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Pakistan trail by 2 runs in their second innings, finishing Day 2 of the First Test against South Africa at 88/3

The cricket enthusiast said:
Why only Pakistani bowlers regressed after injury ?
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because they are too lazy to work hard at rehab
they are also scared that if they rest too long for rehab that they will be dropped forever, so they continue to play with niggles. shows how toxic our culture is
 
Abid Z said:
It’s a ploy. Mind games that Pakistani bowlers have mastered now. The batsman thinks they will bowl off stump line because there are 4 slip fielders but they actually bowl short on leg stump to encourage a 6 where the field is vacant. Have to admire the genius
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If they are unable to control the line, then they should pack the legside and stem the flow of runs there. Not sure what the plot from Shan and the bowlers is here
 
Farabi said:
Both Rauf and Shaheen could have been highly effective here, as shown during the recent Australia ODI series in similar conditions.

Shaheen, even at 17 on his first tour, performed admirably. He’s also inform - he and dominated South Africa during that white-ball series for the most part. His new reverse-swing skills would have been invaluable, and his height and extra bounce would have made a significant impact in these conditions. My opinion.

Huge misses
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Performance in one format is not indicative of anything in another . Shaheen did well in Australia ODIs but he was awful in Australia Tests.
 
140-150 lead will make this game completely 1 sided ... Abbas has bowled nearly 50% of innings overs !
 
Pakistan are going to tour England in 2026. The wickets are now flat and the dukes don't swing. Shudder to think what the Bazballers will do with this lot.
 
Bavuma in the 30's,
shows how toothless our bowling has been today
 
DTrump said:
Pakistan are going to tour England in 2026. The wickets are now flat and the dukes don't swing. Shudder to think what the Bazballers will do with this lot.
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at least we beat them at home haha
 
Abid Z said:
So the least they should do is keep it top of off stump. Even at 125kph that’s challenging for batsmen but they are just spraying it around.
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They lack the ability to hit the right areas consistently. The one guy who does possess that ability hasn't even bowled today.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Performance in one format is not indicative of anything in another . Shaheen did well in Australia ODIs but he was awful in Australia Tests.
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That’s an extreme statement. Performance in tests is a good predictor of ODIs and vice versa, if done wisely.

Shaheen averaged 26 with 9 wickets in 2018. That was a much better SA batting team on better batting tracks.
Shaheen may have caused mayhem here
 
Farabi said:
Both Rauf and Shaheen could have been highly effective here, as shown during the recent Australia ODI series in similar conditions.

Shaheen, even at 17 on his first tour, performed admirably. He’s also inform - he and dominated South Africa during that white-ball series for the most part. His new reverse-swing skills would have been invaluable, and his height and extra bounce would have made a significant impact in these conditions. My opinion.

Huge misses
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Rauf just won't last a test match. He is 31 and has played a mere 9 FC matches. The last of which was 2 years ago. One full test will kill his white ball career.
 
Farabi said:
That’s an extreme statement. Performance in tests is a good predictor of ODIs and vice versa, if done wisely.

Shaheen averaged 26 with 9 wickets in 2018. That was a much better SA batting team on better batting tracks.
Shaheen may have caused mayhem here
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You have to go back all the way to 2018 to prove your point. It's almost like Shaheen's injury and subsequent decline didn't happen
 
DTrump said:
Rauf just won't last a test match. He is 31 and has played a mere 9 FC matches. The last of which was 2 years ago. One full test will kill his white ball career.
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That’s ridiculous extremes. Express press bowlers can be fast tracked.
The lengths Rauf bowled in Aus ODI tour were test match lengths. He can be a much better test bowler and he does better in helpful conditions. His worse days come on flat tracks where he loses it
 
Khurram has a lot of potential with the new ball. But he needs to work on his fitness. Seems like he is always getting injured.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Performance in one format is not indicative of anything in another . Shaheen did well in Australia ODIs but he was awful in Australia Tests.
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In general, Shaheen has lacked test match fitness in recent times. Maybe he would have snared a couple of key wickets but I question how successful he would have been spell-by-spell. Still should have been playing though. His replacements haven't exactly set a high bar.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
They lack the ability to hit the right areas consistently. The one guy who does possess that ability hasn't even bowled today.
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South Africa is a notoriously difficult place to bat but it's a little tough to bowl there as well for visiting teams. The South Africans quicks are tall and get so much more out of the surface.

The lengths you need to bowl there is vastly different from the rest of the world.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
In general, Shaheen has lacked test match fitness in recent times. Maybe he would have snared a couple of key wickets but I question how successful he would have been spell-by-spell. Still should have been playing though. His replacements haven't exactly set a high bar.
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We need to accept Shaheen was destroyed by being rushed for T20I tournament. He needs more time to get that verve back
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
In general, Shaheen has lacked test match fitness in recent times. Maybe he would have snared a couple of key wickets but I question how successful he would have been spell-by-spell. Still should have been playing though. His replacements haven't exactly set a high bar.
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Probably should have played ahead of Abbas. Don't see the logic in bringing him back.

