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Would you swap Imran Khan for Sachin Tendulkar?

Electron said:
It is a known fact that everything about Imran's captaincy is hugely exaggerated by Pakistanis. That guy almost lost them the WC with his selfish batting. It was only bcz of an out of form Inzi's unexpected magic inning that Imran could save his face.

If it wasn't for Inzi, Imran's legacy would be " The guy who played a selfish WC knock".

Everone knows that bro. But what is the point of talking about all this on a Pakistani forum? You are never going to change people's opinion. So don't waste your energy.
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It is a team sport. Great Khan kept playing Inzi when he was not performing earlier in the tournament so give credit to IK for keeping faith on the big guy.
 
Romali_rotti said:
Ok before I give it a rest now I am curious how 10x inferior Kapil Dev wouldve done as captain in overseas can you post those stats..
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My post was about the whole package. Wasn't a direct captaincy comparison.

Imran was an ATG bowler. Kapil was not.

Imran indeed has achieved more in his career. Way more than Kapil.

Dunno how to get Kapil as captain stats only as India had several captains....

Stats of India in 80s outside India.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...team=6;template=results;type=team;view=series

Kapil too won a series in England. Woohoo. :)

But when you take WL records, its kinda really bad.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
10X is obviously figure of speech.

Still Kapil cannot be compared to Imran as an allrounder. Yes, both are ATG allrounders but on a level comparison, Imran towers above Kapil.
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‘Imran towers above Kapil’ is a lot of exaggeration.Infact if we deeply analyse their records we can see that they are on the same level.
Imran being an ‘ATG FAST bowler’ is not that relevant when the criteria is w.r.t who was the better all rounder.Here I feel ‘who was better in their weaker discipline’ has to get more credit.
Kapil was the better test batsman convincingly.His str: rate was a huge 80.91 which puts even Viv into shades(Viv only had 69.28).At the end of 87 tests Kapil’s str: rate stood at around 84.and they contributed almost equal runs/inns.Kapil has the better batting record vs WI in WI.He has 2 run a ball +98 scores in WI.Imran never had to face the 2nd best bowling attack of their times(Pak line up headed by Imran himself who avg:ed around 15 for 5 or 6 straight years for what ever reasons.Other bowlers
Included 2Ws,Sarfraz,Qadir,Qasim).Also if we go thru their big scores , we can see that Kapil’s big scores on the avg: were of much better quality than Imran’s.All these combined,Kapil was the better test batsman.

Kapil’s test bowling figures has to be evaluated based on the fact that he played in a weak bowling unit and had non stop cricket thru out his career.More over his figures are in 131 tests compared to Imran’s 88.So the gap is not that big as against general assumption.
Kapil was the better batsman and slightly better bowler in one dayers. He was the leading all rounder in 83 and 92 world cups.
Kapil was ahead convincingly in all round fielding, the next physically involved discipline.
‘Imran being the better captain’ is ok. But we have to remember that Imran possessed a very strong bowling attack.Also his much spoken about battles vs WI were also abled by the fact that Windies was in a trasition period in addtion to ‘PAK matched WI man for man in bowling’ (If we go thru the score card of those matches we can understand this)More over Kapil too was brilliant captain in his own right.
His 83 world cup victory,86 ENG series victory,86 AUS drawn series, 83 2-0 loss series to WI all are proof of this.Kapil was the premier allrounder in both AUS and WI series.All this , he achieved with much weaker over all bowling unit at his disposal.So Imran was only slightly better in captaincy.
So, when all these taken in to account , Kapil was on a par with Imran for me.So you statement seems a bit over the board for me.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
My post was about the whole package. Wasn't a direct captaincy comparison.

Imran was an ATG bowler. Kapil was not.

Imran indeed has achieved more in his career. Way more than Kapil.

Dunno how to get Kapil as captain stats only as India had several captains....

