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[PICTURES] Is Virat Kohli the greatest ODI run chaser in history?

He is already by far the best limited overs bat going around period. And the greatest chaser period. Where he can improve is his record in setting up scores where each in is way ahead.

Virat averages some 41 while setting up scores. This is his only blemish else he is a top loi bat of all time.
 
abc_to_xyz said:
Kohli never chased against Wasim/Waqar/Imran which he did.

For me Kohli is only a joke till he start chasing like that consistently OUTSIDE ASIA.
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For me Pakistani team is a joke until they win two odi wc or defeat India in wc.

Talking about obscure criteria.
 
Someguy said:
Most of tendulkers 100s were in losing causes, many times the loss was due to the 100 as well, best chaser has to be Bevan.
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In Tests, only 21.5% of his 100's came in loses.

In ODI's only 28.5% of his 100's came in loses.


And over all in both the formats combined, only 25% of his 100's came in loses.
 
Hitman said:
In Tests, only 21.5% of his 100's came in loses.

In ODI's only 28.5% of his 100's came in loses.


And over all in both the formats combined, only 25% of his 100's came in loses.
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What about Lara? Surely Lara has better numbers since he had a better bowling attack and is generally considered a match winner.
 
Statsman said:
What about Lara? Surely Lara has better numbers since he had a better bowling attack and is generally considered a match winner.
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A grand total of 8 centuries off 34 centuries of his came in wins (Test cricket).
 
Stark said:
:misbah




You are ready to take a call on his career already?


Comedy badiya chal rahi hai yahan.
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How hard is it to understand that you can give a solid opinion on a player based on his performance to date only. If he starts scoring runs more consistently in tests, he will find a place in all time Indian XI. However, at this moment he can't replace any of Dravid, Tendulkar, and Laxman in the middle order.
 
Statsman said:
Shocking! How many in losses?
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14 centuries in loses, that's 41.1% of his centuries in loses. One can hardly blame him for anything though, apart from that 400* innings of his. It's the Pakistani way of looking things trying to glorify their hero Inzamam.
 
The_Odd_One said:
How hard is it to understand that you can give a solid opinion on a player based on his performance to date only. If he starts scoring runs more consistently in tests, he will find a place in all time Indian XI. However, at this moment he can't replace any of Dravid, Tendulkar, and Laxman in the middle order.
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Kohli is not carrying finesse in his game, but for his sheer gameplay and temperament, he should have a case. Having all the stalwarts in the team is fine, but there is a def need to keep some busy players in the team who can motor along, and can change the complexion of the team with their presence.

He has tuned his game a bit more, and it will be interesting to see what he does in England next time. But apart from that, he has shown the stomach to surge ahead, and that makes it atleast a 50-50 case for him.
 
eradicator said:
Both Bevan and Kohli are batsmen made for different occasions. For example if my team is at 42/6 in 15 overs chasing 185, then I will choose Bevan over Kohli.

And if my team is at 10/1 in 5 overs chasing 330, then I will choose Kohli over Bevan.
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I think dis sumz it up well.
 
One of his finest innings today if he can help us get past the line will be in his top 5 best knocks considering we were 4 down for nothing chasing 351.

Still 110 away.
 
Tell about Virat Kohli Batting in LOI's

Dictionary: Insane! Incredible!

Tell about his Batting while Chasing:

Dictionary: Error 404 not found
 
Dont think i have seen a better chaser who used to bat at 3.
 
He has stopped winning matches single handedly ,worrying sign for Us, highly disappointing
 
I predicted kohli's century after England's inning. But I don't feel that was a great prediction. Opposition should know India starts with 100 for 0 at the least with kohli in the side.
 
He now has 17 centuries in ODI chases - the joint-most by any batsman along with Tendulkar. And he's still only 28 years old.
 
The biggest compliment you can give him is that no one thought India were out of the match at 63/4 chasing 351 to win since Kohli was still around.

Is there anyone else in history the same could be said about?
 
Greatest ever chaser already.

Just have a good WC and he will be the greatest ODI bat of all time.

