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Asia Cup 2023: Super 4: Pakistan vs India | 10-11 September | Colombo | India innings

Per weather.com, continuous rain all throughout the day today and tomorrow:).
 
181 off 20 overs with this batting line up is not easy at all. Imam, Agha, Faheem are three duds with the bat.
 
shobiii said:
This guy again! Last time he spewed the same garbage India got wiped out of the WC. Also, talk about blind bias - anyone watching the game can see Naseem bowled really well and even dominated Rohit at times. Key difference here is we dropped 2 chances (Yes Gil first ball was a chance) and the slip comedy was something else...game is not over yet homie. Don't put india on a pedestal.

We got a solid team. Fans need to stick it out. Yes - it's ok to criticize the team but being needlessly negative all the time is counter productive. India came with a plan to attack gun bowlers and credit to them they have batted well. Had we taken those two chances things might have tilted our way - but that's what you get with Pakistan. Anyone who follows cricket knows you only judge a game after both teams have batted. On current roster India will NOT pound Pakistan 8/10. It would be a coin toss on who plays better on the day. Wake up homie! Also - like last time. This will be my last response to your garbage @Mamoon
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Actually my apologies in case you are like 12 or something. All good then.
 
5.30pm Most of the covers are still on. The rain seems to have stopped, though, and the groundstaff seem to be clearing water off the covers at one end of the ground.
 
shobiii said:
Actually my apologies in case you are like 12 or something. All good then.
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What a reply from Shoabi…Good on you for showing some fans cricket is about going through emotions. Pakistan and this team has something special in them, they wont let india win easily.
 
What happens if Pakistan gets the reduced target of 181 off 20 overs but then rain intervenes again and there is no cricket possible today.

Does that mean they come back tomorrow and still try to chase the same target on 20 overs?
 
Mamoon said:
Full strength India would still pound full strength Pakistan 8/10 times. All this ranking and best bowling this and that means nothing.
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if so why havent they pounded Pakistan in the last few outings we have had since the last 2 years?
 
NeVerMind said:
What happens if Pakistan gets the reduced target of 181 off 20 overs but then rain intervenes again and there is no cricket possible today.

Does that mean they come back tomorrow and still try to chase the same target on 20 overs?
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We do coin toss to decide the winner :)
 
Mamoon…I bet mamoon has never even played hard ball cricket. He forgot that India is still a superior team and Pakistan has done alot of catching up.
 
Markhor said:
Most bowlers in world cricket look average when the ball doesn't swing.

Shaheen's problem is when the ball actually swings - he sometimes overattacks and lacks the patience to just hit a consistent channel.

That's the effect of playing too much T20 when you're trying to bowl six different balls an over.
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Well said.

Shaheen is not only our best bowler our best player by some distance.

As expected, @shariqnoor doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
 
I hope its not t20. Imam isn't a t20 player, so wonder where he'll slot in. And 181 is not an easy score to chase. I'd rather have the game moved tmr, it also gives us a chance cause kholi and Rahul will need to readjust and our bowlers get to readjust as well, meaning we can restrict India to that 260 score again.
 
mominsaigol said:
I hope its not t20. Imam isn't a t20 player, so wonder where he'll slot in. And 181 is not an easy score to chase. I'd rather have the game moved tmr, it also gives us a chance cause kholi and Rahul will need to readjust and our bowlers get to readjust as well, meaning we can restrict India to that 260 score again.
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If it’s t20 we just go with our t20 line up and stick Imam down at 6/7 or not bat at all. I think we’d actually stand a better chance in 20 overs. Imam is already not going to necessarily be great chasing 300 plus scores anyway if run rate is too high. Though we would probably just go with the same odi line up. But even then I think we stand a better chance.
 
topspin said:
Well said.

Shaheen is not only our best bowler our best player by some distance.

As expected, @shariqnoor doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
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I've been saying this time and time again. Shaheen isn't our best bowler. Naseem is. In the NZ series where everyone was getting tonked, naseem was the only one onsong. Even today he was unlucky, he should have gotten gill's wicket early on.

Shaheen has a great inswing, and is a decent Death bowler, and Rauf Is good in the middle overs.

Naseem however is pur best bowler with accurate line and length, I'm telling you Glenn mcgrath in the making. Although I will say this, Shaheen and Rauf are likely to be more impactful on their day with more 5 wicket hauls, because they look for genuine wickets and while they can get tonked, they will perform on occasions and get wickets, naseem relies on perfect line and length and eventually the batsmen gets out. But naseem with economy and wicket taking ability > Shaheen and Rauf.
 
ads101 said:
If it’s t20 we just go with our t20 line up and stick Imam down at 6/7 or not bat at all. I think we’d actually stand a better chance in 20 overs. Imam is already not going to necessarily be great chasing 300 plus scores anyway if run rate is too high.
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Imam has chased scores with babar 300 more times then pakistan ever chased in history.