Stats of India in 80s outside India.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...team=6;template=results;type=team;view=series

Kapil too won a series in England. Woohoo. :)

But when you take WL records, its kinda really bad.
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So out of 11 series, Kapil captained India to 1 series win, 6 loses and 4 draws. I recall India drawing a series vs Australia in early 80's not sure if Dev was the captain but anyway back to the topic so as per the stats you put up Imran is not 10x better, for a moment you had me believe this crap lol :))
 
Let me make it simple, IK is second to none, and had he been an Indian he would have been made the god bless by the Indians. SRat would have been less than IK
 
Cricket-passion said:
Let me make it simple, IK is second to none, and had he been an Indian he would have been made the god bless by the Indians. SRat would have been less than IK
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No need to generalize Indians. Because there are a lot of Indians who now a days believe that Imran's record has been hugely boosted by ball tampering.the root for this assumption was infact started by Imran himself by his self confession. later Aamir Sohail,Sarfraz Nawaz,Shahbaz Sharif & Rameez Raja confirmed this belief thru various statements at frequent intervals.So why this generalization?
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Abe Genius.

Tendulkar does not owe it to his country to do anything extra.

He gave his best in the field and that's the most you can ask for a sportsman.

What he does next is HIS FREAKING CHOICE.

Imran is doing more so kudos to him.

We are talking about them as players and not as people who gave more to the society.

Just because people don't respond to your dumb illogical comments doesn't mean you are spouting some jaw dropping knowledge.

Now go and ahead and waste someone else's time.
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Just a game and he did it for himself... Nothing to be proud of.

So many indians love him, I would be seriously ashamed if I were in his place... I guess some people are more selfish than others....

Everyone knows all Tendu cares about is his reputation.... Never says anything controversial.... Never does anything good if it means getting criticized... That's also why Tendulkar was a bad captain... He has a compulsive need to be liked.... While Imran places his ideas above all else, no matter who he hurts....

Tendulkar may be a good cricket but he is a pathetic human being.... Just look at all those BMWs while hundreds of millions of the people who love him more than they love their parents are dying of hunger.... How can he be loved more than great men like Gandhi and Ranjeet?
 
JoniInsafian said:
Just a game and he did it for himself... Nothing to be proud of.

So many indians love him, I would be seriously ashamed if I were in his place... I guess some people are more selfish than others....

Everyone knows all Tendu cares about is his reputation.... Never says anything controversial.... Never does anything good if it means getting criticized... That's also why Tendulkar was a bad captain... He has a compulsive need to be liked.... While Imran places his ideas above all else, no matter who he hurts....

Tendulkar may be a good cricket but he is a pathetic human being.... Just look at all those BMWs while hundreds of millions of the people who love him more than they love their parents are dying of hunger.... How can he be loved more than great men like Gandhi and Ranjeet?
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As a sportsman, he did it for himself but he gave it his best which is what his country expects him to do.

Everyone doesn't aspire to be a man who wants to change the nation.

Kudos to those who do.

That doesn't mean those who don't are selfish. Its their life.
 
JoniInsafian said:
Just a game and he did it for himself... Nothing to be proud of.

So many indians love him, I would be seriously ashamed if I were in his place... I guess some people are more selfish than others....

Everyone knows all Tendu cares about is his reputation.... Never says anything controversial.... Never does anything good if it means getting criticized... That's also why Tendulkar was a bad captain... He has a compulsive need to be liked.... While Imran places his ideas above all else, no matter who he hurts....

Tendulkar may be a good cricket but he is a pathetic human being.... Just look at all those BMWs while hundreds of millions of the people who love him more than they love their parents are dying of hunger.... How can he be loved more than great men like Gandhi and Ranjeet?
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Sorry, but this type of dramey baazi fits into Time Pass section. We are here in Cricket section to discuss cricketing matters... Not about Tendulkar's life style or Imran's affair with Sita White. So, chill out, and discuss cricket matters, we don't know their personal lives enough to comment on them and also this is a cricketing section, so let's stick to it.
 
Ok guys.... You're right.... We are in cricket section and, even if Tendulkar is a bad person outside cricket, this is not the place to talk about it.... He was a great cricketer so he was great in context of this discussion...... Sorry if I hurt anybody by talking of him outside cricket....
 
