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West Indies v Pakistan | 2nd Test | Bridgetown, Barbados | Apr 30-May 4, 2017 | Day 1

MMHS said:
I forgot to mention Yasir as well - he Test debuted at official 28/29 with 270+ FC wickets at ~25 after 14 !!!!!!!!! years of FC debut (debuted at 14 :() - that too, because of Ajmal's ban, he got his chance against AUS in OCT 2014.
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The whole selection process is farce , when Inzamam , yousuf and younis were there , they did not let any young talent come in . How can you get in batsmen if you do not give proper chances ? Asif zakir was taken to WI , but did not get even a game , if he was not good enough why select him in first place .
 
That will do wonders for the youngster

Its that man at slip again.

Pak will miss his slip catches just as much as his runs..
 
6NfiwvP.gif
 
On_the_up said:
A googly to Holder now would be interesting
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Keep bowling leggies, everyone has been talking about Shadab's googly so Holder will have it in the back of his mind. Bowl leg-break after leg-break for a couple of overs and then slip the googly in, the batsman will probably think "Hang on, is this a googly" for a couple of those leg-breaks and make a mistake because they're so worried about it.
 
Pakistan should go on full attack here , they need to stop the lower order from playing cameos.
 
Yuni can catch better with bare hands than Kami can do with gloves.
 
This is the only 3rd u20 Pak player to debut since 2010 ,,it shows how visionary misbah is.
 
DRsohail said:
This is the only 3rd u20 Pak player to debut since 2010 ,,it shows how visionary misbah is.
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And how does that compare to other countries?

In that same time span England have debuted how many teenagers. Haseeb Hameed and...?
 
Comparison with eng is useless here Knowing the standard of their first class and ours...We have to develop players in international set up and have been doing it for decades...
 
Love Bishop's honesty, I agree with him on Blackwood.

Lot of WI fans are kicking off about his exclusion but they're not leaving some worldbeater out of the XI.
 
Seriously, Who is the designated care taker of ball in Pakistan XI.

Apparently Abbas has a large stain of managing the ball.

Do we have a player designated to take care of ball ?
 
Big Mac said:
And how does that compare to other countries?

In that same time span England have debuted how many teenagers. Haseeb Hameed and...?
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Don't look it that way, because of the "official" age factor - look at how many players are debuted by ECB or CA within first 5 years of their FC Debut, or even 3 years, compared to PCB, who runs the state of the art FC system of theirs.

For PAK, comparison is scary these days - that "official" age factor was always there, hence PAK has debuted almost 75% of U19 cricketers between 1952 to 2000. These days, PCB is debuting players officially 25-33, which is mind blowing.

Average age of the team in last UK Tour was almost 31, officially - biologically, if you take the last batch of AUS cricketers that retired & make an XI on their retirement age, it'll be younger than PAK team that played the Lord's Test - factor this with that AUS cricketers being supremely fit; you'll find why PAK pacers look like part-timers in their 3rd spell of the day.
 
DRsohail said:
Comparison with eng is useless here Knowing the standard of their first class and ours...We have to develop players in international set up and have been doing it for decades...
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Younis Khan didn't make his debut until he was 23/25 (depending on whether you believe the birth certificate).
Misbah didn't become an international regular until his thirties.
Yasir Shah played a couple of international games at 25 years old then didn't play again until he was 28 and really established himself as an international bowler.
Azhar Ali made his test debut at 25.
Shafiq was 24.
Safraz debuted at 19, played a few ODIs and then got dropped before becoming a test regular at 25 years old.

Go back a bit further, MoYo was 24, Azhar Mahmood was 22, Shoaib was 23, Asif was 23, Ajmal was 30/31.

How many teenagers have we developed in international cricket in the last 15-20 years?

Amir is one. Popeye and Kaneria debuted a few weeks shy of their 20th birthday. Who else debuted as a teenager and became an important test player?
 
MMHS said:
Don't look it that way, because of the "official" age factor - look at how many players are debuted by ECB or CA within first 5 years of their FC Debut, or even 3 years, compared to PCB, who runs the state of the art FC system of theirs.

For PAK, comparison is scary these days - that "official" age factor was always there, hence PAK has debuted almost 75% of U19 cricketers between 1952 to 2000. These days, PCB is debuting players officially 25-33, which is mind blowing.