Imam is good at anchoring and getting you close. But he does require babar, fakhar or rizwan to hold his hand.
 
Pakistan need Mohammed Asif here. Who talk to them about how to set field and how to bowl in 50 overs match. He was a genuis and we need to hire him, who ever think morkel is the bowling coach is wrong.
 
shariqnoor said:
I don't get the obsession over Shaheen. He's a very average bowler when the ball doesn't swing. He's just hyped because he gets wicket in his first over because of the ball swinging. Doesn't have any bowling IQ when the ball goes gun barrel straight.
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Misbah also said the same during the 2019 WC before he was made to eat his words.

This is what happens when you see cricket through his lens.

You have to be deluded to come up with this.
 
lahoriyah1234 said:
Pakistan need Mohammed Asif here. Who talk to them about how to set field and how to bowl in 50 overs match. He was a genuis and we need to hire him, who ever think morkel is the bowling coach is wrong.
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Morkel is a good bowling coach though. Shaheen and Rauf not doing well today doesn't mean anything. A player can't perform every match. And Rauf still got the wicket.

Rauf, naseem and shaheen are genuine wicket takers and are needed. We need to get rid of shadab, Faheem and these bits and pieces spinners however. Waseem should be playing in place of faheem and shadab needs to be removed, Management should just focus on abrar and also help him learn slogging and batting skills since in test he ironically isn't that bat in batting, he's able to tonk and hit a few boundaries here and their and shows more intent them shadab.
 
Markhor said:
Most bowlers in world cricket look average when the ball doesn't swing.

Shaheen's problem is when the ball actually swings - he sometimes overattacks and lacks the patience to just hit a consistent channel.

That's the effect of playing too much T20 when you're trying to bowl six different balls an over.
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Cummins, Boult, Bumrah, Hazlewood don't lose the plot and get attacked mercilessly when the conditions don't favour them. Shaheen invariably does. He's still a long way from being a great bowler.
 
Everyone here needs to calm down, our bowling trio isn't bad, Wasim and waqar have also gotten tonked and had bad games.

Haris still got you the wicket, naseem was onsomg and should have gotten gill's wicket.

Shaheen while poor today isn't a bad bowler and is very good with the new ball, he's attacking and will win games. A few bad performances here and their doesn't matter, these guys are Human, not gods, even murli, Shane Warne and these chads have had awful games. So relax.

Our problem is spin and faheem lol. Not our main bowling trio. As well as a weak middle order. And worries about fakhar.
 
shariqnoor said:
Cummins, Boult, Bumrah, Hazlewood don't lose the plot and get attacked mercilessly when the conditions don't favour them. Shaheen invariably does. He's still a long way from being a great bowler.
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They do. But none of them match Shaheen's magic. I can give you multiple examples of every single one of them. It's just your confirmation bias at play here.
 
topspin said:
Misbah also said the same during the 2019 WC before he was made to eat his words.

This is what happens when you see cricket through his lens.

You have to be deluded to come up with this.
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Wow. You can't seem to get Misbah out of your head. Incredible obsession. Puts Bieber fans to shame.
 
shariqnoor said:
Cummins, Boult, Bumrah, Hazlewood don't lose the plot and get attacked mercilessly when the conditions don't favour them. Shaheen invariably does. He's still a long way from being a great bowler.
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Yes they do, I can name countless games where they've gotten thrashed just like shaheen today.

Again this forumn over analyses pakistan but conveniently ignores all the times when other bowlers and ATG performed poorly.

Their humans, cricket is a sport where its impossible to score and be economical and take wickets every game and be perfect at the game unless your Sir Donald freaking Bradman.

Shaheen, Rauf and naseem are great. Their not the issue, shadab, Faheem and our spin department in general is.
 
Major said:
rain has stopped. outfield is wet
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17:55 Local Time, 12:25 GMT, 17:55 IST: There is some activity on the ground. The staff are removing the top layer of the cover which means the rain must have reduced or stopped. There's still a lot of cleaning to be done and that would take some time. Many more covers being peeled off which a positive sign.
 
Marooned said:
They do. I can give you multiple examples of every single one of them. It's just your confirmation bias at play here.
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lol, we love to over analyze our bowlers because we watch them play with full attention. WHen it comes to other teams we dont concentrate on them.