In my opinion Imran Khan was much better than Sachin Tendulkar as a cricketer.

To the excitable Indian fans I concede that Sachin was the better batsman(not by much) but Imran was the better cricketer.

Sachin is a legend and rightly so but his importance has been bolstered by hysterical Indians.

Had Pakistan played India from 1990 to 1995 he would have been butchered by Waqar. Waqar would have eaten Sachin all by himself. The Indians very carefully stopped matches with Pakistan during this period when Waqar and Wasim were running riot.

Imran was a leader. Sachin wasn't. Imran inspired his team, so did Sachin but I always felt Sachin inspired Sachin(himself) more than Sachin inspired India. Think about that for a second, intelligent posters will know what I mean.

Imran's bowling was more impactful than Sachin's batting.

To sum it up Imran Khan is the greatest cricketer to come out of Asia. Not Sachin.

This thread is open for healthy debate.
 
Warrior said:
To the excitable Indian fans I concede that Sachin was the better batsman(not by much) but Imran was the better cricketer.

Sachin is a legend and rightly so but his importance has been bolstered by hysterical Indians.

Had Pakistan played India from 1990 to 1995 he would have been butchered by Waqar. Waqar would have eaten Sachin all by himself. The Indians very carefully stopped matches with Pakistan during this period when Waqar and Wasim were running riot.

Imran was a leader. Sachin wasn't. Imran inspired his team, so did Sachin but I always felt Sachin inspired Sachin(himself) more than Sachin inspired India. Think about that for a second, intelligent posters will know what I mean.

Imran's bowling was more impactful than Sachin's batting.

To sum it up Imran Khan is the greatest cricketer to come out of Asia. Not Sachin.

This thread is open for healthy debate.
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Yeah, sure. :))
 
Need to make the thread more subtle for it to be effective.

Your first line shouldn't give it away like this:

Sachin was the better batsman(not by much) but Imran was the better cricketer.
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sensible-indian-fan said:
Need to make the thread more subtle for it to be effective.

Your first line shouldn't give it away like this:
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The OP needs to take a crash course on internet trolling. The first line truly gave it away, even if one tried to give the thread a chance by looking at the title.
 
[MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION] [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] [MENTION=65183]freelance_cricketer[/MENTION]
[MENTION=134473]Haroon786[/MENTION] [MENTION=129948]Bilal7[/MENTION] [MENTION=135445]Strike Rate[/MENTION]

Let the war begin:akhtar
 
Hitman said:
Let's have a look at this, a list made by 25 legends of the game. Sachin found a place ahead of Imran back in 2001, at a time when Sachin was just half way through his career, while Imran finished his career :)) -

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...ends-of-Cricket-Top-25-Cricketers-Of-All-Time

Enjoy it, and enjoy even more trying to cook up some of your conspiracy theories ....
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lol forget Imran..even :afridi was better match winner for his country than Tendulker. Sachin was a legend as a batsman no doubt an all time great but not a true match winner.
 
Yeah, this thread proves that World Cups are over for Pak fans. Now come to their natural self.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Need to make the thread more subtle for it to be effective.

Your first line shouldn't give it away like this:
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Yeah... He sure did. Imran was a decent bat but not a world beater by any means.
Imran was obviously a better leader.

If the argument is about Batting, Sachin is better than Imran
If it was about leadership and achievements, Dhoni is on par or better than Imran. He over achieved in LOIs. It is was tests, it's Imran
If it was about bowling, Wasim is ahead
If it was about an all rounder, Imran is the best followed by Kapil.
 
rhony said:
Yeah... He sure did. Imran was a decent bat but not a world beater by any means.
Imran was obviously a better leader.

If the argument is about Batting, Sachin is better than Imran
If it was about leadership and achievements, Dhoni is on par or better than Imran. He over achieved in LOIs. It is was tests, it's Imran
If it was about bowling, Wasim is ahead
If it was about an all rounder, Imran is the best followed by Kapil.
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If it was about inspirational leadership, it has to be Rantunga followed closely by Imran. Ranatunga took a bunch of minnows to a World championship where as Imran had a killer team that underperformed initially but played to their potential during the final stages on 92 WC
 
As cricketers, absolutely not though I'd be more than happy to hand over today's Imran Khan for Tendulkar. Will be a good tradeoff for Pakistan to lose the public face of mullahism and gain a decent cricket coach.