There is NONE like Kohli.

None.
 
Sin Nombre said:
The biggest compliment you can give him is that no one thought India were out of the match at 63/4 chasing 351 to win since Kohli was still around.
Is there anyone else in history the same could be said about?
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Yes. Sachin of the 90s and decent bit in the noughts held similar repute.
 
Stark said:
Yes. Sachin of the 90s and decent bit in the noughts held similar repute.
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I am a big fan of Sachin. But i would have lost confidence even with Sachin with large totals ahead. First Dhoni/Yuvraj combo started this chasing Trend for India. Kohli took it to another level. Before that they would come close before fizzling out. You need nerveless batting ability. Many have done once or twice, Kaif did at Lords. But Dhoni, Yuvraj did more frequently. Kohli is doing religiously in almost all the chasing matches.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
I am a big fan of Sachin. But i would have lost confidence even with Sachin with large totals ahead. First Dhoni/Yuvraj combo started this chasing Trend for India. Kohli took it to another level. Before that they would come close before fizzling out. You need nerveless batting ability. Many have done once or twice, Kaif did at Lords. But Dhoni, Yuvraj did more frequently. Kohli is doing religiously in almost all the chasing matches.
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With time the game has changed a lot. Earlier the scores were mighty good with 250+ and teams usually would go onto win. Now with 350 being the norm, and if a single player has to achieve it, they usually gun it down with some mongrel. Sachin's time was less on this brutal stuff, plus Sachin liked to bat, whereas Kohli likes to win.

With change in time and trend, Kohli looks the natural progression of things. He just needs to fine tune his batting a bit more against the moving ball, and he ll be abs tremendous in every aspect.
 
GLORY OF '92 said:
Greatest ODI player ever. No doubt.
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Not yet. but he will be in a few years beyond any doubt. Just needs to have a good world cup especially knockout games and then critics would have NOTHING against him.
 
Where were these chases when SA visited? Once again, he's great in his comfort zone in India against average bowlers in small grounds. Until he proves himself outside that, he isn't. He's among the very best but doesn't stand alone because of this.

Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio? His record says otherwise.
 
He is still young..Lots of matches to go...He will definitely prove himself there too..
 
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Chief Destroyer said:
Where were these chases when SA visited? Once again, he's great in his comfort zone in India against average bowlers in small grounds. Until he proves himself outside that, he isn't. He's among the very best but doesn't stand alone because of this.

Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio? His record says otherwise.
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He made 91,59,117,106 in Australia vs Australia last time. India was 278 for 3 chasing 348 .. with 11 overs to go . Collapse did India in. They collapsed to 323. Otherwise his 100 would not have gone in vain.
 
One of Kohli's six today over long on off Woakes was a stunning one, deserved a separate thread to talk about. Only Richards used to play shots like this.

Best run chaser in history ? He's getting there, will eventually take over Micheal Bevan, not yet though.
 
moghul said:
One of Kohli's six today over long on off Woakes was a stunning one, deserved a separate thread to talk about. Only Richards used to play shots like this.

Best run chaser in history ? He's getting there, will eventually take over Micheal Bevan, not yet though.
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That is debatable. Dhoni already overtook Bevan. Kohli has overtaken everyone as he takes care of both building and attacking for longer periods more frequently.
 
I dont know how many here have actually seen Bevan as opposed to simply going by hearsay and debating a topic they have knowledge of.

I have followed Bevan all along. While he is no mug with the bat, i dont think he is deserving of any greatness tag, not even close. You have to bring in filters such as chaser, finisher to even get him on the list. Picture WC 2003. Shane Bond blitzed the Aussie top order & they were reduced to 5 down for nothing. Then in came Bevan who helped reconstucted the innigs & helped them get to 200. And then in came, the great Aussie bowling brigade led by McGrath and Brett Lee. They bowled the Kiwis out for less than 120 & won the game. Bevan's reputation was enhanced because of games like this, because of the type of players he had around him.