We fans expect that we should be getting India 20/3 in every first powerplay. India is also a good team and not some minnow. Shaheen got dominated today, and thats fair enough. Doesnt make Shaheen bad.

You are right that every bowler gets attacked, doesnt mean they are terrible.
 
More of the covers are coming off now. The rain seems to have stopped completely.
 
Major said:
lol, we love to over analyze our bowlers because we watch them play with full attention. WHen it comes to other teams we dont concentrate on them.

We fans expect that we should be getting India 20/3 in every first powerplay. India is also a good team and not some minnow. Shaheen got dominated today, and thats fair enough. Doesnt make Shaheen bad.

You are right that every bowler gets attacked, doesnt mean they are terrible.
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He didnt got dominated, he bowled really badly. leg side boundaries are just pies to any batsman.
 
Major said:
lol, we love to over analyze our bowlers because we watch them play with full attention. WHen it comes to other teams we dont concentrate on them.

We fans expect that we should be getting India 20/3 in every first powerplay. India is also a good team and not some minnow. Shaheen got dominated today, and thats fair enough. Doesnt make Shaheen bad.

You are right that every bowler gets attacked, doesnt mean they are terrible.
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This forumn over analyses every pakistani player in general minus a few horrible players like azam Khan or asif Ali where all is forgiven with one good innings but consistent players are bashed at every turn.

Like rn, Virat kholi somewhat slowed down the innings with 8 of 16, and got India from rr 7 to rr 6, but our fans won't bat an eyelash to kholi. However if babar did this, everyone would attack him relentlessly. It doesn't mean virat or babar are bad players if they kill the tempo a few times 😂😂. Same with our bowlers.
 
tauseef_mahmood said:
He didnt got dominated, he bowled really badly. leg side boundaries are just pies to any batsman.
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Alot of bowlers from other sides bowl badly hence they get dominated at times. Doesnt mean their bad bowlers. All the bowlers you've mentioned have been horrible at times and been taken to the cleaners.

Its about consistency, shaheen performs every 7 to 8 games out of 10, same with the other bowlers you mentioned. Don't over analyse. Teams won't always let you get then 20/3, nor will our bowlers always be able to get those perfect line and length deliveries every game. No team in history have been able to do that.

Only player who's ever come close to being perfect was Donald Bradman and he's a mystery due to having zero footage and playing in an era completly unfamiliar to all of us.
 
Marooned said:
They do. But none of them match Shaheen's magic. I can give you multiple examples of every single one of them. It's just your confirmation bias at play here.
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Not that I remember of any since the last world cup. Please remind me.
 
We are starting soon great job by kohli and Rahul for bring the RR from 7.5 to 6.3
 
mominsaigol said:
This forumn over analyses every pakistani player in general minus a few horrible players like azam Khan or asif Ali where all is forgiven with one good innings but consistent players are bashed at every turn.

Like rn, Virat kholi somewhat slowed down the innings with 8 of 16, and got India from rr 7 to rr 6, but our fans won't bat an eyelash to kholi. However if babar did this, everyone would attack him relentlessly. It doesn't mean virat or babar are bad players if they kill the tempo a few times 😂😂. Same with our bowlers.
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exactly. As soon as shaheen got hit for runs, the comments about him being bad started to come in
 
mominsaigol said:
Morkel is a good bowling coach though. Shaheen and Rauf not doing well today doesn't mean anything. A player can't perform every match. And Rauf still got the wicket.

Rauf, naseem and shaheen are genuine wicket takers and are needed. We need to get rid of shadab, Faheem and these bits and pieces spinners however. Waseem should be playing in place of faheem and shadab needs to be removed, Management should just focus on abrar and also help him learn slogging and batting skills since in test he ironically isn't that bat in batting, he's able to tonk and hit a few boundaries here and their and shows more intent them shadab.
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I would play Shadab as a batter instead of Salman agha and drop him. Bring Usama mir. Fahim Ashraf is fine but wasim can play instead of Rauf and Shaheen if needed.
 
mominsaigol said:
Yes they do, I can name countless games where they've gotten thrashed just like shaheen today.

Again this forumn over analyses pakistan but conveniently ignores all the times when other bowlers and ATG performed poorly.

Their humans, cricket is a sport where its impossible to score and be economical and take wickets every game and be perfect at the game unless your Sir Donald freaking Bradman.

Shaheen, Rauf and naseem are great. Their not the issue, shadab, Faheem and our spin department in general is.
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I don't have a problem with our bowling trio. They are the best Pakistan has to offer and should be backed. However Shaheen is put on a pedestal which he's not deserving of, atleast yet.
 