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
 
Warrior said:
To the excitable Indian fans I concede that Sachin was the better batsman(not by much) but Imran was the better cricketer.

Sachin is a legend and rightly so but his importance has been bolstered by hysterical Indians.

Had Pakistan played India from 1990 to 1995 he would have been butchered by Waqar. Waqar would have eaten Sachin all by himself. The Indians very carefully stopped matches with Pakistan during this period when Waqar and Wasim were running riot.

Imran was a leader. Sachin wasn't. Imran inspired his team, so did Sachin but I always felt Sachin inspired Sachin(himself) more than Sachin inspired India. Think about that for a second, intelligent posters will know what I mean.

Imran's bowling was more impactful than Sachin's batting.

To sum it up Imran Khan is the greatest cricketer to come out of Asia. Not Sachin.

This thread is open for healthy debate.
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In my opinion this thread has been created 1100 times already so there is no need for another one.
 
DW44 said:
As cricketers, absolutely not though I'd be more than happy to hand over today's Imran Khan for Tendulkar. Will be a good tradeoff for Pakistan to lose the public face of mullahism and gain a decent cricket coach.

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
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it's not easy to do politics in KPK. He can't go complete liberal if he wants safety of his party members. He is clever. he mixes liberalism with Islamism to keep both happy.
 
MRSN said:
it's not easy to do politics in KPK. He can't go complete liberal if he wants safety of his party members. He is clever. he mixes liberalism with Islamism to keep both happy.
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I'm from KPK, I know exactly how politics are done there and he was on the extremist bandwagon well before his party was elected in KPK, even when he had his sights set on federal government. His extremism is not out of political pragmatism, it's ideological. Also, there's no mixture of liberalism and Islamism, its purely the latter.

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
 
Only a fool would take Sachin Tendulker over Imran Khan. The impact Imran has had on Pakistan's bowling is huge, without him, it is likely that Wasim and Waqar wouldn't have become the bowlers they did.

He was also the chief, human architect behind our WC win and our slug-fest in the test arena against the best team of all time.

Sachin Tendulker was a great batsman, arguably the greatest ever but Imran was a great player, arguably the GOAT.

Compare Sachin to Wasim and that would be much fairer for the little master. Wasim is to bowling what Sachin is to batting. Imran though, was on a different level to both, as a cricket player.
 
Allrounders always have a greater impact, so it is an unfair comparison.

I would take Kallis over Wasim and Waqar, but thats simply because he was an allrounder.
 
Bilal7 said:
Only a fool would take Sachin Tendulker over Imran Khan. The impact Imran has had on Pakistan's bowling is huge, without him, it is likely that Wasim and Waqar wouldn't have become the bowlers they did.

He was also the chief, human architect behind our WC win and our slug-fest in the test arena against the best team of all time.

Sachin Tendulker was a great batsman, arguably the greatest ever but Imran was a great player, arguably the GOAT.

Compare Sachin to Wasim and that would be much fairer for the little master. Wasim is to bowling what Sachin is to batting. Imran though, was on a different level to both, as a cricket player.
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This is a logic only used by Pak fans. By this argument, only all rounders can be considered for the title of the GOAT (which is such a weird logic really) and even by that logic, Gary Sobers will be the GOAT.

I'm not sure too many Australian and English fans would consider Imran or Sobers (he has a case though) the Greatest cricketer ever ahead of Bradman.
 
Bilal7 said:
Only a fool would take Sachin Tendulker over Imran Khan. The impact Imran has had on Pakistan's bowling is huge, without him, it is likely that Wasim and Waqar wouldn't have become the bowlers they did.

He was also the chief, human architect behind our WC win and our slug-fest in the test arena against the best team of all time.

