The Russian invasion of Ukraine

[daytrader]

Ukraine accuses Russia of shelling rescuers amid dam evacuations
Russian President Vladimir Putin blames Kyiv and Western supporters in first comments on destroyed Kakhovka dam.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has accused Russian forces of shelling Ukrainian emergency workers who are trying to rescue people from floodwaters caused by the destruction of the Nova Kakhovka dam.

Speaking in his nightly address on Wednesday, Zelenskyy said that more than 2,000 people have been rescued so far from flooding in the Kherson and Mykolaiv regions which, he said, contrasted starkly with Russian-occupied regions where he accused Moscow’s forces of simply abandoning people to the flood.

“Evacuation continues. Under fire!” Zelenskyy said. “Russian artillery continues to fire, no matter what. Savages,” he said.

“Our military and special services are rescuing people as much as it is possible, despite the shelling.”

Zelenskky described conditions in Russian-occupied parts of the Kherson region as “absolutely catastrophic” and called on international humanitarian organisations, such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, to immediately deploy to and help people abandoned in occupied areas now hit by flooding from the destruction of the Nova Kakhovka dam on Tuesday.

“The occupiers simply abandoned people in these terrible conditions. Without rescue, without water, just on the rooftops in flooded communities,” Ukraine’s president said.

“It is even impossible to establish for sure how many people in the temporarily occupied territory of Kherson region may die without rescue, without drinking water, without food, without medical care,” he added.

...
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023...-shelling-rescue-workers-amid-dam-evacuations

 

[bones]

Initially when the dam blew up I thought it was neither side and that it was damaged over several months through various forms of shelling. But given the way MSM has pinned the blame on Russia and the Ukranians just won't shut up about it, I'm now pretty confident it was blown up by the Ukranians.

As a journalist quizzed John Kirby recently - does it make any sense for Russia to blow up a dam that would cut off the fresh water supply to Crimea? It makes about as much sense as blowing up your own pipeline.

I fear for the journalist who asked that question though, it might be the end of her career.

 

[cpleigh]

Jesus... you actually believe that??? On Russian state tv yesterday the pundits all agreed Ukraine couldn't do it.. and it could only be done by Russia!

The hosts had to cut away. Someone even tracked Russian social media activity. The timeline went like this:

A: Rejoice and bragging about it
B: An acceptance that it may have been a mistake
C: Deny it and Blame anyone else.

Exactly the same as when they shot down the airliner.

Russia did it. If you honestly believe Ukraine would destroy its own country, kill its own people, destroy its economy by flooding its bread basket, and hamper the counter attack and the BEST arguement you have for Russia not doing it is because of water to Crimea even though for 8 years they didn't have access anyway..

You seriously need to come out of the Kremlins rear end. Now the debate should be did Putin order it or was it a Drunk general?

but Russian propagandrists have openly talked about blowing Ukraines Dams for months...

 

[the Great Khan]

stopped reading at the 'Russian defence ministry said'

The same ministry that published a video yesterday of them destroying a 'Leopard 2' tank... that turned out to be a tractor. They are a shambles,

There are more videos of more armoured vehicles being taken out..haven't seen one of a leapord yet but its only a matter of time. KA52's have free reign at the moment. None of these offensives seem to have air defence cover..no significant territory has been taken yet as Ukraine is trying for a 3rd day to break through enemy lines. As of now they haven't managed it. This may change in the next day or too..the longer it takes the more problematic it becomes..

They need to push through quickly and pour men through the gaps..if this becomes attritional there is only one winner.

 

[the Great Khan]

Also the Russians will fall back in the coming days as their main defensive positions are further back. They are relying on air power and atgms to take down alot of the armour. I have seen at least one dead leapord..the idea is to hold the line for as long as possible and then fall back to the main defensive positions..let's see how this goes..

 

[MenInG]

Norwegian scientists say they have found evidence of an explosion in the area of the Kakhovka dam at the time water began pouring through
The findings, based on seismic signals detected in Romania, come after days of uncertainty over how the dam was breached on Tuesday morning
Both Russia and Ukraine have accused each other of attacking the dam, though some speculated it could have collapsed from previous damage
Separately, Ukraine’s domestic security service has released a recording it says shows Russian soldiers admitting the country attacked the dam
Hundreds of thousands of people in the Kherson region, where the dam is located, have been left without drinking water
Meanwhile, Ukrainian attacks in the key Zaporizhzhia region are continuing, Russian officials and military bloggers say
Several military experts have said the focus of Ukraine's long awaited counter-offensive will be Zaporizhzhia

 

[KingKhanWC]

Initially when the dam blew up I thought it was neither side and that it was damaged over several months through various forms of shelling. But given the way MSM has pinned the blame on Russia and the Ukranians just won't shut up about it, I'm now pretty confident it was blown up by the Ukranians.

As a journalist quizzed John Kirby recently - does it make any sense for Russia to blow up a dam that would cut off the fresh water supply to Crimea? It makes about as much sense as blowing up your own pipeline.

I fear for the journalist who asked that question though, it might be the end of her career.

Its a recent pattern of Ukrainians using terrorism as a desperate move as they are on the brink of humiliation. Ukrainians have shown bravery but their recent counter offensive has been a total disaster so far. Much of The tanks, depleted uranium shells, patriots, long range missiles have been destroyed before any real chance of using them.

Russia have been preparing for this since 2014, they have intel inside Ukrainian forces.

A US citizen, journalist has been kidnapped by the Ukrainians but Yanks dont care enough of their own citizens to free him.

I wrote 6 months ago and still feel Ukraine will try to hit the nuclear plant. They now need something very serious to pressure the Russians to leave or for Nato to step in as much as they can.

Btw Over 80 nations are meeting in Russia this summer to forge a new gold backed currency. The clock for the wests superiority is ticking down ....fast.

 

[Reddy]

In total, during the failed attack in the Zaporozhye direction, the Armed Forces of Ukraine lost at least:

- 5 German tanks Leopard 2A6 and 2A4 (2 destroyed, 1 hit and abandoned, 3 abandoned)
- 6 American infantry fighting vehicles M2A2 Bradley ODS-SA (all destroyed and abandoned)
- 3 American MRAP M1224 MaxxPro (all hit and abandoned)
- 1 Dutch armored personnel carrier YPR-765 (hit and abandoned)
- 1 Czech T-72M1 (destroyed)
- 1 BMR-2 demining vehicle (hit and abandoned)
- 1 French VAB armored car (hit and abandoned).
- several burned out trucks

For the first time , Leopard 2 tanks and M2A2 Bradley IFVs were destroyed.

Source: Milinfolive

 

[MenInG]

Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky appears to have confirmed that his country's long-awaited counter-offensive against Russia has started.

"Counteroffensive and defensive actions are taking place," he said on Saturday.