Major said:
exactly. As soon as shaheen got hit for runs, the comments about him being bad started to come in
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I've maintained my position on Shaheen since long. He's a terrible old ball and death bowler. And he's not improved.
 
shariqnoor said:
I don't have a problem with our bowling trio. They are the best Pakistan has to offer and should be backed. However Shaheen is put on a pedestal which he's not deserving of, atleast yet.
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That part I agree with. I've advocated time and time again that shaheen is neither better then naseem or Rauf. Nor is he the best middle overs or death bowlers. He's good but not better then stark, Hazelwood etc, I agree.

But if anyone uses this game to state that shaheen is poor then I can highlight games where Hazelwood the supposed no 1 bowler in the world has been poor. Making an analogy like pur forumn makes is silly. But pure analyses shows shaheen is ironically the weakest of pur 3 trio with naseem as the strongest.
 
Shaheen getting smacked here isn't the problem. Anybody can get hit, especially against the class of Rohit and Gill. It's the lack of bowling intelligence that's worrying. Naseem schooled Shaheen today.
 
shariqnoor said:
I want to know the opinions of Indian fans here.

The openers give a 7.5 run rate start. A couple of wickets go down and Kohli/Rahul slows the entire batting down to 6 RPO. How is that acceptable for a batting lineup of India's caliber.

I can understand a team like SL, Pakistan, WI preserving wickets because of the lack of batting depth but India?
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Likes of England and Australia will eat our non existent batting alive. Kohli is so selfish to shoot another of our LoI trophy campaign down. Rahul has always been pathetic, today is nothing new.
 
shariqnoor said:
Shaheen getting smacked here isn't the problem. Anybody can get hit, especially against the class of Rohit and Gill. It's the lack of bowling intelligence that's worrying. Naseem schooled Shaheen today.
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M. Amir is the answer, can he replace faheem ashraf.
 
Pakistan bowlers have now bowled around 70 overs so far to Indian batters this tournament and have not faced a single delivery. It feels like Jay Shah's master plan was to get some much needed practice against Pak bowlers prior to the world cup :srini
 
Rajdeep said:
Pakistan bowlers have now bowled around 70 overs so far to Indian batters this tournament and have not faced a single delivery. It feels like Jay Shah's master plan was to get some much needed practice against Pak bowlers prior to the world cup :srini
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Yeah, funny as it might be so true.
 
lahoriyah1234 said:
I would play Shadab as a batter instead of Salman agha and drop him. Bring Usama mir. Fahim Ashraf is fine but wasim can play instead of Rauf and Shaheen if needed.
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My problem with Pakistan is that we have genuine middle order batsmen and lower order batsmen sitting in our squad.

And we have a genuine pacer like waseem + one extra spin option with usama sitting.

But we opt for bits and pieces players instead. Agha is bits and pieces, Chacha is bits and pieces and so is shadab. Bits and pieces players can be useful but not when you're playing 3 of them in useful middle order positions.

Saud and tayyab are genuine no 4 and no 5, Theirs only room for 2 bits and pieces, I don't see why we're keeping 5 of them. Faheem, Shadab, Chacha, Nawaz, Agha like bro, just shadab and chacha are enough lol or nawaz vs shadab depending on who bowls better and can be a better assesst. Infact imad waseem should be here in place of these 2 lol, he's a genuine allrounder, not a bits and pieces player.
 
Rajdeep said:
Pakistan bowlers have now bowled around 70 overs so far to Indian batters this tournament and have not faced a single delivery. It feels like Jay Shah's master plan was to get some much needed practice against Pak bowlers prior to the world cup :srini
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Lol, isn't it the practice to Pak bowlers also ? like bowling 70+ overs to top quality players like Rohit and Kohli.
 
mominsaigol said:
My problem with Pakistan is that we have genuine middle order batsmen and lower order batsmen sitting in our squad.

And we have a genuine pacer like waseem + one extra spin option with usama sitting.

But we opt for bits and pieces players instead. Agha is bits and pieces, Chacha is bits and pieces and so is shadab. Bits and pieces players can be useful but not when you're playing 3 of them in useful middle order positions.

Saud and tayyab are genuine no 4 and no 5, Theirs only room for 2 bits and pieces, I don't see why we're keeping 5 of them. Faheem, Shadab, Chacha, Nawaz, Agha like bro, just shadab and chacha are enough lol or nawaz vs shadab depending on who bowls better and can be a better assesst. Infact imad waseem should be here in place of these 2 lol, he's a genuine allrounder, not a bits and pieces player.
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not shahdab ... come one. he has come a long way.
 