Sachin Tendulker was a great batsman, arguably the greatest ever but Imran was a great player, arguably the GOAT.

Compare Sachin to Wasim and that would be much fairer for the little master. Wasim is to bowling what Sachin is to batting. Imran though, was on a different level to both, as a cricket player.
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Depends on how terrible your batting line up is. I m sure current Pakistani team would happily swap Imran for Tendulkar.
 
This shouldn't even be a debate.

Imrans all round qualities including his legacy are 10 times better.
 
street cricketer said:
This is a logic only used by Pak fans. By this argument, only all rounders can be considered for the title of the GOAT (which is such a weird logic really) and even by that logic, Gary Sobers will be the GOAT.

I'm not sure too many Australian and English fans would consider Imran or Sobers (he has a case though) the Greatest cricketer ever ahead of Bradman.
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Bradman was an exception for obvious reasons. There is nothing weird about being a great all-round player rather than being great for half of the match and doing nothing in the other half.

Why are you so desperate to overrate Sachin? He's no Bradman so cannot compete with the likes of Imran and Sobers, he's the batting version of Wasim Akram, which itself puts him ahead of 99.9% of cricketers.
 
Yep...now it finally looks like WC over for Pakistan. When there is no cricket...discuss Imran Khan's greatness :D

Sorry guys we have a very important game coming up tomorrow, so not in a mood to defend Sachin in these baseless debates.
 
LastManstanding said:
Depends on how terrible your batting line up is. I m sure current Pakistani team would happily swap Imran for Tendulkar.
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Not a chance. Umar Akmal, Babar, Irfan, Riaz, etc will all be better players with Imran captaining them. Then you also get an ATG pacer with the greatest peak of all time and a batsman who can be very handy down the order.
 
Indian_Supporter said:
Yep...now it finally looks like WC over for Pakistan. When there is no cricket...discuss Imran Khan's greatness :D

Sorry guys we have a very important game coming up tomorrow, so not in a mood to defend Sachin in these baseless debates.
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See you here tomorrow then.
 
Bilal7 said:
Bradman was an exception for obvious reasons. There is nothing weird about being a great all-round player rather than being great for half of the match and doing nothing in the other half.

Why are you so desperate to overrate Sachin? He's no Bradman so cannot compete with the likes of Imran and Sobers, he's the batting version of Wasim Akram, which itself puts him ahead of 99.9% of cricketers.
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I'm not overrating Sachin and neither I'm underrating Imran. I don't think Sachin is GOAT.

But the logic of only ARs can be considered for the title of the GOAT is something I find really weird. It's like saying only midfielders can be considered for the title of the Greatest footballer ever because they can both attack as well as drop to defence when needed.
 
street cricketer said:
I'm not overrating Sachin and neither I'm underrating Imran. I don't think Sachin is GOAT.

But the logic of only ARs can be considered for the title of the GOAT is something I find really weird. It's like saying only midfielders can be considered for the title of the Greatest footballer ever because they can both attack as well as drop to defence when needed.
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All soccer players play the full game so they can make an impact at any time. Someone like Sachin would be twiddling his thumbs for half the match and cannot make an impact in the opposition's batting innings at all. Neither is he head and shoulders above all other batsmen like Bradman is.
 
Bilal7 said:
Not a chance. Umar Akmal, Babar, Irfan, Riaz, etc will all be better players with Imran captaining them. Then you also get an ATG pacer with the greatest peak of all time and a batsman who can be very handy down the order.
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Wasim and waqar were ATG bowlers. May be imran had a role in their development but what makes you think he will have the same impact on Wahab and Irfan? They already have a great bowler like Waqar in the dressing room and still they are abysmal.

Haven't seen Babar so can't comment on him but Umar Akmal is a leg side hack. If none of the batting coaches till now could improve his batting I doubt imran could do better.
 
Glorifying past legends is the only think Pakistanis can do now, because we have nothing to look forward to in the future.

Such a pity.
 
One inspired millions of Batsman to be like him and probably the reason we have kohlis and rahanes while other identified/plucked talented bowlers/batsman who became great.