But he added that he would not talk in detail about which stage or state the counter-offensive was in.

The comments come after an escalation of fighting in the south and east of Ukraine and speculation about progress of the widely anticipated push.

Ukrainian troops are reported to have advanced in the east near Bakhmut and in the south near Zaporizhzhia, and have carried out long-range strikes on Russian targets.

But assessing the reality on the front lines is difficult, with the two warring sides presenting contrasting narratives: Ukraine claiming progress and Russia that it is fighting off attacks.

Russian President Vladimir Putin said in a video interview published Friday that Ukrainian forces had certainly begun their offensive but that attempted advances had failed with heavy casualties.

Speaking in Kyiv, after talks with the Canadian PM Justin Trudeau, Mr Zelensky described the Russian leader's words as "interesting".

Shrugging his shoulders, raising his eyebrows and pretending not to know who Mr Putin was, Mr Zelensky said it was important that Russia felt "they do not have long left".

He also said that Ukraine's military commanders were in a positive mood, adding: "Tell that to Putin

 

[pakistani pride]

Total opposite statements.

 

[cpleigh]

Sounds like Ukraine have made breakthroughs in Donetsk and Zaporozhye now. Videos of liberated places and Russian millbloggers confirming it.

 

[MenInG]

Russia appears to have moved to take direct control of Wagner, after months of infighting between defence officials and the private military group.

Deputy Defence Minister Nikolai Pankov said on Saturday "volunteer formations" will be asked to sign contracts directly with the ministry of defence.

The vaguely worded statement is widely believed to target the group.

But in a furious statement on Sunday, Wagner boss Yevgeny Prigozhin said his forces would boycott the contracts.

The private military group has played a major role in the war in Ukraine, fighting on the side of Russian forces.

But Prigozhin, who is said to hold political ambitions of his own, has been embroiled in a public dispute with Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu and military chief Valery Gerasimov for months.

He has repeatedly accused the pair of incompetence and of deliberately undersupplying Wagner units fighting in Ukraine.

"Wagner will not sign any contracts with Shoigu," Prigozhin said in response to a request for comment on the defence ministry's announcement. "Shoigu cannot properly manage military formation."

He insisted that his group was well integrated with the Russian military, but said that its effectiveness would be damaged by having to report to the defence minister.

While Saturday's announcement did not directly reference Wagner or any other paramilitary groups, Russian media suggested that the new contracts were a move to bring Prigozhin and his forces under control.

But the defence ministry said the move was designed to "increase the effectiveness" of Russian units fighting in Ukraine.

"This will give volunteer formations the necessary legal status, create common approaches to the organization of comprehensive support and the fulfilment of their tasks," the ministry said in a statement, adding that the contracts must be signed by 1 July.

The long-running tensions between the Wagner Group and the army have threatened to boil over in recent weeks.

Last week the group kidnapped a senior frontline army commander, Lt Col Roman Venevitin, after accusing him of opening fire on a Wagner vehicle near Bakhmut.

Lt Col Venevitin was later released, and in a video shared by Russian military bloggers he accused the group of stoking "anarchy" on Russia's frontlines by stealing arms, forcing mobilised soldiers to sign contracts with the group and attempting to extort weapons from the defence ministry.

Prigozhin called the comments - which appeared to be read from a script - "absolutely total nonsense".

He has also suggested that he is ready to deploy his troops on Russian soil, saying on Telegram that Wagner was ready to fight against insurrectionist forces in the Belgorod region.

In December, the US estimated that Wagner had around 50,000 troops fighting in Ukraine.

And the mercenary group has increasingly become a tool of Russian state power around the world. Its troops are currently believed to have been deployed in Mali, the Central African Republic,Sudan and Libya.

BBC

 

[daytrader]

Ukraine counter-offensive: Kyiv says it has liberated villages in Donetsk region

Ukraine says it has liberated three villages in the south-east of the country in the first victories of its much-anticipated counter-offensive.

Footage on social media showed Ukrainian troops celebrating in the neighbouring settlements of Blahodatne and Neskuchne in the Donetsk region.

Kyiv's deputy defence minister said nearby Makarivka was also taken.

On Saturday, President Volodymyr Zelensky confirmed that the counter-offensive had begun.

These three settlements would be the first liberated since his comments, but not the first that Ukraine has recaptured since Monday, when pockets of its forces began to advance in the country's south.

Moscow has yet to confirm the fall of any of the villages, instead speaking of repelling Ukrainian assaults in the region.

Elsewhere, Ukraine says Russia has blown up another dam in the Zaporizhzhia region, following the destruction of the major Nova Kakhovka on Monday, which caused widespread flooding and mass evacuations. On Sunday, President Zelensky said 4,000 people had now been evacuated.

Ukraine says the dam was blown up by Russian forces, who have controlled it since February 2022.

Valeriy Shershen, a spokesperson for the Ukrainian military, said Moscow's forces had chosen to blow up a second dam near the village of Novodarivka, which "led to the flooding on both banks of the Mokri Yaly river".

Mr Shershen said Russia was deliberately blowing up dams in the region to halt Ukraine's advance towards occupied areas.

Russia has denied it blew up the Nova Kakhovka dam and has blamed Ukraine instead.

BBC

 

[pakistani pride]

Sounds like Ukraine have made breakthroughs in Donetsk and Zaporozhye now. Videos of liberated places and Russian millbloggers confirming it.

What is the reaction of our posters who claim that Russia has the upper hand?

 

[the Great Khan]

What is the reaction of our posters who claim that Russia has the upper hand?

They took three villages and then lost one already.. this is just the beginning of the offensive. Remember the Russians will withdraw. Its part of their tactics..they have space to do so as their first defensive line is quite far back.

They are currently withdrawing..then sending tons of artillery down the AFU's throat. Then they retake positions..the AFU return. The Russians move back again in some places and artillery..then back again..

You have to wait and see what happens..AFU are losing tons of equipment and troops..just remember bakhmut..

 

[cpleigh]

they didn't lose that village, that was a wildly optimistic hope from pro Russian telegram sources that was quashed by WarGonzo

 

[pakistani pride]

They took three villages and then lost one already.. this is just the beginning of the offensive. Remember the Russians will withdraw. Its part of their tactics..they have space to do so as their first defensive line is quite far back.

They are currently withdrawing..then sending tons of artillery down the AFU's throat. Then they retake positions..the AFU return. The Russians move back again in some places and artillery..then back again..

You have to wait and see what happens..AFU are losing tons of equipment and troops..just remember bakhmut..

I wonder what the end game is here. Looks like a very sad situation in the long term.

 

[daytrader]

Ukraine attacks the front line; Russia says big losses inflicted
Ukraine says its forces recaptured 100 square kilometres, but Russia’s President Vladimir Putin says counteroffensive attacks have ‘catastrophically’ failed.

