What's new

England pre-1968 Test XI v post-1968 England Test XI - Who will win?

Harsh Thakor

First Class Star
Joined
Oct 1, 2012
Runs
3,519
Post of the Week
2
Fascinating that England is a nation who had several all time greats before the war and the subsequent period but significantly declined after the 1970's.Man -to-man the players before 1968 were stronger .

Pre-1968 English xi

Len Hutton
Jack Hobbs
Walter Hammond
Denis Compton
Peter May
Frank Woolley
Godfrey Evans
Harold Larwood
Fred Trueman
Jim Laker
Sydney Barnes


Post-1968 xi

Geoff Boycott
Graham Gooch
David Gower
Kevin Pieterson
Robin Smith
Alec Stewart
Ian Botham
Andrew Flintoff
Derek Underwood
John Snow
Bob Willis


In terms of talent the pre-1968 xi was overwhelmingly superior.It posessed legends like Hobbs,Hutton,Hammond and Compton who could be classed with Tendulkar or Viv Richards.Hammond took batting domination to regions rarely traversed,Compton took wizardry to the height of divinty.Hutton took technical mastery to its highest zenith while Hobbs was in the all-round sense the best batsmen ever.Sydney Barnes in terms of statistics wa sthe best ever bolwer being more daunting than anyone on as tickler while Trueman and Larwood were in the Marshall-Wasim class.-,capable of unleashing devastating pace.Frank Wooleey was great all-rounder and left -hand batsmen in hiso wn right.


However the post-1968 xi had more professionalism with players who could adapt better to the modern game.In Botham and Flintoff they had 2 all-rounders who could turn a game in a whirlwind fashion from the deepest depths of despair.Botham could often play the role of a one -man army making the impact of a Hercules with bat and ball.Pieterson was one of the most destructive middle order batsmen of all time particularly against pace bowling.David Gower on his day could take batting to regions of the sublime ,matching strides with any batting great.Bob Willis was ferocious with the new ball and often an epitome of grit.John Snow had great variety and control matching strides with Lillee and Andy Roberts in his time.On bad wicket Underwood was as lethal as any spinner.Alec Stewart was the ultimate man for a crisis and would keep the wickets.Gooch and Boycot comprised the ideal pair.Boycott was the fulcrum,Gooch was the executioner.Gooch could tear an attack to the shreds ,Boycott could wear it down like boulder withstanding a gale.Robin Smith was master against lightning pace.

I back the pre-1968 to win but not by a very big margin.Say around 50 runs or 3 wickets.It is something unique as perhaps no nation's pre-1968 xi could beat it's post 68 xi.It tells us something about the evolution of English test cricket.
 
erm...no Jimmy? Swann was possibly better than Underwood, Cook should be in there instead of Boycott and Robin Smith....what? Where is Joe Root?
 
erm...no Jimmy? Swann was possibly better than Underwood, Cook should be in there instead of Boycott and Robin Smith....what? Where is Joe Root?
@ Robert [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] @ MMHS [MENTION=139595]Ab Fan[/MENTION] please participate here
 
@ Robert [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] @ MMHS [MENTION=139595]Ab Fan[/MENTION] please participate here

I'll drop Peter May from pre 1968 team and play Herbert Sutcliffe at 3 - and drop Frank Woolley for WG Grace (W Rhodes also misses out). Hammond bowled great seemers, therefore you can think of Verity as 12th man just in case. Between Barnes & Alec Bedsar, I'll definitely take Bedsar - take out 84 wickets at <10 in 7 Tests against SAF of their early days, Barnes' figures are 104 wickets in 20 Tests against AUS at 21 - bang average for the then cricket; even George Lohman or Richardson makes a much better case.

So my team - Hobbs, Hutton, Suttcliffe, Hammond*, Compton, WG, Evans, Larwood, Trueman, Laker, Bedsar. 12th man Verity.


For the team of last 50 years, no way Smith makes the XI - I'll pick one of Root, Amiss or Thorpe. Technically, Cook should open instead of Boyce as Boycott debuted before 1968, but I keep him. And, Anderson definitely makes it ahead of Flintoff. If 2 all-rounders are to play, I'll drop Bob Willis for Jimmy. Underwood was a bit unconventional spinner - I keep Swan as 12th man just in case, if 2 spinners are required.

So my team,

Boycott, GG*, Gower, Root, KP, Stewart, ITB, Dudley, Willis, Snow, Anderson. 12th - Swan.

Not even a contest in a time ZERO world, it's not even fair - Pre 1968 era should win 6-0, batting 8 or maximum 9 times.

This is one reason, British media glorifies their past (pre WW2 era) so much, because from last 50 years, apart from ITB, I doubt how many cricketers will make all time ENG 30 men A & B squad. Their cricket supremacy ended like their global geo-political dominance with WW2.

I haven't considered KS Ranji, Bill Voce, Brian Statham, Wardle, Blythe, Peel, Les Ames, Barrington, Cowdrey, Graveney, Patsey Hendren, Leyland, Dexter, Jardin, CB Fry, Washbrooke, Hardstaff, Paynter, FS Jackson, E Tyldesley, M Tate, AP Freeman, T Bailey, GR Lock, Briggs, Tyson ....... in past teams, and these are just random names came to mind.

But, the game has obviously changed in last 50 years, therefore it's unfair to compare such.
 