I would much rather have sachin than Imran in this batting dominating era.
 
Bilal7 said:
All soccer players play the full game so they can make an impact at any time. Someone like Sachin would be twiddling his thumbs for half the match and cannot make an impact in the opposition's batting innings at all. Neither is he head and shoulders above all other batsmen like Bradman is.
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How often do you see Messi dropping down to defence and making an "impact" there even if he plays the entire 90 minutes.
 
LastManstanding said:
Wasim and waqar were ATG bowlers. May be imran had a role in their development but what makes you think he will have the same impact on Wahab and Irfan? They already have a great bowler like Waqar in the dressing room and still they are abysmal.

Haven't seen Babar so can't comment on him but Umar Akmal is a leg side hack. If none of the batting coaches till now could improve his batting I doubt imran could do better.
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Imran did pretty well with Inzi who as a youngster, was similar to Akmal. He also got a lot out of mediocre players like Rameez. Imran was a miles better captain than Waqar and he might not make any ATGs but he is the sort of captain who makes his players punch above their weight.
 
street cricketer said:
How often do you see Messi dropping down to defence and making an "impact" there even if he plays the entire 90 minutes.
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The point is contribute in more ways than one. Why are we even conparing these two sports? They are totally different.
 
Mamoon said:
Glorifying past legends is the only think Pakistanis can do now, because we have nothing to look forward to in the future.

Such a pity.
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Much better than wrist-slitting and whining about everything.
 
Indian_Supporter said:
Yep...now it finally looks like WC over for Pakistan. When there is no cricket...discuss Imran Khan's greatness :D

Sorry guys we have a very important game coming up tomorrow, so not in a mood to defend Sachin in these baseless debates.
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no worries mate you will also be interested in praising sachin on same post after tomorrow's result.

Sent from my Mi 4i using Tapatalk
 
Just imagine Sachin had Imran's looks of 80s and persona.
He would be a global sports icon like Beckham and the most marketable sportsman ever.
 
Bilal7 said:
The point is contribute in more ways than one. Why are we even conparing these two sports? They are totally different.
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I disagree. Otherwise all teams would be stuffing their team full of all rounders, since they have the most chances of contributing to a win.

We all saw how well Pakistan did in this world cup with its ARs Afridi and Imad. I'm pretty sure Asghar would've won more matches for Pakistan than the two even if he had less ways of contributing than the former two.
 
street cricketer said:
[MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION] [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] [MENTION=65183]freelance_cricketer[/MENTION]

[MENTION=134473]Haroon786[/MENTION] [MENTION=129948]Bilal7[/MENTION] [MENTION=135445]Strike Rate[/MENTION]

Let the war begin:akhtar
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:)) thanks you forgot [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] and [MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION] :D

Swap Tendulkar? :)) Sorry No but I wont Swap the great man with even Bradman.

Anil Kumble once said that he was worried Tendulkar would take his spot in ODI's as he could bowl 10 overs of decent spin. (He has even won matches with his bowling).

Anyhow we have had our own great AR in Kapil whose exploits against the 2 best teams of his time Aus and WI is as good as Imrans and he Won the WorldCup pretty convincingly without any help from Weather and results going in his favor and leading from the front.
 
Nahh SRT cannot be swapped for anyone let alone Imran. We had Kapil Dev who was 70 percent as good as Imran so we already had a taste of what it is like to have an Imran like player, but SRT is once in a lifetime player and there will never be another one... So sorry NO SWAP!!!!!!!
 
Romali_rotti said:
Nahh SRT cannot be swapped for anyone let alone Imran. We had Kapil Dev who was 70 percent as good as Imran so we already had a taste of what it is like to have an Imran like player, but SRT is once in a lifetime player and there will never be another one... So sorry NO SWAP!!!!!!!
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I would say 85 %
 
Lol i would not even exchange Harbhajan Singh for Imran Khan.400+ wkts with 2 centuries in tests and 300 wkts in ODIs and T20s.Also helped India win 2 WCs whereas Imran won one which was also a fluke.
 