Ukraine says it has recaptured about 100 square kilometres (40sq miles) of its territory during the 68th week of Russia’s invasion as a long-planned counterattack gains momentum.

But Russian President Vladimir Putin said Ukraine was suffering “catastrophic” losses and Kyiv’s casualties were 10 times greater than Moscow’s.

“All counteroffensive attempts made so far have failed, but the offensive potential of the troops of the Kyiv regime is still preserved,” said Putin.

The counteroffensive is still in its early days, said Demetries Andrew Grimes, a former commander who spent two years retraining the Ukrainian military from 2015 to 2017.

“All we’re seeing right now is softening of the [Russian] front lines with harassment fire with everything from small arms and rockets to drones and artillery,” Grimes told Al Jazeera.

“The aim of that is to stretch out the opposition to thin their forces… they’re lengthening the conflict zone and forcing the Russians to expose their supply lines so those can be disrupted and [Ukrainian forces] can encircle smaller groups.”

Ukraine stepped up attacks along much of the 1,200km (745-mile) front. Russia’s defence ministry said it repelled four Ukrainian ground attacks in the Kreminna area of the eastern Donetsk region on June 9.

Further south, eastern forces spokesman Serhiy Cherevatyi said Ukrainian forces advanced by 1,200m (3,940 feet) around Bakhmut on June 9, and by 1,400 metres (4,600 feet) the following day. Russian military sources corroborated these advances.

Ukrainian forces also launched a new front where Donetsk meets the Zaporizhia region on June 9.

Russia’s defence ministry said initial attacks were repelled, but two days later the Washington-based Institute for the Study of War (ISW) said “geolocated footage and Russian sources indicated that Ukrainian forces liberated multiple settlements… [near] Velyka Novosilka in western Donetsk Oblast”.

...
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023...e-front-line-russia-says-big-losses-inflicted

 

[bones]

I wonder what the end game is here. Looks like a very sad situation in the long term.

The Russians don't want to fight any longer than they have to, they were happy to negotiate in April last year. The Ukranians also want to negotiate but Zelensky has no choice. He is a puppet.

The Americans want to weaken Russia and they think by extending or even expanding this war they will, but it's not the case at all.

But numerically there's just no way the Ukranians can win. A win for Ukranians would be removing Russian troops from their territory and I just don't see that happening - there's just no possibility the reserves that Ukraine have are totally outnumbered by the reserves that the Russians have.

 

[cpleigh]

Please stop with the puppet nonsense. I think both were happy to negotiate in April, in fact rumours are now coming out that they nearly agreed for Russia to pull out of Ukraine but Ukraine would the lease Crimea to Russia.

A very sensible deal IMO. But the. Bucha happened, and Ukraine remembered it could NEVER trust Russia.

You keep harping on about these mythical reserves Russia have. They don't exist

 

[bones]

Please stop with the puppet nonsense. I think both were happy to negotiate in April, in fact rumours are now coming out that they nearly agreed for Russia to pull out of Ukraine but Ukraine would the lease Crimea to Russia.

A very sensible deal IMO. But the. Bucha happened, and Ukraine remembered it could NEVER trust Russia.

You keep harping on about these mythical reserves Russia have. They don't exist

Discussing with you is like discussing with a child.

Let me turn your words around on you. This great Ukranian counter offensive started around 10 days ago - why aren't they in Crimea yet?

The Russians are not stupid like the Ukranians or the west - they are properly training their soldiers, properly arming them, rather than picking up kids from the street and shoving them out to the front lines after 2-6 weeks of training. The Russians mobilised over 300k men last winter - every side agrees on this. We know they are there, they will be introduced if the Russians want to introduce them when they are ready to. Right now - they are doing find holding their lines.

Ukraine has no air defence - not a meaningful one anyway - what's happening to them is just crazy. There is just no way they break through.

 

[cpleigh]

10 days.... 10 days... they've taken 100km2. And they haven't even brought out their main stuff yet. Me a child? thats rich coming from someone who REFUSES to listen to anything other than Russian lies, and dimmises it as the 'MSM'

You keep saying they are open to peace and negotiations, as thats what Putin keeps saying..

So please tell me if thats what they really want, why have they decided today to lob more missiles at Kyiv when the African delgation is there on a peace mission?

 

[bones]

10 days.... 10 days... they've taken 100km2.

When will you stop with the lies? I will use a pro-Ukranian source and show you the map from June 1 and then Jun 16, today. You’ll notice other than the odd village or field the Ukranians have made no gains. But for Russia, they are happy to trade territory for lives.

https://liveuamap.com/en/time/01.06.2023
https://liveuamap.com/en/time/16.06.2023
Even a blind man can see hardly any changes in the last 10 (+6 to give you some extra leeway).

And they haven't even brought out their main stuff yet.

Is this the game changing HIMARs? Perhaps the Patriots? Or maybe you mean the Leopard Tanks. If it’s not that or the Javelins, Stingers, M1777, F16s then what is this state of the art game changing brand new kit? Why do you never address my comments and questions regarding the logistics. The Ukranians have British, American, Soviet, French, German, Norweigian, Polish and many other types of equipment, how are they going to effectively supply, maintain and repair all this hodge podge of equipment during the middle of a very bloody war?

Me a child

Yes but of course – you were the one who told us the Russians were a disorganised rabble who would run out of missiles in x, y, z weeks last year and yet here we are, they continue to launch wave after wave of attacks.

thats rich coming from someone who REFUSES to listen to anything other than Russian lies, and dimmises it as the 'MSM'

I refer to alternative sources. In fact I rarely refer to Russian sources, most of the people and sources I refer to are from the west but who have been removed from MSM for speaking the truth. If you want to listen to propaganda then by all means continue using CNN, NYT, BBC, SKY etc etc. Sky for example never ever highlight the Ukranian deficiencies – only Russian ones. Just look at their videos online. I expect the Ukranians and Russians to churn out propaganda but for the MSM? Anyone who uses MSM for their news needs guidance.

You keep saying they are open to peace and negotiations, as thats what Putin keeps saying..
So please tell me if thats what they really want, why have they decided today to lob more missiles at Kyiv when the African delgation is there on a peace mission?

The Ukranians have repeatedly been caught using various schools, hospitals and shopping centres to store ammunition, equipment or even as base camps. If the Russians are hurling these missiles and drones (which you said they ran out of in June last year) then they’ll have legitimate targets. It is the west who keeps saying “we’ll keep supporting Ukraine for as long as it takes”. Have you heard a single western leader other than Orban (who is a small fish) say it’s time for negotiations?

 

[MenInG]

Putin says Western sanctions have failed to isolate Russia

More now from Russian President Vladimir Putin.

He's been speaking about the impact of Western sanctions on his country's economy. Many Western states including the US, Canada, the UK and the EU slapped asset freezes and travel bans on Russian individuals and clamped down on trade with Russia after it invaded Ukraine.