Average age of the team in last UK Tour was almost 31, officially - biologically, if you take the last batch of AUS cricketers that retired & make an XI on their retirement age, it'll be younger than PAK team that played the Lord's Test - factor this with that AUS cricketers being supremely fit; you'll find why PAK pacers look like part-timers in their 3rd spell of the day.
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Lol that last paragraph made me laugh
 
Hasan123 said:
Lol that last paragraph made me laugh
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MU, MCity & Arsenal lost points today - probably now Liverpool will make the top 4. Coming to the last para - look what Amir has bowled on his return spell ........ and he'll have to bowl 5 overs in last spell with 2nd ball, if WI carries on .
 
MMHS said:
MU, MCity & Arsenal lost points today - probably now Liverpool will make the top 4. Coming to the last para - look what Amir has bowled on his return spell ........ and he'll have to bowl 5 overs in last spell with 2nd ball, if WI carries on .
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Top 4 will remain how it is till the end of the season.

I don't know why his fitness isn't upto scratch. I thought he was quite fit. Wahab doesn't burn out as quickly as this .
 
Big Mac said:
Younis Khan didn't make his debut until he was 23/25 (depending on whether you believe the birth certificate).
Misbah didn't become an international regular until his thirties.
Yasir Shah played a couple of international games at 25 years old then didn't play again until he was 28 and really established himself as an international bowler.
Azhar Ali made his test debut at 25.
Shafiq was 24.
Safraz debuted at 19, played a few ODIs and then got dropped before becoming a test regular at 25 years old.

Go back a bit further, MoYo was 24, Azhar Mahmood was 22, Shoaib was 23, Asif was 23, Ajmal was 30/31.

How many teenagers have we developed in international cricket in the last 15-20 years?

Amir is one. Popeye and Kaneria debuted a few weeks shy of their 20th birthday. Who else debuted as a teenager and became an important test player?
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Take it back to 90s or2003..U will get ur answer....2003 onwards till 2007 was inzi time so obviously not much to to tell
 
If Yasir is still struggling with his back after this game, I wouldn't risk him in the 3rd test.
 
DRsohail said:
Take it back to 90s or2003..U will get ur answer....2003 onwards till 2007 was inzi time so obviously not much to to tell
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No, you made the claim so onus is on you to provide facts to support it.

How many players, since 1990, made their debut for Pakistan as a teenager and went on to become a test match regular?

Inzi debuted at 21 or so, so did Saeed Anwar.
 
Big Mac said:
The problem with Pakistani first class stats is the conditions are weighted heavily in favour of seam bowlers, it's why expansive stroke players rarely top the averages ahead of accumulators and it's why medium pace trundlers always top the list of leading wicket takers.

You need to be able to separate the numbers from whether the bowler is international standard.

I don't think I've seen Sadaf bowl so I'm not saying whether he is or isn't good enough but you can't look at the numbers and assume he's good enough for test cricket.
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He is: Tall.... accurate.... swings the ball back in... seams both ways.... 125-130 kph. If Abbas can succeed, so can Sadaf...
 
DRsohail said:
Take it back to 90s or2003..U will get ur answer....2003 onwards till 2007 was inzi time so obviously not much to to tell
Click to expand...

Actually 2000 - Wasim was the last visionary Captain, Waquar as well when it comes to youngsters, but his other tools were not sharp. In this regard (bringing youngsters), Inzi is probably the worst in the history of the game among Captains with 25+ Tests - under him 3 players debuted in 4 years, one at 19 :( (Riaz Afridi), one at 21 (Asif) & one at 27-28 (Rehman). This is in in the period PAK won 2 U19 WCs. Befittingly he is the CS now..............

I actually give Misbah lot of credit in this regard - areas I can point finger is because of the type of player he is, NOT for ill intention. He is a PAK Batsman - Captain groomed entirely in PAK domestics, hence he has very little clue of handling fast/swing bowlers, therefore he is comfortable with aged fast bowlers, who doesn't need much guidance during match. 2nd one is his batting style - he batted his entire career with one philosophy & that's reflected in his choice/backing of batsmen - Umar, Sharjeel, Maqsood .... vs Azhar, Asad, Shan. As a person, I found him limited, but not bad at heart, neither mean or selfish - he just carried too long for few months.
 
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I don't see the harm in giving a couple of overs to Babar or Asad just to try something different.
 
Very similar to how the first test panned out.

Need to bat long in the 1st inns and get a decent lead.
 
On_the_up said:
Very similar to how the first test panned out.

Need to bat long in the 1st inns and get a decent lead.
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Are we all going to moan about the run rate when we try to bat long and get a big lead?
 
Big Mac said:
Are we all going to moan about the run rate when we try to bat long and get a big lead?
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surely not. otherwise it would be easy to differentiate the real minnows.
 
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Pitch has flattened out, 2nd and 3rd day could be the best for batting.

Desperately need another wkt before the close.
 
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