Honestly, i think of Bevan as an average talented cricketer who maximized his potential with sheer hard work, temperament and work ethic. He is not even a top 10 ODI batsman Australia has ever produced. Whereas by the time he hangs his boots, we will be able to comfortably make the case for Kohli as a top 10 ODI batsman ever.

Throughout Bevan's career, i have never seen any opponent fear Bevan or strategize their game plan around him. It was always Mark Waugh or Gilly or Hayden or Ponting or Symonds who were more feared by opponents. Bevan's limitations as a batsman are well documented, which is why he never made it to the test squad. He batted in pretty much ONE gear constantly rotating the strike and using percentage shots to maximize his time in the middle. He simply did not have the skills to lead the chase of big targets like Kohli or Dhoni does.

So to me this comparison is a joke. One is a hardworking average batsman who enhanced his reputation by virtue of being surrounded by the greatest teammates ever and the other is a potential ATG batsman who can construct the innings, rebuild the momentum or destroy attacks without looking like a hack. Chalk & Cheese!
 
Kohl is already comfortably a top 10 ODI batsman and a better chaser than Bevan. You could argue about better finisher but not better chaser.
 
You are perfectly entitled to your view.

But majority in the world consider Bevan to be amongst the top 2 finishers in the game (other being Dhoni).

Even though good bowlers turned his performances into a win, there are too many games which Bevan won batting 2nd. I can't forget how he chased down 260 odd in the decider game in India when Aus was at 202-6 having lost Symonds. That's just one of the many games he finished.

Would have had a good enough SR in today's era cos he can smash the ball.

He is simply the greatest finisher imo.
 
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cricjunkie2 said:
I dont know how many here have actually seen Bevan as opposed to simply going by hearsay and debating a topic they have knowledge of.

I have followed Bevan all along. While he is no mug with the bat, i dont think he is deserving of any greatness tag, not even close. You have to bring in filters such as chaser, finisher to even get him on the list. Picture WC 2003. Shane Bond blitzed the Aussie top order & they were reduced to 5 down for nothing. Then in came Bevan who helped reconstucted the innigs & helped them get to 200. And then in came, the great Aussie bowling brigade led by McGrath and Brett Lee. They bowled the Kiwis out for less than 120 & won the game. Bevan's reputation was enhanced because of games like this, because of the type of players he had around him.

Honestly, i think of Bevan as an average talented cricketer who maximized his potential with sheer hard work, temperament and work ethic. He is not even a top 10 ODI batsman Australia has ever produced. Whereas by the time he hangs his boots, we will be able to comfortably make the case for Kohli as a top 10 ODI batsman ever.

Throughout Bevan's career, i have never seen any opponent fear Bevan or strategize their game plan around him. It was always Mark Waugh or Gilly or Hayden or Ponting or Symonds who were more feared by opponents. Bevan's limitations as a batsman are well documented, which is why he never made it to the test squad. He batted in pretty much ONE gear constantly rotating the strike and using percentage shots to maximize his time in the middle. He simply did not have the skills to lead the chase of big targets like Kohli or Dhoni does.

So to me this comparison is a joke. One is a hardworking average batsman who enhanced his reputation by virtue of being surrounded by the greatest teammates ever and the other is a potential ATG batsman who can construct the innings, rebuild the momentum or destroy attacks without looking like a hack. Chalk & Cheese!
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This is potw material

Unbelievable that the same fans who talk about amirs missed edges etc are questioning documented visual as well as statistical evidence of Kohli's greatness lol.
 
Lol, I had surely thought the game was over when they were not many for 4. Full credit to Kohli and Yadav, these were fantastic innings, albeit on a flat pitch.

Kohli's comment of "Let's get to 150/4 positively and watch them press the panic button" was a great mentality to have.

Chief Destroyer said:
Where were these chases when SA visited? Once again, he's great in his comfort zone in India against average bowlers in small grounds. Until he proves himself outside that, he isn't. He's among the very best but doesn't stand alone because of this.

Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio? His record says otherwise.
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He does stand alone because of the Indian hype machine and because in the average cricket fan's mind, he's been chasing down every 300+ target he's been given.

Unless you dig in deeper for the truth, Kohli is an irresistible chaser.
 