Well, Putin has told the gathering sanctions on Russia had failed to isolate it and instead led to an "expansion" in its trade with "the markets of the future".

He praised new deals with countries in Asia, the Middle East and Latin America - calling them "reliable, responsible partners".

Calling them the "markets of the future", he took aim at Western countries, saying "neocolonial international system has ceased to exist, while the multipolar global order is on the other hand strengthening. This is an inevitable process".

 

[bones]

Cpleugh, care to elaborate on the following?

Why are no South African journalists allowed into Kyiv?
Why are the Polish security agencies messing around with the South African delegation?
Why would the South African delegation say there was no shelling during their visit?

Would it surprise you or anyone if it turns out that the Ukrainians and their western allies are once again lying?

 

[daytrader]

Ukraine war: Putin confirms first nuclear weapons moved to Belarus

Russia has already stationed a first batch of tactical nuclear weapons in Belarus, Vladimir Putin says.

Russia's president told a forum they would only be used if Russia's territory or state was threatened.

The US government says there is no indication the Kremlin plans to use nuclear weapons to attack Ukraine.

"We don't see any indications that Russia is preparing to use a nuclear weapon," US Secretary of State Antony Blinken said after Mr Putin's comments.

Belarus is a key Russian ally and served as a launchpad for Mr Putin's full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February last year.

Mr Putin said transferring the tactical nuclear warheads would be completed by the end of the summer.

Answering questions after a speech at the St Petersburg International Economic Forum, Russia's president said the move was about "containment" and to remind anyone "thinking of inflicting a strategic defeat on us".

When asked by the forum's moderator about the possibility of using those weapons, he replied: "Why should we threaten the whole world? I have already said that the use of extreme measures is possible in case there is a danger to Russian statehood."

Tactical nuclear weapons are small nuclear warheads and delivery systems intended for use on the battlefield, or for a limited strike. They are designed to destroy enemy targets in a specific area without causing widespread radioactive fallout.

The smallest tactical nuclear weapons can be one kiloton or less (producing the equivalent to a thousand tonnes of the explosive TNT). The largest ones can be as big as 100 kilotons. By comparison, the atomic bomb the US dropped on Hiroshima in 1945 was 15 kilotons.

...
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65932700

 

[cpleigh]

Cpleugh, care to elaborate on the following?

Why are no South African journalists allowed into Kyiv?
Why are the Polish security agencies messing around with the South African delegation?
Why would the South African delegation say there was no shelling during their visit?

Would it surprise you or anyone if it turns out that the Ukrainians and their western allies are once again lying?

They didn't mess them around. They didn't have the correct paperwork to carry their own guns.thats their fault.

Lying? They made up air defence launches... That all have GPS tracking and are visible to anybody... That seems far more likely than a member of BRICS whose political party have accepted huge sums of Russian money lying to protect their friend?

Delusional once again

 

[bones]

cpleigh I'm still waiting for a response from you to the post I made yesterday.

- Why do none of the maps show the Ukranians taking 100sq km in the last 10 days as you claim? Will you admit you were lying?
- Why don't you ever highlight the logistical problems with all the pick and mix of weapons and equipment sent to Ukraine?

 

[MenInG]

The war in Ukraine must end, South Africa's President Cyril Ramaphosa has told Russia's leader Vladimir Putin.

Mr Ramaphosa's remarks came as he met Mr Putin in St Petersburg on Saturday as part of a peace mission with six other African countries.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky told the delegation on Friday that he would not enter talks with Russia while they occupied Ukrainian land.

Mr Putin told the African leaders Ukraine had always refused talks.

At the meeting in St Petersburg, Mr Ramaphosa also called for both parties to return their prisoners of war, and said children removed by Russia should be returned home.

 

[the Great Khan]

Looks like the so called counter offensive is into its 13 or 14th day and hardly any real movement. A poor offensive at the moment.

 

[cpleigh]

Looks like the so called counter offensive is into its 13 or 14th day and hardly any real movement. A poor offensive at the moment.

It hasn't started yet has it? Just probing attacks to find weak points

 

[Adijazz1706]

It hasn't started yet has it? Just probing attacks to find weak points

Very unlikely that Ukraine will ever be able to properly start this till the end of the month

 

[the Great Khan]

It hasn't started yet has it? Just probing attacks to find weak points

They have said it has started but we shall see. At the moment their attacks have been quite unsuccessful and without air cover or air defence it is looking very bleak. The much vaunted western equipment as predicted hasn't been a game changer..

Most of the western media are saying the same thing. This whole counter offensive nonsense was just that. A suicidal move inmho.

 

[the Great Khan]

Very unlikely that Ukraine will ever be able to properly start this till the end of the month

By which time Russia will have built up even more defences. The AFU are losing men left right and centre. The Russians just withdraw..pound them with artillery and air power and return the next day..you can't fight modern war without any airforce and air defence..those leopards and Bradley's are sitting ducks..

How will the AFU assault a heavily defended first defence line without air cover??

 

[bones]

The Ukrainians are getting obliterated before they even reach the first line of defence. There are 3/4/5 layers of defence in some places. There is no way that Ukraine comes close to winning unless hundreds of thousands of nato soldiers are deployed on the ground and air. Even then I don’t see how these fortifications are penetrated.

 

[bones]

So many videos being released of Ukrainian units and equipment being destroyed. Nothing like it all war. The west are sending untrained soldiers to certain death .

 

[KingKhanWC]

So many videos being released of Ukrainian units and equipment being destroyed. Nothing like it all war. The west are sending untrained soldiers to certain death .

Nato proxy war is ran out of Ukrainian specialist soldiers with experience after the fall of Bakhmut. It was a genius strategy luring many in and wiping them out. Many were also taken out when Russia moved its troops in. Most of the Nazis were killed in Mariupol.

Now Ukraine is all over the place, no real strategy left, just random attacks at what they perceive to be weak points before a line of defence.

UK and US have been training around 10k, these are the last lot of soldiers with good training but their equipment not only has been destroyed but they dont have the logistics to use the equipment properly.

Yet MSM and esp the BBC are still shamelessly telling their brainwashed readers Ukraine is wining, it Wow, they took a village but wont report when its re-taken.

It sadly seems Nato/West want total destruction of Ukraine so it can be used for proxy attacks for years to come.

Russia imo must change the ruling regime now.

 

[daytrader]

Moscow launches Ukraine-wide overnight attacks
Russia launched attacks across Ukraine overnight, including on the capital Kyiv and the western city of Lviv, close to the border with Poland.

Kyiv’s military administration said Moscow had launched a drone attack in the early hours of Tuesday, warning residents to find shelter, in a post on the Telegram messaging app. There were no immediate reports of casualties.