Sachin took India cricket altogether to a different level. Within a year from his debut, every Indian parents wanted their son to be Sachin. Lots of kids and youngsters took cricket seriously, Yuvraj/ Kohli are just one of them.
 
GrandMaster said:
Sachin took India cricket altogether to a different level. Within a year from his debut, every Indian parents wanted their son to be Sachin. Lots of kids and youngsters took cricket seriously, Yuvraj/ Kohli are just one of them.
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Even Sehwag and Dhoni
 
IMO Imran in an ATG but not GOAT level.

Players like Sachin comes in GOAT list. He is 2nd best in ODIs to have ever played cricket after Viv Richards and 2nd best in tests after Don Bradman. No one comes near him.
 
Ankit007 said:
IMO Imran in an ATG but not GOAT level.

Players like Sachin comes in GOAT list. He is 2nd best in ODIs to have ever played cricket after Viv Richards and 2nd best in tests after Don Bradman. No one comes near him.
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Hahaha what?

After Garry sobers he is arguably the greatest all rounder ever

And yea Kapil dev isn't close to him in tests no matter how much Indians try to bring him in the debate. Whenever anyone apart from Indian talks about great all rounders you hear about Sobers, Botham, Hadlee and Imran. Heck even Keith Miller gets a mention before dev
 
Indian fans and it seems Kapil Dev himself have a severe inferiority complex with regards to Imran

Dev even mentioned once about Imrans Oxford education and his own inability to speak fluent English ag start of his captaincy as a swipe at Imran . Shows his little man mentality.
 
As far as topic is concerned if I have a strong team then Imran and if it's a weak team then Sachin

However Imran also gives a great leadership option so you have to look at the whole package...
 
Slog said:
Hahaha what?

After Garry sobers he is arguably the greatest all rounder ever

And yea Kapil dev isn't close to him in tests no matter how much Indians try to bring him in the debate. Whenever anyone apart from Indian talks about great all rounders you hear about Sobers, Botham, Hadlee and Imran. Heck even Keith Miller gets a mention before dev
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First of all I didnt talk about Kapil Dev, you are bringing him into debate to prove your point stronger.

Imran and Kapil both are ATG. Both were great all rounders. But just All time greats. Not the greatest of all times.

Kallis and gary sobers are ahead of him. And not much seperates Imran and Kapil
 
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Slog said:
And yea Kapil dev isn't close to him in tests no matter how much Indians try to bring him in the debate.
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Yeah you sure about that ? vs the best side of their era

DEV:

v West Indies 25 1079 126* 30.82 3 89 9/83 24.89 4 17 0 5.92

IMRAN:

v West Indies 18 775 123 27.67 1 80 7/80 21.18 6 4 0

It all comes down to what you did against the best and Imran is a measley 3 run avg better than DEV in bowling, comparison is more than close it is almost the same............
 
Slog said:
Indian fans and it seems Kapil Dev himself have a severe inferiority complex with regards to Imran

Dev even mentioned once about Imrans Oxford education and his own inability to speak fluent English ag start of his captaincy as a swipe at Imran . Shows his little man mentality.
Click to expand...

When did this happen?

And how is that a swipe and showing little man mentality..
 
srh said:
If there was no Imran Khan then there was no Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis and co.
Click to expand...

I highly doubt that, Wasim and Inzi were always going to make it eventually, they were just far too talented not to dominate domestic cricket. And if I remember correctly it was Miandad and not Imran who spotted Akram.
 
As far as who would you rather have, I would say Tendulkar since Pakistan has on most occasions lacked behind in batting. It takes a very special mind to make a great batsmen, it doesn't take as much mentally to be a top notch fast bowler, it is more about natural ability and Pakistan has had an abundance of that.

As long as the cricketing infrastructure in the country is weak, you can still keep producing very good bowlers but it is much harder to find top class batsmen.
 
Both Sachin and Imran are among the top ten greatest cricketers of all time.Imran was the second greatest AR ever behind Garry Sobers while Sachin is up there alongside Viv, Sobers and only behind Bradman as the greatest batsmen of all time. It all sums up to the team you play for. Imran was also a great leader too.
 