Chief Destroyer said:
Where were these chases when SA visited? Once again, he's great in his comfort zone in India against average bowlers in small grounds. Until he proves himself outside that, he isn't. He's among the very best but doesn't stand alone because of this.

Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio? His record says otherwise.
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who can? point is that he's better than his competition.
 
Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio today? He perfectly can and you just need to see his batting numbers in Australia.

Convenient now to discredit England's pace attack, call them 'average' and hype Australia's attack but the English didn't look so "average" when they were bowling on flat tracks in the summer, even if it was the Pakistani batsmen at the other end.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
You are perfectly entitled to your view.

But majority in the world consider Bevan to be amongst the top 2 finishers in the game (other being Dhoni).

Even though good bowlers turned his performances into a win, there are too many games which Bevan won batting 2nd. I can't forget how he chased down 260 odd in the decider game in India when Aus was at 202-6 having lost Symonds. That's just one of the many games he finished.

Would have had a good enough SR in today's era cos he can smash the ball.

He is simply the greatest finisher imo.
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You never saw that match, did you?
That match was turned by wrong decision of Ganguly wicket when he was batting very fluently and then by great death bowling by Aussie especially Harvey, Indians made 40 odd runs in last ten overs which made chase possible, even then Bevan was batting slower than required rate.
India even with 6 run per over in last 10 could have finished over 280 and with little bit acceleration could have easily touch 290or 300.
 
Navdeep Srivastava said:
You never saw that match, did you?
That match was turned by wrong decision of Ganguly wicket when he was batting very fluently and then by great death bowling by Aussie especially Harvey, Indians made 40 odd runs in last ten overs which made chase possible, even then Bevan was batting slower than required rate.
India even with 6 run per over in last 10 could have finished over 280 and with little bit acceleration could have easily touch 290or 300.
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I saw that match fully.

Whatever happened in Indian innings is not Bevan's fault. Also we can't penalize Bevan for Aus death bowling.

Bevan got a target, he planned his chase and he executed it brilliantly. Finishers are those who close out chases. They don't have to necessarily bat at the req rate. They are finishers cos they know runs are like elastic. In the right moment, many can be scored.

That game, I was confident India would win after Symonds threw away his wicket but what followed had my jaw on the floor.

Bevan is incredible. His low SR is used against him but I feel he would have batted perfectly fine in modern era to close down targets.
 
No question about it. Beven was very very good. But Kholi you fear him. AS a captain, team He plays like He is god and The result is pre decided when He is Chasing. Kholi is infAct The greatest ever batsman his mental and out of The World. He is from a different planet
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
I saw that match ful
Whatever happened in Indian innings is not Bevan's fault. Also we can't penalize Bevan for Aus death bowling.

Bevan got a target, he planned his chase and he executed it brilliantly. Finishers are those who close out chases. They don't have to necessarily bat at the req rate. They are finishers cos they know runs are like elastic. In the right moment, many can be scored.

That game, I was confident India would win after Symonds threw away his wicket but what followed had my jaw on the floor.

Bevan is incredible. His low SR is used against him but I feel he would have batted perfectly fine in modern era to close down targets.
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Kholi is 2 times better than beven yaar
 
Bevan is a finisher. Greatest ever imo.

Kohli is a chaser. Greatest ever imo.

Finishing is the sub set of chasing but a very crucial component at that.

Without finishing, excellent chase knocks can get wasted.

Take today, if Pandya and Ash had choked, Kohli and Jadhav's knocks would have been wasted.
 
Chief Destroyer said:
Where were these chases when SA visited? Once again, he's great in his comfort zone in India against average bowlers in small grounds. Until he proves himself outside that, he isn't. He's among the very best but doesn't stand alone because of this.

Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio? His record says otherwise.
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Check your facts before resorting to generalities. Speaking of tough chases in limited overs Kohli ALREADY has more than a dozen 50+ scores in won chases in AWAY games. He will probably go on to play another 200 ODIs before he hangs his boots. So if he continues in this vein, his stats will be mind blowing. The complete list is here:
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...3;tournament_type=5;type=batting;view=innings

Couple of innings that standout for me were the Adelaide chase vs Lanka where India had to chase down 350 in 40 overs & Kohli bludgeoned the likes of Malinga in Australia. I dont think Malinga is a medicore bowler.