The administration later said the city’s air defences had detected and destroyed about two-dozen Iranian-made Shahed drones in the “massive air attack”. It was the second drone attack on the city since the beginning of the month, it said.

In Lviv, a piece of “critical infrastructure” was hit and set on fire, the city’s military administration said, but there were no injuries. Earlier, the city’s mayor, Andriy Sadovy reported explosions in Lviv and the surrounding area. It was not clear if the explosions came from air defences or from missile strikes.

Air raid alerts also sounded in Zaporizhzhia, the Kyiv Independent reported, noting that the southern city has been heavily targeted by Russian artillery over the past few days.

The situation in the city was “stable” despite a “a restless and noisy night” the head of the city council, Anatoly Kurtev, later said on Telegram. No injuries were reported and there was no damage to residential buildings while all utility systems were working as normal, he said.

The Guardian

 

[MenInG]

Russian drones targeted the capital Kyiv and other cities in the early hours of Tuesday, hitting critical infrastructure in Lviv in the west, Ukrainian officials have said.

Ukraine's air force says 35 drones were launched and all but three shot down.

The attack on Lviv triggered a fire, but no-one was injured, the local authorities say.

The raid on Kyiv and a missile attack on Zaporizhzhia in the south were both described as massive.

More than 20 drones were fired at Kyiv in waves from Russian territory to the north and from the coast of the internal Sea of Azov in the south-east, according to the air force. It was the first such incident in 18 days.

In Lviv, the head of the regional authority, Maksym Kozytskyi, said a critically important target had been hit by Iranian-made Shaheed drones and fire had broken out.

"Today, about five o'clock in the morning [02:00 GMT] during an air raid alert we had three hits," he said. "Fortunately, there are no casualties."

In southern Ukraine, Zaporizhzhia was attacked by a number of Iskander-M ballistic missiles, local officials said, adding that nobody had been hurt.

Three drones were also shot down over the southern region of Mykolaiv, the governor said.

The Zaporizhzhia region is the focus of much of the Ukrainian military's current offensive to recapture territory seized by Russia at the start of its full-scale invasion in February 2022.

In his nightly TV address, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said that in some areas the military was moving forward while in others they were holding positions against Russian attack.

Deputy Defence Minister Hanna Maliar said hours earlier that Ukrainian forces had recaptured the village of Piatykhatky as they try to break through Russia's front line in the southern region. She said it was the eighth Ukrainian village to be recaptured in the past week. There has been no independent confirmation of the latest developments.

Ms Maliar said Ukraine's push had advanced some 7km (4.3 miles) in two directions in Zaporizhzhia, towards the occupied southern cities of Melitopol and Berdyansk.

The exiled mayor of Melitopol, Ivan Fedorov, said residents had seen Russian forces leave the Kherson region further west for the front line in Zaporizhzhia.

Melitopol and Berdyansk lie on a coastal route from Russia to Crimea seen as critical to the Russian military because the bridge over the Kerch Strait from Russia to occupied Crimea is largely avoided by supply lorries. A Russian MP said earlier this month that the bridge was not considered secure but the "land corridor" was operating normally.

Western intelligence officials say Russian troops have moved away from the front line in Kherson since areas around the Dnipro river were flooded after the Kakhovka dam was destroyed on 6 June.

 

[cpleigh]

So many videos being released of Ukrainian units and equipment being destroyed. Nothing like it all war. The west are sending untrained soldiers to certain death .

Lol it's the same tank over and over again. More Kremlin rubbish.

On another note... The financial times are reporting there is a secret meeting in Copenhagen next week with the following countries:
Ukraine
USA
UK
The EU
China
South Africa
Brazil
India

Is BRICS about to become BICS?...

 

[bones]

Lol it's the same tank over and over again. More Kremlin rubbish.

On another note... The financial times are reporting there is a secret meeting in Copenhagen next week with the following countries:
Ukraine
USA
UK
The EU
China
South Africa
Brazil
India

Is BRICS about to become BICS?...

Same tank? Dude you have MLRS, IFVs and AD vehicles being blown up all along points on the frontlines. The Russians are hitting the Ukrainians with their superior firepower. If you think this is propaganda then explain why Zelensky and the west keep demanding to send more and more weapons to Ukraine?

Have you got any evidence to suggest that the Ukrainians are even remotely close to reaching or breaching the first line of defence?

Care to explain why Kyiv has now declared general mobilisation?

The secret meeting is very clear to even a blind bat, the Ukrainian counter offensive has not achieved anything and won’t, they want to find an off-ramp, obviously Russia won’t have any interest why would they when they haven’t even started their own counter offensive.

 

[bones]

cpleigh I'm still waiting for a response from you to the post I made yesterday.

- Why do none of the maps show the Ukranians taking 100sq km in the last 10 days as you claim? Will you admit you were lying?
- Why don't you ever highlight the logistical problems with all the pick and mix of weapons and equipment sent to Ukraine?

Cpleigh never answers these serious questions. Always repeating Msm and Ukrainian propaganda.

 

[cpleigh]

Yeah Russian telegram channels said yesterday Ukraine had broken through the first line.

Why don't you just keep quoting Putin's fantasies? If Ukraine's offensive had failed what would be the need for India and China to meet Ukraine?

 

[bones]

Yeah Russian telegram channels said yesterday Ukraine had broken through the first line.

Why don't you just keep quoting Putin's fantasies? If Ukraine's offensive had failed what would be the need for India and China to meet Ukraine?

Lol. Russian telegram channels, do they have a red blue and white flag to prove their nationality?

Xi met with Zelensky a few months ago didn’t he? Nothing new there. As for India, let’s see shall we. As I said many times before, even with western supplies the Russians have significantly more firepower they aren’t just winning they are obliterating Ukrainian fodder.if you think the Russians are looking for a way out then you’re in Layla land. By the way where is your evidence for the ** claim the other day 100k sq km had been retaken in this counter offensive?

 

[Adijazz1706]

The counter offensive has gone even worse than most imagined even the cheerleaders in the US military have told CNN it has gone sour

https://www.cnn.com/cnn/2023/06/22/politics/ukraine-counteroffensive-western-assessment/index.html

 

[bones]

The counter offensive has gone even worse than most imagined even the cheerleaders in the US military have told CNN it has gone sour

Precisely - in order for the counter offensive to have succeeded they need air surperiority if not air supremacy. Without that you'd huge numbers and the element of surprise, the Ukranians have neither of these.

They Ukranians have done quite well given how little they have going for them, but they were never ever going to win this war, not without hundreds of thousands of NATO troops to help them out.

Ukraine fires 1 shell, the Russians fire 5,6,7,8 and sometimes more in return. Do people really think the Ukranians can win with those odds? Cpleigh actually thinks a couple dozen donated IFVs and Tanks will make up for the artillery mismatch. It's laughable.