But I don't Shaheen was able to take that 3 format workload . And a given a choice, fast bowlers will always quit Tests first.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
You have to go back all the way to 2018 to prove your point. It's almost like Shaheen's injury and subsequent decline didn't happen
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Did you even see the recent SA and Aus ODI series? If anything, this is the deadliest Shaheen I’ve seen. He’s now added the one that goes away, and he’s also added reverse swing. The pace is also back to where it used to be.
Some of the commentary I see here is delusional. Shaheen was never express. He has always been high 130s bowler and he never saw a decline in ODIs. He bowled 145+ for brief 6 month period in T20Is at max, but that now feels like an aberration.
In test cricket, he’s been used on the worse pitches in the world
 
Farabi said:
That’s ridiculous extremes. Express press bowlers can be fast tracked.
The lengths Rauf bowled in Aus ODI tour were test match lengths. He can be a much better test bowler and he does better in helpful conditions. His worse days come on flat tracks where he loses it
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No it is not. He has no test fitness.
He has barely bowled with the red ball in his life and is now 30+. Even the great fast bowlers start to wind down at this stage. A bloke with NINE FC matches will not set the international stage on fire. Come on.
 
DTrump said:
South Africa is a notoriously difficult place to bat but it's a little tough to bowl there as well for visiting teams. The South Africans quicks are tall and get so much more out of the surface.

The lengths you need to bowl there is vastly different from the rest of the world.
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Jahandad would've been perfect. Alas.

Not too dissimilar to England, SA, a cross between England/NZ and Australia
 
Farabi said:
Did you even see the recent SA and Aus ODI series? If anything, this is the deadliest Shaheen I’ve seen. He’s now added the one that goes away, and he’s also added reverse swing. The pace is also back to where it used to be.
Some of the commentary I see here is delusional. Shaheen was never express. He has always been high 130s bowler and he never saw a decline in ODIs. He bowled 145+ for brief 6 month period in T20Is at max, but that now feels like an aberration.
In test cricket, he’s been used on the worse pitches in the world
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I reiterate . It has no bearing on how he may go in Test matches.

He won't hit the same speeds while bowling 18 overs a day.
 
SSA ready to play in BPL but has no aspirations or hunger for test cricket
 
the 133 kph bowler did the job

ytNDdAT.png
 
DTrump said:
No it is not. He has no test fitness.
He has barely bowled with the red ball in his life and is now 30+. Even the great fast bowlers start to wind down at this stage. A bloke with NINE FC matches will not set the international stage on fire. Come on.
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Test cricket isn’t one-dimensional—it requires variety in the bowling attack. While players like Mir Hamza and Abbas have their roles, there’s also a need for an enforcer who can consistently bowl 145+ in short bursts of 3-4 overs, especially in SENA conditions.

There don’t seem to be many such options in domestic cricket, but from what I’ve seen of Rauf, his Test-match lengths during the Australia ODI tour suggest he could thrive in similar conditions. If he replicates that form, he’d be a real handful.

To make it work, though, someone needs to guide him properly: compensate him for league sacrifices, rest him during T20s, get him into the academy, give him FC opportunities, and introduce him to Test cricket carefully and strategically.
 
Jamal has done it... i was just about to praise Bavuma that he likes Pakistan LOL
 
Nikhil_cric said:
I reiterate . It has no bearing on how he may go in Test matches.

He won't hit the same speeds while bowling 18 overs a day.
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You’re living in extremes if you think that success in ODIs is not a good predictor of success in tests. The formats are similar enough. If anything bowling in ODIs is harder. These same bowlers Bosch, Jansen and Rabada look more threatening with red ball because conditions are more favorable. It’s like saying Jaiswal wouldn’t do well in ODIs.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Probably should have played ahead of Abbas. Don't see the logic in bringing him back.

But I don't Shaheen was able to take that 3 format workload . And a given a choice, fast bowlers will always quit Tests first.
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Well they dropped him because they felt he lacked pace. Then they saw the pace of the other bowlers and figured might as well bring him back so he can replicate some of the old magic, since the others aren't exactly quick either. But he seems to be past it at this point. He actually hasn't been that bad but when you are that low on pace, the margin for error is even lower.

Yeah, alot of the blame lies on playing Shaheen in meaningless bilateral T20s against England C and New Zealand Z. There is zero amount of planning and thinking behind how our fast-bowlers should be used. The prevailing theme still very much seems to be that every game for Pakistan is important, which it is not.
 
This wicket is really fun to watch cricket on. Not much bounce but the pitch is always doing something. Bowlers are always in the game should they pitch it in the right areas.
Perfect balance between bat and bowl.
 
