the bowling front and always give us our best chance of picking up wickets, even if they're a bit expensive. Picking up line and length trundlers and spinners who stop the run flow will do no good for our chances. We need 5 genuine bowlers in the team for that, our 5 best bowlers.

Excellent post.

I was about to use the Dhoni analogy and write something very eerily similar to this but didn't bother cos I felt too lazy to do it. :))

Also those tactics rarely ever result in draws. Just outright losses.

Kuldeep must be fast tracked and tested to see what kind of wicket taking option he can be.
 
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Rahul is an incredible talent.

I think his domination or aggression is fine...even encouraged.

But seen him play way too many risky shots right from NZ series...to both spinners and pacers....shots that weren't well struck. Taking balls on the up without accounting for swing and just going through with it. Needs to settle down.

Will be a huge boost to Indian batting when he does.

Yeah he was a little careless on few occasions , but not today imo . Hes hardly played a false shot in the whole innings . What am saying is , the big shots and reverse sweeps are part of his game . He's also a compulsive puller . I have seen him Change his game depending on the pitch , so the guy is capable of playing like Dravid if the pitch is difficult ..so I don't see a big issue if he takes a little risk on these pitches
 
Yeah he was a little careless on few occasions , but not today imo . Hes hardly played a false shot in the whole innings . What am saying is , the big shots and reverse sweeps are part of his game . He's also a compulsive puller . I have seen him Change his game depending on the pitch , so the guy is capable of playing like Dravid if the pitch is difficult ..so I don't see a big issue if he takes a little risk on these pitches

There is a difference in playing aggressive cricket and risky cricket. Rahul's game is good enough to play aggressively without taking too much risks.

The reverse sweep etc might fine for LOI game, and those are the shots that have helped him succeed in the limited overs format. But his long format game is good enough that he doesn't need these. He was successful in Ranji with his normal risk free cricket. He just need to stick to how he played before IPL.

I didnt see the game for about an hour before tea, but post tea he seems to be playing good risk free cricket.
 
A few loose shots from the Indians now.

Why play like this when you are still nearly 200 runs behind.
 
Heart warming to see Rahul, Nair and Parthiv doing well here.

I hope Jaddu and Mishy too contribute here.

100 runs partnership between youngsters.

311/3
 
Good to see a score reading 311/3 with no contribution from Kohli, Pujara and Vijay.
 
England's match to win with Ishant and Mishra coming in. Rahul, Nair and Parthiv are also weak links / injury selections. As easy as it gets for a touring side with the toss win as well.

England are comfortably in front, as expected.

They will win from here unless Kohli hits another double.

"weak links" Rahul, Nair and Parthiv at 119*, 9* and 71. Every fan must wish their country had such "weak links"!

"Weak links" are now at 181*, 60* and 71. India's weak links are currently averaging 300+ :)

Then again, can't blame you. Even some Indian posters on PP are sufficiently deluded into thinking that Indian Test batting lineup is weaker than Pakistan's.
 
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"Weak links" are now at 181*, 60* and 71. India's weak links are currently averaging 300+ :)

Then again, can't blame you. Even some Indian posters on PP are sufficiently deluded into thinking that Indian Test batting lineup is weaker than Pakistan's.

Clearly you don't understand the concept of reverse jinxing :). I am quite a big supporter of Rahul, him getting going will be great for Indian cricket.
 
Yeah he was a little careless on few occasions , but not today imo . Hes hardly played a false shot in the whole innings . What am saying is , the big shots and reverse sweeps are part of his game . He's also a compulsive puller . I have seen him Change his game depending on the pitch , so the guy is capable of playing like Dravid if the pitch is difficult ..so I don't see a big issue if he takes a little risk on these pitches

Yeah was speaking about his innings uptil now (starting from NZ tour). Haven't seen him today. Glad to hear he batted properly.
 
What's very heartening is that all of our main guys Kohli, Pujara and Vijay (didn't bat) scored nothing and yet we got to this position.

Before this test, Rahul looked good but would throw it away....Nair looked nervous....Parthiv looked good but would throw it away too (still did but he scored 70 odd)....

This is what makes a good lineup.

The quality of Indian lineup was never in doubt (except Pujara outside Asia and Rahane against spin) but it was application which was the big question mark.

Would like to see Rahul tighten up his game...Nair get amongst runs...will make India a super solid batting lineup with a torture trio down the batting order (Ash, Jaddu and Jayant).
 
Clearly you don't understand the concept of reverse jinxing :). I am quite a big supporter of Rahul, him getting going will be great for Indian cricket.

I am jinxing your reverse jinx to make it stronger :)
 
That was exactly how Dhoni planned his team for overseas matches in the past. He always wanted control and he was someone who would lose it if the bowlers kept going for runs, eventhough he wouldn't show it in outwardly emotions. Hence he always preferred line and length bowlers like Bhuvi, Mohit and even Vinay Kumar sometimes rather than a bit erratic but express pace bowlers like Yadav and Aaron. It was the same with the spinners, he played Jadeja as the first choice spinner in the overseas tours than Ashwin who could go for some runs. That Jadeja strengthened the batting more also made Dhoni to select him as the lone spinner. That sort of tactic might result in more draws and prevent defeats, but you'll never win games with that formation.

Our problem overseas has always been picking up 20 wickets. Batting has stood up most times (barring the 2md half of the England tour) but it is the bowling which has always impacted us. So we should never compromise on the bowling front and always give us our best chance of picking up wickets, even if they're a bit expensive. Picking up line and length trundlers and spinners who stop the run flow will do no good for our chances. We need 5 genuine bowlers in the team for that, our 5 best bowlers.


Our team combination overseas should be

Vijay
Rahul
Pujara
Kohli (c)
Rahane
Parthiv/Saha (wk)
Ashwin
Pandya
Bhuvi/Ishant
Shami
Yadav

This is the only way we can win matches overseas. Pandya is the most important player here because he lends that balance overseas, a bit like Jayant Yadav in India.

Agree that taking wickets is the most important concern away outside the subcontinent/WI.

All I am advocating is if Ashwin continues to struggle take wickets in the absence of spin, I would rather play Jadeja + our 3 pacers with the best strike rates. Jadeja keeps control on one end and the seamers can keep attacking.

If Pandya or someone else can develop into a pace all-rounder, then they would be the 5th bowler.
 
Very poor from Rahul,hope he learns from this,Decides the match may be,India were pushing for a win :facepalm:
 
Very poor from Rahul,hope he learns from this,Decides the match may be,India were pushing for a win :facepalm:

Yah. His wicket could be the difference between a win and a draw. Had he been there tomorrow, we would have been looking to play more positive with the aim of a 100 run lead.
 
We need Ashwin and Jadeja to show application and add another 200 runs from here and bat till tea.

Nair and Vijay ought to bat at least mid way till the first session tomorrow. Any less and we could be in trouble.

Once we get close to lunch, then we have the lower order that can put us in a strong position 100 run lead
 
Btw, that 199 out club is so star studded that KL might not regret about it a lot in future
 
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