Recently in WC T20, in the virtual QF vs Australia, on a two paced wicket he was the only batsman who looked comfortable, chasing down a stiff target against a quality attack in a high pressure game. If anything this is even tougher than a conventional ODI chase. And he did that with pure timing and placement, so much so, after this innings, Ian Chappell rated him higher than Lara in terms of his ability to place the ball and toy with the bowlers.

For my own liking, Kohli still has to prove himself on the big stage - in world cups. He has not done enough yet and that's a fair criticism, but I am confident he will right the wrongs in the next two world cups (or champions trophies).
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Bevan is a finisher. Greatest ever imo.

Kohli is a chaser. Greatest ever imo.

Finishing is the sub set of chasing but a very crucial component at that.

Without finishing, excellent chase knocks can get wasted.

Take today, if Pandya and Ash had choked, Kohli and Jadhav's knocks would have been wasted.
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I am sorry. Finisher or not is a matter of perspective.

In this thread, i mentioned about a WC2003 game Aussies played vs NZL where they scored 200+ with the help of Bevan after being reduced to 80/5. Aussie bowlers were still good enough to bowl Kiwis out & win the game by 80 runs.

Contrast that with the innings Dhoni played vs Pakistan here:
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/589308.html

Considering the circumstances, Dhoni's was a better innings, but he ended up losing. If he had McGrath & Lee to backup his batting, he'd have won & his reputation would have been enhanced as a finisher.

I repeat. Bevan was a very average batsman. The Aussie top order was mostly good enough in good batting conditions to post big runs and not require any serious contribution from Bevan. When the conditions were bowler friendly, Bevan served as the insurance policy, who played percentage cricket to take Aussies to a decent total (in the ball park of 200). Most teams defending 200 would have lost those games 9 times out of 10. And while chasing i have never seen Bevan bring down big targets. But the great Aussie ODI team was good enough to win many of those games. Bevan's reputation of a finisher is built on these type of games. If you analyze the games closely you will see what I am saying.
 
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sensible-indian-fan said:
I saw that match fully.

Whatever happened in Indian innings is not Bevan's fault. Also we can't penalize Bevan for Aus death bowling.

Bevan got a target, he planned his chase and he executed it brilliantly. Finishers are those who close out chases. They don't have to necessarily bat at the req rate. They are finishers cos they know runs are like elastic. In the right moment, many can be scored.

That game, I was confident India would win after Symonds threw away his wicket but what followed had my jaw on the floor.

Bevan is incredible. His low SR is used against him but I feel he would have batted perfectly fine in modern era to close down targets.
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Any link of that game?
 
Yes that is why Bevan averages 86 in won games chasing an already set total for Aus. Averages 56 in chasing in general.

Now you would say since he had Aussie bowlers who could bowl teams to low total, its not a big deal.

I agree with you on one thing.

Cricket is not played in stats sheets.

Those who saw Bevan were astounded by his finishing prowess regardless of how good Aus the team was. He won Aus tons of games with his ability to plan and coordinate the innings.

So no amount of "he got this, he got that" analysis is going to change that perception.

As I said, you are free to hold your view mate.

99% of cricket fans who watched Bevan will disagree with you and rightly so.

He was an incredible ODI bat.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
I saw that match fully.

Whatever happened in Indian innings is not Bevan's fault. Also we can't penalize Bevan for Aus death bowling.

Bevan got a target, he planned his chase and he executed it brilliantly. Finishers are those who close out chases. They don't have to necessarily bat at the req rate. They are finishers cos they know runs are like elastic. In the right moment, many can be scored.

That game, I was confident India would win after Symonds threw away his wicket but what followed had my jaw on the floor.