Why select Shehzad when you know he won't last one test inning.Terrible fitness
 
Farabi said:
Did you even see the recent SA and Aus ODI series? If anything, this is the deadliest Shaheen I’ve seen. He’s now added the one that goes away, and he’s also added reverse swing. The pace is also back to where it used to be.
Some of the commentary I see here is delusional. Shaheen was never express. He has always been high 130s bowler and he never saw a decline in ODIs. He bowled 145+ for brief 6 month period in T20Is at max, but that now feels like an aberration.
In test cricket, he’s been used on the worse pitches in the world
Click to expand...
If a bowler does well in Test cricket, you can assume that they will do well in Odi's as well. There are exceptions like Philander, Robinson etc but the larger point is true.

Success in LOI is not indicative of anything.
Farabi said:
Test cricket isn’t one-dimensional—it requires variety in the bowling attack. While players like Mir Hamza and Abbas have their roles, there’s also a need for an enforcer who can consistently bowl 145+ in short bursts of 3-4 overs, especially in SENA conditions.

There don’t seem to be many such options in domestic cricket, but from what I’ve seen of Rauf, his Test-match lengths during the Australia ODI tour suggest he could thrive in similar conditions. If he replicates that form, he’d be a real handful.

To make it work, though, someone needs to guide him properly: compensate him for league sacrifices, rest him during T20s, get him into the academy, give him FC opportunities, and introduce him to Test cricket carefully and strategically.
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He will never agree to it and for good reason. He is 31 years old and the risk of injury is too big. One injury and he is done.

He is an asset for Pakistan in White ball cricket and should stay there.

Last question, is there any example of a 31 year with no FC experience doing well in International cricket? Teach him. Cannot do it at his age. Age is the issue here.
 
Farabi said:
You’re living in extremes if you think that success in ODIs is not a good predictor of success in tests. The formats are similar enough. If anything bowling in ODIs is harder. These same bowlers Bosch, Jansen and Rabada look more threatening with red ball because conditions are more favorable. It’s like saying Jaiswal wouldn’t do well in ODIs.
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Because in Odi even a bad ball can get you wickets and there is a massive difference bowling 10 overs and bowling 20 in a day. In Odi going at 4 rpo is ok. In tests 4rpo is rubbish. You are just handing the initiative to opposition.

I’m not saying Abbas, Jamal, Naseem are bowling well. They are awful
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Well they dropped him because they felt he lacked pace. Then they saw the pace of the other bowlers and figured might as well bring him back so he can replicate some of the old magic, since the others aren't exactly quick either. But he seems to be past it at this point. He actually hasn't been that bad but when you are that low on pace, the margin for error is even lower.

Yeah, alot of the blame lies on playing him in meaningless bilateral T20s against England C and New Zealand Z. There is zero amount of planning and thinking behind how our fast-bowlers should be used. The prevailing theme still very much seems to be that every game for Pakistan is important, which it is not.
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That last point is really crucial. Barring the odd outlier , most Test bowlers need to limit their T20 workloads to keep their speeds up and to stay injury free.

But in the modern cricket ecosystem , it's almost impossible to do
 
I don't think Khurram is injured. It's just brilliant captaincy by Shan not to bring his best bowler on.
 
I thought Abbas only lost his pace but it looks like he has forgotten his line too.

Can only get English club cricketers now a days
 
Amla clearly uncomfortable with him being praised in the comms

Leave him alone
 
Ali T said:
This wicket is really fun to watch cricket on. Not much bounce but the pitch is always doing something. Bowlers are always in the game should they pitch it in the right areas.
Perfect balance between bat and bowl.
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you are also in the game sir
 
Maybe the strategy was to get Jamal to bang it into the pitch and damage one side of the ball so that Khurram can get reverse ?
 
DTrump said:
If a bowler does well in Test cricket, you can assume that they will do well in Odi's as well. There are exceptions like Philander, Robinson etc but the larger point is true.

Success in LOI is not indicative of anything.

He will never agree to it and for good reason. He is 31 years old and the risk of injury is too big. One injury and he is done.

He is an asset for Pakistan in White ball cricket and should stay there.

Last question, is there any example of a 31 year with no FC experience doing well in International cricket? Teach him. Cannot do it at his age. Age is the issue here.
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The idea that success in ODIs doesn’t translate to Tests is an oversimplification. ODI bowling, in particular, shares many similarities with Test cricket. Countless players have started in ODIs, impressed, and gone on to have great Test careers.

Rauf has the skills, regardless of his lack of extensive first-class experience. You’re right that FC experience should be a pre requisite. But you cannot become one dimensional in your thought process. There isn’t any bowler in FC whose express.

He’s already proven himself in ODIs and thrives in helpful conditions. I’d rather he plays where he thrives than play mindless T20s where he tends to lose the plot.

Age is irrelevant—look at South Africa’s debutants who bowled out Pakistan; they were 31 and 35. At the end of the day, it’s the skills that matter, not the fluff.
 
I think Bedingham is a good player who has't quite cracked it in the test format so far. Very good player of pace and bounce. Maybe today is the day he cashes in.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Maybe the strategy was to get Jamal to bang it into the pitch and damage one side of the ball so that Khurram can get reverse ?
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If that is the strategy then someone needs to remind them that they don't have 300+ on the board.
 
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