Rajdeep said:
Pakistan bowlers have now bowled around 70 overs so far to Indian batters this tournament and have not faced a single delivery. It feels like Jay Shah's master plan was to get some much needed practice against Pak bowlers prior to the world cup :srini
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Ye but the Indian batters couldn't play full 50 overs vs pakistani bowlers that it's self is high level bezati 😆
 
mominsaigol said:
My problem with Pakistan is that we have genuine middle order batsmen and lower order batsmen sitting in our squad.

And we have a genuine pacer like waseem + one extra spin option with usama sitting.

But we opt for bits and pieces players instead. Agha is bits and pieces, Chacha is bits and pieces and so is shadab. Bits and pieces players can be useful but not when you're playing 3 of them in useful middle order positions.

Saud and tayyab are genuine no 4 and no 5, Theirs only room for 2 bits and pieces, I don't see why we're keeping 5 of them. Faheem, Shadab, Chacha, Nawaz, Agha like bro, just shadab and chacha are enough lol or nawaz vs shadab depending on who bowls better and can be a better assesst. Infact imad waseem should be here in place of these 2 lol, he's a genuine allrounder, not a bits and pieces player.
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Chacha bit and pieces is a bit hash? He has played well recently, hasn't he? The others I agree
 
Hope the match is called off today and we continue again tomorrow. A shortened game today will favour Pakistan
 
Game should be shortened now. Overs started to be lost from 9:52 AM EST (source: Cricinfo).
 
Asad T said:
Chacha bit and pieces is a bit hash? He has played well recently, hasn't he? The others I agree
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He has, but I don't feel he's a genuine finisher, he's someone who can be slotted anywhere and can be asked to bowl anywhere, also bits and pieces players aren't a bad thing. Their a good thing, alot of teams have bits and pieces players like contribute and genuinely win you games.

Problem isn't with Pakistan playing bits and pieces, it's the fact that most teams tend to play 1 or 2 bits and pieces only, aka players they can slot anywhere to get you good vital runs and bowl a few overs that may slow down the run rate or pick up few wickets.

Pakistan however are playing way way way too many bits and pieces players, especially when they have the option of genuine middle order batsmen (Saud and tayyab), genuine finishers ( Haris) and genuine pacers ( Waseem) in the squad.
 
mominsaigol said:
He has, but I don't feel he's a genuine finisher, he's someone who can be slotted anywhere and can be asked to bowl anywhere, also bits and pieces players aren't a bad thing. Their a good thing, alot of teams have bits and pieces players like contribute and genuinely win you games.

Problem isn't with Pakistan playing bits and pieces, it's the fact that most teams tend to play 1 or 2 bits and pieces only, aka players they can slot anywhere to get you good vital runs and bowl a few overs that may slow down the run rate or pick up few wickets.

Pakistan however are playing way way way too many bits and pieces players, especially when they have the option of genuine middle order batsmen (Saud and tayyab), genuine finishers ( Haris) and genuine pacers ( Waseem) in the squad.
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Agree mostly. Wasim is a question mark. His radar goes missing at times. He is a better attacking bowling option than Faheem, but a riskier one.
 
CricVet said:
Agree mostly. Wasim is a question mark. His radar goes missing at times. He is a better attacking bowling option than Faheem, but a riskier one.
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He isn't really riskier, because even at his worst he won't get beaten by sena teams. Faheem is going to get smashed by sena even at his best.
 
Let me see how do we avoid situations like these, well if this game was being played in Pakistan like it should have then there would be no rain, but let’s pick Sri Lanka during the rainy season!
 
CricVet said:
Then you need to check Faheem's economic stats.
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His stats in international are horrible economy wise. He bowls the exact same line and length at those 128 to 135 kph speeds. He's getting tonked by sena

Theirs a difference between with what naseem does and what faheem does. Faheem bowls slow amd the exact same delivery usually with hardly any variation.

Naseem bowls perfect line and length but varies it up, he bowls short, cramps batsmen for room, bowls a perfect putswinger angled in at the good length delivery etc.

Waseem is basic, he's just fast, also I don't want waseem, it's just waseem is > Faheem. I want ihsanullah or zaman Khan lol.
 
Movement from the groundstaff. The rain has stopped but the main effort is trying to dry the covers and outfield.

 
I think shortened game is bad for Pakistan because they have a few accumulators.

There is no Nawaz in this game.
 
If it is 35 over game, Pakistan need take wickets quickly to reduce the DLS revised target. If they don't they may have to chase around 250+ in 30-32 overs.
 
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