Bevan is incredible. His low SR is used against him but I feel he would have batted perfectly fine in modern era to close down targets.
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He was great , his 185 while chasing down in loosing cause is one of my favourite inning. My point he was rarely put out of comfort zone regarding run rate.
Bevan used to play really slow while batting first , remember a match where Bevan came in 30th over, Australia was 175 odd and made 60 ball 45 runs and next Australian wicket fell in 49 th over. So he batted till 50overs when there was no wicketfall, no pressure but batted slowly during death overs . Australia won the match and everything is forgotten. There are many instances where Bevan batted slowly without any reason when there was no pressure even in death overs but because Australia won the matches with good bowling.
 
Navdeep Srivastava said:
He was great , his 185 while chasing down in loosing cause is one of my favourite inning. My point he was rarely put out of comfort zone regarding run rate.
Bevan used to play really slow while batting first , remember a match where Bevan came in 30th over, Australia was 175 odd and made 60 ball 45 runs and next Australian wicket fell in 49 th over. So he batted till 50overs when there was no wicketfall, no pressure but batted slowly during death overs . Australia won the match and everything is forgotten. There are many instances where Bevan batted slowly without any reason when there was no pressure even in death overs but because Australia won the matches with good bowling.
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1. That 185 game was amazing but I didn't live. Dunno how I missed that. If I am not wrong, Bevan would have tied the game for his team had one of the other batsmen grounded his bat after reaching the crease. His bat was in the air and he was run out. In the end, Rest Of World lost by 1 run.

2. The era during Bevan's was different. There were quite a few games where 220-230-240 used to be match winning on tricky pitches. Now I am not saying Bevan couldn't have played any bad knocks or match losing knocks in his career but point is that in general, you knew that if Bevan got in, you are pretty much screwed. And that's what happened most of the times. He just was so hard to get out and he knew what to do and when to do it which is why he was so amazing. He never gave you a chance.

Now Kohli is just next level though.
 
sarthak said:
Could he chase 300 on a Brisbane track facing Australia's trio today? He perfectly can and you just need to see his batting numbers in Australia.

Convenient now to discredit England's pace attack, call them 'average' and hype Australia's attack but the English didn't look so "average" when they were bowling on flat tracks in the summer, even if it was the Pakistani batsmen at the other end.
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Has he done it against Australia, England and South Africa in their home grounds? He can do a lot of things and when he does, he'll be unanimously regarded as one of the three greatest ODI batsmen ever.
 
3. Its perfectly fine if you want to question his SR and wonder how he would have done in this era. Its up for debate. Looking at the way he batted, I think he would have done just fine. Would have striked at respectable 80s and ensured a lot of wins.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
1. That 185 game was amazing but I didn't live. Dunno how I missed that. If I am not wrong, Bevan would have tied the game for his team had one of the other batsmen grounded his bat after reaching the crease. His bat was in the air and he was run out. In the end, Rest Of World lost by 1 run.

2. The era during Bevan's was different. There were quite a few games where 220-230-240 used to be match winning on tricky pitches. Now I am not saying Bevan couldn't have played any bad knocks or match losing knocks in his career but point is that in general, you knew that if Bevan got in, you are pretty much screwed. And that's what happened most of the times. He just was so hard to get out and he knew what to do and when to do it which is why he was so amazing. He never gave you a chance.

Now Kohli is just next level though.
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What are Bevan's advantages over Dhoni?genuine question as havent watched him much
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
You are perfectly entitled to your view.

But majority in the world consider Bevan to be amongst the top 2 finishers in the game (other being Dhoni).

Even though good bowlers turned his performances into a win, there are too many games which Bevan won batting 2nd. I can't forget how he chased down 260 odd in the decider game in India when Aus was at 202-6 having lost Symonds. That's just one of the many games he finished.

Would have had a good enough SR in today's era cos he can smash the ball.