 

[cpleigh]

"The Armed Forces of Ukraine hit only the military, and we hit them. There was nothing extraordinary until the 24th. Ukraine did not bomb Donetsk for 8 years, but only "exchanged ammunition" with the positions of the Russians." - Prigozhin

OH... but i thought 14k were murdered in Donetsk and thats why Russia invaded.

More lies being exposed now.

 

[cpleigh]

Precisely - in order for the counter offensive to have succeeded they need air surperiority if not air supremacy. Without that you'd huge numbers and the element of surprise, the Ukranians have neither of these.

They Ukranians have done quite well given how little they have going for them, but they were never ever going to win this war, not without hundreds of thousands of NATO troops to help them out.

Ukraine fires 1 shell, the Russians fire 5,6,7,8 and sometimes more in return. Do people really think the Ukranians can win with those odds? Cpleigh actually thinks a couple dozen donated IFVs and Tanks will make up for the artillery mismatch. It's laughable.

Far less laughable than your claims in this thread...

 

[bones]

Far less laughable than your claims in this thread...

Like the claim you made all of last year that the Russians were out of missiles? Or perhaps the claim that Russia was losing when they held referendums in occupied regions?

 

[cpleigh]

Like the claim you made all of last year that the Russians were out of missiles? Or perhaps the claim that Russia was losing when they held referendums in occupied regions?

It was a desperate grab at legitimising their gains. it hasn't worked either btw as only Syria and North Korea have recognized it.

Thoughts on Prigozhins comment today?

It flies in the face of all your Russian prop that you spread on here

 

[bones]

It was a desperate grab at legitimising their gains. it hasn't worked either btw as only Syria and North Korea have recognized it.

Thoughts on Prigozhins comment today?

It flies in the face of all your Russian prop that you spread on here

Most of the west still doesn't recognise Crimea as Russia - but guess what the the Russians control it. It's part of Russia now. Same applied to the Donbas and the other oblasts.

Prigozhin is a private military organisation leader - of course he's going to say what he does to try and gain more money. Do you think he utters a single word without getting the green light from Putin?

Remember when you were getting oh so giddy when Prigzhin said he was going to withdraw from Bakhmut on May 10 or was it May 16? Only then for the world to see Wagner capture the entire town a few days later and there was no withdrawal.

Care to explain why you never cover the logistics? Why are 100 IFVs which are a mix/match from the west, better than 100 IFVs from Russia/Soviet Union which Ukraine has the infrastructure for?

 

[bones]

By the way it doesn't seem desperate - they still control almost all of those regions.

 

[the Great Khan]

Just wondering why this supposed 14 day counter offensive has essentially stopped. They couldn't even get past the grey areas. Why? The Leopards were tak3n out do the AFU stopped sending them out. Why? The Bradley's have been burnt like any other vehicle without air cover..

Why has zelensky sent his people into a death trap? There is now a Russian counter offensive coming. How will they stop it? Wagner have had weeks to recuperate. So have many other units..logistics are now better than before..the Russians have wiped out three Ukrainian armies already..why isn't Nato stopping this war??

 

[cpleigh]

Wagner declares war on the Russian military...

Oh no

 

[cpleigh]

Just wondering why this supposed 14 day counter offensive has essentially stopped. They couldn't even get past the grey areas. Why? The Leopards were tak3n out do the AFU stopped sending them out. Why? The Bradley's have been burnt like any other vehicle without air cover..

Why has zelensky sent his people into a death trap? There is now a Russian counter offensive coming. How will they stop it? Wagner have had weeks to recuperate. So have many other units..logistics are now better than before..the Russians have wiped out three Ukrainian armies already..why isn't Nato stopping this war??

Russians have confirmed today they've broken through the first line of defence.

It hasn't stopped. Stop believing Kremlin rubbish

 

[KingKhanWC]

Just wondering why this supposed 14 day counter offensive has essentially stopped. They couldn't even get past the grey areas. Why? The Leopards were tak3n out do the AFU stopped sending them out. Why? The Bradley's have been burnt like any other vehicle without air cover..

Why has zelensky sent his people into a death trap? There is now a Russian counter offensive coming. How will they stop it? Wagner have had weeks to recuperate. So have many other units..logistics are now better than before..the Russians have wiped out three Ukrainian armies already..why isn't Nato stopping this war??

Because NATO wants a large serious war, nuclear if so be it. I recall you posted something a year ago, along the lines of its not my fight or no dog in this fight, which would be fair. The problem is UK is at serious risk , along with Europe and the world. Because the people who actually control western governments want this to be serious.

Which is why F16s are next, when Sleepy Joe said F16's would mean WW3 but is allowing Dutch and others to send them?

US also wants to supply cluster bombs, which are banned by most nations.

But the biggest fear/issue is the biggest nuclear plant in Europe, which I stated would be attacked months ago and it will sooner or later. Reason why US senators are now suggesting any attack on the plant by Russia will lead to Nato intervention. The Yanks will be happy for RUssia and Europe to go at it and they will then attempt some sort of peace or hopefully not worse.

 

[cpleigh]

Oh yeah... maybe put down the whiskey before typing that drivel...

Russia WILL lose. Get used to it.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Oh yeah... maybe put down the whiskey before typing that drivel...

Russia WILL lose. Get used to it.

And you want others to put down the Jameson's.

Russia will use all its nuclear Arsenal before any loss of its territory. Brits and Yanks think they are still in Iraq, a recent state terrorist attack they committed.

But please do explain in detail HOW will Russia lose? No offence Mr Leigh but you have less credibility than Zelesnky guard a kg of cocaine.

 

[cpleigh]

And you want others to put down the Jameson's.

Russia will use all its nuclear Arsenal before any loss of its territory. Brits and Yanks think they are still in Iraq, a recent state terrorist attack they committed.

But please do explain in detail HOW will Russia lose? No offence Mr Leigh but you have less credibility than Zelesnky guard a kg of cocaine.

.Russia will not use it's nuclear arsenal... Not even sure it works. Russia will be driven out of Ukraine.

It will then descend into civil war... Think it's started tonight actually.

I'll say it again .. Russia will not use it's nuclear arsenal. It's a death sentence for them. The US I'll obliterate them or they do. China will disown them, India will too.

You may mock NATO ( out of fear I suspect) but they will turn Russia into the world's biggest wildlife reserve the second Russia use a Nuke

 

[KingKhanWC]

.Russia will not use it's nuclear arsenal... Not even sure it works. Russia will be driven out of Ukraine.

It will then descend into civil war... Think it's started tonight actually.

I'll say it again .. Russia will not use it's nuclear arsenal. It's a death sentence for them. The US I'll obliterate them or they do. China will disown them, India will too.