Last edited:
Time to get your popcorn out whist we anticipate the arrival of the old era hype brigade to bring us the finest wisdom you'll find on PakPassion.
[MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION] [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] please make your way to the stage...
 
Of course pre 1968 team would win. Is this even a question? You had guys bowling 170 kph and spinners like Laker who could turn it on glass or even water.
 
Fascinating that England is a nation who had several all time greats before the war and the subsequent period but significantly declined after the 1970's.Man -to-man the players before 1968 were stronger .

Pre-1968 English xi

Len Hutton
Jack Hobbs
Walter Hammond
Denis Compton
Peter May
Frank Woolley
Godfrey Evans
Harold Larwood
Fred Trueman
Jim Laker
Sydney Barnes


Post-1968 xi

Geoff Boycott
Graham Gooch
David Gower
Kevin Pieterson
Robin Smith
Alec Stewart
Ian Botham
Andrew Flintoff
Derek Underwood
John Snow
Bob Willis

Barrington in for Smith, push Gower down to #5, Knott in for Stewart, and Jimmy in for Flintoff. If it’s a Bunsen then the attack is Snow, Willis, Botham, Underwood and Swann.
 
Barrington in for Smith, push Gower down to #5, Knott in for Stewart, and Jimmy in for Flintoff. If it’s a Bunsen then the attack is Snow, Willis, Botham, Underwood and Swann.

Which team would win?
 
My XI for post 1968 will be: -

Boycott
Gooch
Gower
KP
Root
Botham
Stewart (wkt)
Swann
Snow
Willis
Anderson

Winner will obviously be pre 1968. Not even up for debate. Those guys were magicians and superhumans with supernatural powers. It was since post 1968, England stopped producing supernatural powers and started producing humans who struggled to break the cut off of 25 as bowlers or 50 as batsmen.
 
Is it sad that I know each and everyone of those pre-1968 players?
 
@ Robert [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] @ MMHS [MENTION=139595]Ab Fan[/MENTION] please participate here
Pre-1968 to win by a landslide.

There was no room for Ken Barrington or Brian Statham, and they were better than anyone except Botham in the post-1968 side.

In the post-1968 side I’d replace Alec Stewart with Alan Knott though.
 
@ Robert [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] @ MMHS [MENTION=139595]Ab Fan[/MENTION] please participate here

My XI for post 1968 will be: -

Boycott
Gooch
Gower
KP
Root
Botham
Stewart (wkt)
Swann
Snow
Willis
Anderson

Winner will obviously be pre 1968. Not even up for debate. Those guys were magicians and superhumans with supernatural powers. It was since post 1968, England stopped producing supernatural powers and started producing humans who struggled to break the cut off of 25 as bowlers or 50 as batsmen.
Because pre-1968 every working class boy played cricket, even it was initially in the street or on a Butlins-style Hi-De-Hi holiday.

Post-1968 it’s just middle-class boys.

So there is only a fraction of the talent.
 
I'll drop Peter May from pre 1968 team and play Herbert Sutcliffe at 3 - and drop Frank Woolley for WG Grace (W Rhodes also misses out). Hammond bowled great seemers, therefore you can think of Verity as 12th man just in case. Between Barnes & Alec Bedsar, I'll definitely take Bedsar - take out 84 wickets at <10 in 7 Tests against SAF of their early days, Barnes' figures are 104 wickets in 20 Tests against AUS at 21 - bang average for the then cricket; even George Lohman or Richardson makes a much better case.

So my team - Hobbs, Hutton, Suttcliffe, Hammond*, Compton, WG, Evans, Larwood, Trueman, Laker, Bedsar. 12th man Verity.


For the team of last 50 years, no way Smith makes the XI - I'll pick one of Root, Amiss or Thorpe. Technically, Cook should open instead of Boyce as Boycott debuted before 1968, but I keep him. And, Anderson definitely makes it ahead of Flintoff. If 2 all-rounders are to play, I'll drop Bob Willis for Jimmy. Underwood was a bit unconventional spinner - I keep Swan as 12th man just in case, if 2 spinners are required.

So my team,

Boycott, GG*, Gower, Root, KP, Stewart, ITB, Dudley, Willis, Snow, Anderson. 12th - Swan.

Not even a contest in a time ZERO world, it's not even fair - Pre 1968 era should win 6-0, batting 8 or maximum 9 times.

This is one reason, British media glorifies their past (pre WW2 era) so much, because from last 50 years, apart from ITB, I doubt how many cricketers will make all time ENG 30 men A & B squad. Their cricket supremacy ended like their global geo-political dominance with WW2.

I haven't considered KS Ranji, Bill Voce, Brian Statham, Wardle, Blythe, Peel, Les Ames, Barrington, Cowdrey, Graveney, Patsey Hendren, Leyland, Dexter, Jardin, CB Fry, Washbrooke, Hardstaff, Paynter, FS Jackson, E Tyldesley, M Tate, AP Freeman, T Bailey, GR Lock, Briggs, Tyson ....... in past teams, and these are just random names came to mind.

But, the game has obviously changed in last 50 years, therefore it's unfair to compare such.

England's dominance ended around 1900. Even in the first half of the 20th century, they were regularly being outplayed by Australia
 
Weakness against high quality quick stuff as possessed by Pre-68. Boycott and Gooch played the top fast men better.
Fair enough. I only watched Cook so dont know how the two compare. Cook has also faced some good attacks (Australia, SA & Pak) and scored plenty.
 
Back
Top