Ankit007 said:
First of all I didnt talk about Kapil Dev, you are bringing him into debate to prove your point stronger.

Imran and Kapil both are ATG. Both were great all rounders. But just All time greats. Not the greatest of all times.

Kallis and gary sobers are ahead of him. And not much seperates Imran and Kapil
Click to expand...
You are allowed to live in delusion that not much seperates Imran and Kapil. Unfortunately most of the world outside India only talks about botham, Hadlee and Imran as the great all rounders of that era
 
Ab Fan said:
Both Sachin and Imran are among the top ten greatest cricketers of all time.Imran was the second greatest AR ever behind Garry Sobers while Sachin is up there alongside Viv, Sobers and only behind Bradman as the greatest batsmen of all time. It all sums up to the team you play for. Imran was also a great leader too.
Click to expand...

Good post
 
Romali_rotti said:
Yeah you sure about that ? vs the best side of their era

DEV:

v West Indies 25 1079 126* 30.82 3 89 9/83 24.89 4 17 0 5.92

IMRAN:

v West Indies 18 775 123 27.67 1 80 7/80 21.18 6 4 0

It all comes down to what you did against the best and Imran is a measley 3 run avg better than DEV in bowling, comparison is more than close it is almost the same............
Click to expand...

Wasim raja has a superior record to both against that West Indies side.

So he is better than both. What stupid logic

No one is denying that Dev was a great player. So Ofcourse he has decent stats. But he was well behind Imran and even stats show that whether you take overall or team by team comparison

Id entertain you by comparing them against each other with various conditions put but it's not worth the effort of getting rid of the delusion
 
Slog said:
You are allowed to live in delusion that not much seperates Imran and Kapil. Unfortunately most of the world outside India only talks about botham, Hadlee and Imran as the great all rounders of that era
Click to expand...

Relax man, Imran is better than DEV no one is going to question that.... However stats vs the best side of their era they are neck and neck so Imran dont have that big of a performance gap over DEV.. There is a reason why not many rates Botham highly, his avg vs the WI sucks bowling and batting, it all comes down to what you do against the best forget the rest......................
 
Romali_rotti said:
Relax man, Imran is better than DEV no one is going to question that.... However stats vs the best side of their era they are neck and neck so Imran dont have that big of a performance gap over DEV.. There is a reason why not many rates Botham highly, his avg vs the WI sucks bowling and batting, it all comes down to what you do against the best forget the rest......................
Click to expand...

Ok sorry for the misunderstanding but ou have to look at overall records first and then give more weightage to opposition strength, conditions etc to seperate players
 
Slog said:
Ok sorry for the misunderstanding but ou have to look at overall records first and then give more weightage to opposition strength, conditions etc to seperate players
Click to expand...

Anyway lets not derail this thread, my point on why I wouldn't swap Imran for SRT was because, DEV already gave us a taste of Imran (again not saying Dev was better than Imran), however no one in the past or present or if ever may be able to replicate SRT hence I wouldnt do the trade....
 
street cricketer said:
I disagree. Otherwise all teams would be stuffing their team full of all rounders, since they have the most chances of contributing to a win.

We all saw how well Pakistan did in this world cup with its ARs Afridi and Imad. I'm pretty sure Asghar would've won more matches for Pakistan than the two even if he had less ways of contributing than the former two.
Click to expand...

The trick is to have quality all-rounders and not mediocre ones. Think Imran, Sobers, Miller, Kallis and Gilchrist.

Romali_rotti said:
Anyway lets not derail this thread, my point on why I wouldn't swap Imran for SRT was because, DEV already gave us a taste of Imran (again not saying Dev was better than Imran), however no one in the past or present or if ever may be able to replicate SRT hence I wouldnt do the trade....
Click to expand...

Inzi was to Sachin what Kapil was to Imran. Then we also had Miandad who was an ATG batsman, whereas India has never had a great fast bowler even in the collective dreams of it's population.

Your reasoning is flawed.
 
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