You may mock NATO ( out of fear I suspect) but they will turn Russia into the world's biggest wildlife reserve the second Russia use a Nuke

This isnt a video game my friend, where your heros Nato always win as you have the controller.

The US and UK believe Russia's Nukes work and work well. Are they lying?

Russia has the same if not more nukes than USA. It has highly advanced nuke subs and hypersonic missiles.

You really dont understand nuclear power. Firstly Russia will deploy all its nukes in any war. You live in the UK? It will only take one missile to wipe us out? You happy to die for Nato and Nazis?

I dont fear Nato but many do as its the biggest terrorist org in modern history.

Btw did you know a high ranking Nazi officer who was with Hitler then became a high level commander of Nato? Nato are Nazis.

 

[bones]

Oh yeah... maybe put down the whiskey before typing that drivel...

Russia WILL lose. Get used to it.

Shall we just wait and see what happens? I am certain that unless massive nato forces join in, the Russians will take a lot more territory. But to be sure I will let it play out.

 

[daytrader]

Wagner chief vows to topple Russia - top brass, says fighters ‘ready to die’

The head of Russia's Wagner mercenary group has vowed to "go all the way" to topple Russia's military leadership, hours after the Kremlin accused him of "armed rebellion".

Yevgeny Prigozhin said his Wagner fighters had crossed the border from Ukraine into Russia, entering the city of Rostov-on-Don.

Mr Prigozhin said his men would destroy anyone who stood in their way.

The local governor urged citizens there to keep calm and stay indoors.

Mr Prigozhin claimed that his forces had shot down a Russian military helicopter that "opened fire on a civilian convoy". He did not give a location and the assertion could not be immediately verified.

The Wagner Group is a private army of mercenaries that has been fighting alongside the regular Russian army in Ukraine.

Tension has been growing between them over how the war has been fought, with Mr Prigozhin launching vocal criticisms of Russia's military leadership in recent months.

On Friday, the 62-year-old mercenary leader accused the military of launching a deadly missile strike on his troops and vowed to punish them. He did not provide evidence.

Authorities have denied the strike and demanded he halt his "illegal actions".

Mr Prigozhin said the "evil" in Russia's military leadership must be stopped and vowed to "march for justice".

"Those who killed our lads, and tens of thousands of lives of Russian soldiers [in the war in Ukraine] will be punished," he said in an audio message posted to the social media platform Telegram.

"I ask you not to resist. Anyone who does will be considered a threat and destroyed. That goes for any checkpoints and aviation on our way.

"Presidential power, the government, the police and Russian guard will work as usual.

"This is not a military coup, but a march of justice. Our actions do not interfere with the troops in any way."

Russia's President Vladimir Putin is receiving round-the-clock updates on the situation, his spokesman said.

Security in Moscow was stepped up on Friday night at prime locations in Moscow, including government buildings and transport facilities, Russia's state-owned news agency TASS said.

The governor of Russia's Lipetsk region is also asking residents not to travel south.

Lipetsk is around 280km (175 miles) north-east of the nearest Ukrainian border, and more than 500km north of Rostov.

Writing on Telegram, Igor Artamonov said security measures in the region are being tightened, with a particular focus on protecting critical infrastructure facilities.

In a tweet late on Friday, the Ukrainian Ministry of Defence said simply: "We are watching."

The White House said it was monitoring the situation and would consult with US allies.

Gen Sergei Surovikin, the deputy head of the Russian forces in Ukraine, whose leadership Mr Prigozhin has praised in the past, called on him to "stop the convoys and return them to their bases".

"We are of one blood, we are warriors," he said in a video. "You mustn't play into the enemy's hands at a time that is difficult for our country."

Another senior commander, Lt Gen Vladimir Alekseyev, described the Wagner chief's actions as "a stab in the back of the country and the president".

Russian state media reported that the FSB, Russia's security service, has opened a criminal case against Mr Prigozhin, accusing him of "calling for an armed rebellion" and attempting to start armed civil conflict in Russia.

The FSB also reportedly called on Wagner fighters to disobey his orders and to take steps to apprehend him.

Russia's defence ministry said in a statement that "all reports by Prigozhin spread on social media" of Russian strikes on Wagner camps were "not true and are an information provocation".

It comes after a video message in May in which Mr Prigozhin stood surrounded by the bodies of his troops and berated Russian defence minister Sergei Shoigu - as well as Chief of the General Staff Valery Gerasimov - for not providing them with enough ammunition.

On Friday, he declared that the war in Ukraine had been started "so that Shoigu could become a Marshal".

"The Ministry of Defence is trying to deceive the public, deceive the president and tell a story that there was some crazy aggression by Ukraine, that - together with the whole Nato bloc - Ukraine was planning to attack us," he said.

BBC

 

[bones]

It seems like Putin has had a word with him already and Prigozhin has toned down and done a U-turn.

 

[daytrader]

Ukraine commander says main offensive reserve yet to be sent into battle

The commander of Ukraine’s ground forces has confirmed for the first time that the main force of his offensive reserve is yet to be committed into battle with Russia, saying: “Everything is still ahead.”

In an exclusive interview from a military base in east Ukraine, Col Gen Oleksandr Syrskyi spoke of the stresses and difficulties of the fight, with Moscow launching its own offensive efforts in recent days.

He said the Russian general staff had anticipated where Ukraine’s forces were at their most dangerous but issued a warning to the Kremlin that he was hunting down the lethal weakness in their lines.

Syrskyi, who led the Ukrainian defence of Kyiv last spring and shocked the world with a counteroffensive that liberated huge swathes of north-east Ukraine in the autumn, said the world had to be patient.

“Everyone wants to achieve a great victory instantly and at once,” he said. “And so do we. But we have to be prepared to have this process take some time because there are a lot of forces massed on each side, a lot of materiel, and a lot of engineered obstacles.

“I want to say that our main force has not been engaged in fighting yet, and we are now searching, probing for weak places in the enemy defences. Everything is still ahead.”

Russia has launched offensives in multiple locations including Kupiansk in the north-eastern region of Kharkiv, and Lyman farther east.

Syrskyi, 57, said there had been “hard fighting” in the Serebryansky forest near Bakhmut in Donetsk oblast, with Russia having moved key forces from the south. “It’s difficult, stressful,” he said of the military situation in the east. “The Russians are trying to seize the initiative. So, the situation is really difficult.”

...
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-offensive-reserve-yet-to-be-sent-into-battle

 

[pakistani pride]

So whats the take on the current situation?
Wagner vs Russia?

 

[90MPH]

Maybe instead of invading other countries illegally Putin should instead focus on his own country where Wagner forces have turned on him.

This insane adventure is going bad to worse for Putin.

Let’s see how the pro war Putin propagandists handle this one, they are not coping well on twitter.

 

[pakistani pride]

Maybe instead of invading other countries illegally Putin should instead focus on his own country where Wagner forces have turned on him.