He is simply the greatest finisher imo.
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well this is why I keep saying how a lot of Asian cricket fans are sooo easily convinced about greatness of foreign players ... the bar is sooo low that it has got to be the effect of media/brainwashing/perceptions/stereotypes or however you want to classify it that does it for us. How else do you explain a simple stat such as Kohli already having made twice as many runs as Bevan (in matches won batting 2nd) at a better avg and such a vasstly superior strike rate that there is not even a semblence of doubt that you are looking at the best of the very best of all times in action !

links :
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

You so easily said that he would have had a better strike rate if he played today !! Really ! has cricket changed that much that a batman striking at 67 batting second would up his game to strike at nearly 30% more S/R over twice as many runs ?


And you mention a match where Bevan did well .... can you find a match where anyone can match Kohli's epic thrashing of Malinga and chasing down 320 in 37 overs ? It requires a completely different level of skill and fitness to play inngs like that which Bevan could only dream about. There is no comparison whatsoever between Bevan putting up a decent partnership to chase 60 odd runs in 11 overs with Harvey and Kohli's inngs. Very huge difference.
 
Saurav said:
What are Bevan's advantages over Dhoni?genuine question as havent watched him much
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Not much , Dhoni is same as Bevan start slow and go in a coordinated way, ofcourse Dhoni is a better hitter.
Australian bowling is the main difference. I saw whole career of Bevan and Dhoni , not big difference between them .
 
Without a shadow of a doubt. If there is one guy who can match him is his own team mate MS Dhoni
 
Saurav said:
What are Bevan's advantages over Dhoni?genuine question as havent watched him much
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From what I have watched with my eyes, he seemed to be a better coordinator of chases (for his era). The thing about Bevan was that he was incredibly smart. He knew when to do what which meant he almost always ended up winning the game for his side.

The biggest thing was that he NEVER got out easily no matter where he played and against whom he played. That is why he has some incredible records in almost every country and continent. Even Tendulkar and Lara don't have that in ODIs.

He has 2 iconic knocks in the 4 WC knockout games he batted (QF knock against WI in 1999, SF knock against SA in 1999). These knocks were when he walked in at situations where Aus was certain to lose. We can't analyze these knocks from a SR point of view. They came in under immense pressure against ATG bowlers (on non easy pitches) with their team staring down the barrel on the biggest stage.

He wasn't flamboyant but did JUST enough to get you the wins and he did it at crucial junctures.
 
Oh, Bevan's SR of 67 cannot be attributed to his ERA. That's nonsense. Many of his peers had a much better SR & that's nos saying much. Bevan bats in the lower order and generally you'd expect a batsman who bats in the slog overs to have a higher SR, esp someone who averages so much. So his **** poor SR is only attributable to his limited ability to change gears.

And you can't overlook how much the bowling attack made a difference to Bevan's reputation. After the narrative is always dictated by the victor. In another team, Bevan could have a Mohammad Kaif, another hard working untalented ODI cricketer.

Overall, Bevan has show cased only one dimension of batting, chasing or batting 1st. And he rarely got out because he hardly played the big shots, always played percentage cricket. Hardly enough to rank him as an all timer.
 
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Tusker said:
well this is why I keep saying how a lot of Asian cricket fans are sooo easily convinced about greatness of foreign players ... the bar is sooo low that it has got to be the effect of media/brainwashing/perceptions/stereotypes or however you want to classify it that does it for us. How else do you explain a simple stat such as Kohli already having made twice as many runs as Bevan (in matches won batting 2nd) at a better avg and such a vasstly superior strike rate that there is not even a semblence of doubt that you are looking at the best of the very best of all times in action !

links :
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

You so easily said that he would have had a better strike rate if he played today !! Really ! has cricket changed that much that a batman striking at 67 batting second would up his game to strike at nearly 30% more S/R over twice as many runs ?


And you mention a match where Bevan did well .... can you find a match where anyone can match Kohli's epic thrashing of Malinga and chasing down 320 in 37 overs ? It requires a completely different level of skill and fitness to play inngs like that which Bevan could only dream about. There is no comparison whatsoever between Bevan putting up a decent partnership to chase 60 odd runs in 11 overs with Harvey and Kohli's inngs. Very huge difference.
Click to expand...

Maybe from next time onwards, read all my posts in a page before taking so much energy to make a post. Haha.

Kohli > Bevan
 
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