This insane adventure is going bad to worse for Putin.

Let’s see how the pro war Putin propagandists handle this one, they are not coping well on twitter.

Looking forward to the comments from our other posters on this.

 

[bones]

It's so interesting how the pro-Ukraine and pro-NATO people twist the everything. Hundreds of Ukranian IFVs, Tanks and AD systems obliterated, not one word. But the moment something Russian is destroyed it's a game changing event.

Prigozhin is the leader of a PMC, heavily linked to the Russian regime of course. He is a drama queen as we've seen numerous times during this conflict already. If there's a lesson to have been learnt - which sadly none of you have, wait a few days until after he's spoken to see what happens. He said he was withdrawing from Bakhmut before capturing it, cpleigh had a field day here about that - guess what he didn't leave, they captured the town and then withdrew and rotated with the main Russian army.

I've seen the interview translated, it's quite a long ramble. I've also seen clips from today in Rostov. There's nothing conclusive but if that's a coup detat then I'm a martian. A couple hundred soldiers and a few armored vehicles and tanks - this is bad viewing on Russia for sure. But it won't change the outcome.

My view is that Prighozin is sick of the soft approach by the main Russian army. Shoigu has huge numbers of men and equipment at his disposal but they continue with this soft approach to limit casualties.

Great distraction from he decimation of the Ukrainian troops involved in the spring offensive.

 

[cpleigh]

Maybe instead of invading other countries illegally Putin should instead focus on his own country where Wagner forces have turned on him.

This insane adventure is going bad to worse for Putin.

Let’s see how the pro war Putin propagandists handle this one, they are not coping well on twitter.

MSM lies ..

 

[bones]

I've just seen a video of Prighozin in Rostov where he says they are occupying one of the command HQs for one of the Russian armies. Seems quite clear to even a blind bat it was drama. Everywhere he goes drama follows. but MSM, social media and pro-Ukranian/Nato people buy into it.

Prighozin wants to speak to Gerasimov and Shoigu - he doesn't say why but I am 99% sure it will be the same view many Russians have had all along, stop with the soft approach and bring the main mobilised armies to the front.

 

[bones]

MSM lies ..

Is this what you're getting excited about?

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1672471542754623489

Cpleigh - do you remember when you said "Wagner are going to leave Bakhmut on May XX" because Prighozin said it.

I then said, all drama, let's wait and see what actually happens. Guess what May XX came and the Wagner forces hadn't left Bakhmut - they captured it and Prighozin was still there. Did you ever admit you were wrong? Nope.

Same with all your nonsense for months about this conflict.

 

[cpleigh]

Like I said... Dismissed it as MSM lies .
Head in sand.

For a start...bakhmut wasn't captured... And still isn't. Ukrainian troops are still in it.

Oh Putin's now envkoimg the 1917 revolution in his speech. And that this is a coup. Wagner's response 'putin has picked the wrong side. We will have a new president'

Ouch. Rumours of the Belarus gov jet doing a runner to Turkey also

 

[bones]

Like I said... Dismissed it as MSM lies .
Head in sand.

For a start...bakhmut wasn't captured... And still isn't. Ukrainian troops are still in it.

Oh Putin's now envkoimg the 1917 revolution in his speech. And that this is a coup. Wagner's response 'putin has picked the wrong side. We will have a new president'

Ouch. Rumours of the Belarus gov jet doing a runner to Turkey also

Are the Russians out of missiles yet? You said they would run out in June 2022, we're now in June 2023...

Bakhmut - this is a pro-Ukranian map. Seems pretty clear who controls the city...

https://liveuamap.com

As for the current situation in Rostov - talk about MSM making a mountain out of a molehill.

https://twitter.com/DenisRogatyuk/status/1672480678888488967

As I said, Prighozin is drama. Give it a day or two and this will all die down and then business as usual on the frontline.

I mean you have to admit - MSM has been brilliant all this conflict at hiding the Ukranian losses. Some people like you, still think Ukraine can push Russia out of Donbas and Crimea!

 

[MenInG]

Russian President Vladimir Putin has accused the leader of the Wagner mercenary group of treason and leading an "armed mutiny".

Condemning the actions of one-time ally Yevgeny Prigozhin, who is leading a rebellion to oust Russia's defence minister, he branded them a "stab in the back" to the country's soldiers and people.

The Russian leader had previously tolerated the rantings and threats made by the man nicknamed "Putin's chef" because catering businesses he owned provided food to the Kremlin, but his patience has finally run out over the current civil unrest.

The confrontation "represents the most significant challenge to the Russian state in recent times," according to the UK's Ministry of Defence.

In some of the latest developments:

Security forces were seen at Wagner's headquarters in St Petersburg as a criminal investigation was opened.
Ramzan Kadyrov, the leader of Chechen forces, said his troops are en route to crush the rebellion.
The British foreign office warned of "further unrest" across Russia.

SKY

 

[mazkhan]

Shall we just wait and see what happens? I am certain that unless massive nato forces join in, the Russians will take a lot more territory. But to be sure I will let it play out.

There's civil war

Wagner have captured rostov

Its an internal implosion

The Russian General surovkin is clearly drunk in the video .


Kkwc , great khan bones

It's only a matter of time the country implodes in various warring factions and ethnic groups
Wait till the caucausus gangs get in the act when the whole state apparatus begins to unravel if the wagner mutiny is not put down .

Afghan war and chernobyl led to the soviet collapse

This ukraine disaster will lead to collapse of modern russia

 

[90MPH]

Wagner took 9 months to capture Bakhmut and 3 hours to capture Rostov.

No wonder Putin is panicking.

 

[cpleigh]

It seems like Putin has had a word with him already and Prigozhin has toned down and done a U-turn.

You truly have bizarre takes on anything Russian. Putin's had a word?

They've literally just declared war on each other

 

[mazkhan]

Are the Russians out of missiles yet? You said they would run out in June 2022, we're now in June 2023...

Bakhmut - this is a pro-Ukranian map. Seems pretty clear who controls the city...

https://liveuamap.com

As for the current situation in Rostov - talk about MSM making a mountain out of a molehill.

https://twitter.com/DenisRogatyuk/status/1672480678888488967

As I said, Prighozin is drama. Give it a day or two and this will all die down and then business as usual on the frontline.

I mean you have to admit - MSM has been brilliant all this conflict at hiding the Ukranian losses. Some people like you, still think Ukraine can push Russia out of Donbas and Crimea!

Mate wakeup the whole situation is crap hitting the fan

They are literally turning on themselves

 

[DeadlyVenom]

It seems like Putin has had a word with him already and Prigozhin has toned down and done a U-turn.

Come on man this is an outrageous take on this news

 

[mazkhan]

Convicts and jailbirds have started attacking the regular military and state
Shot down a helicopter