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Junaid Khan vs Mohammad Amir

I don't care what anyone says but visually watching amir, he was the best bowler since Wasim akram and waqar era.
 
Amir was a talent u dont get to see very often
Junaid will still need to prove to be better than amir

Amir was 17 when he took 5 wicket hall,, very young with pace bounce and variation was a complete package but was misguided by :butt
well amir was talented by unlucky too
 
Amir averaged 29 after bowling in the most seam-friendly conditions of the cricketing world. And he's a cheat.

Not hard to pick a winner here.
 
Varun said:
Amir averaged 29 after bowling in the most seam-friendly conditions of the cricketing world. And he's a cheat.

Not hard to pick a winner here.
Click to expand...

in Odi his Average was around 24
where Junaid also have same Average 24 in Odi
 
HASHAM2 said:
in Odi his Average was around 24
where Junaid also have same Average 24 in Odi
Click to expand...

Again, Junaid Khan ripped out our batting line-up in India. That would've been beyond Amir, I'm sure - who needed helpful pitches to....well, average under 30 in tests.

Flush the cheat from your collective memories, persist with Junaid Khan - he's a good find.
 
Varun said:
Again, Junaid Khan ripped out our batting line-up in India. That would've been beyond Amir, I'm sure - who needed helpful pitches to....well, average under 30 in tests.

Flush the cheat from your collective memories, persist with Junaid Khan - he's a good find.
Click to expand...
The conditions in India where Junaid bowled were favorable for seam bowling though.
 
Varun said:
Amir averaged 29 after bowling in the most seam-friendly conditions of the cricketing world. And he's a cheat.

Not hard to pick a winner here.
Click to expand...

Amir was 4 years younger and was improving with every series.
 
Varun said:
Again, Junaid Khan ripped out our batting line-up in India. That would've been beyond Amir, I'm sure - who needed helpful pitches to....well, average under 30 in tests.

Flush the cheat from your collective memories, persist with Junaid Khan - he's a good find.
Click to expand...
Stats don't tell the true picture. It would be unfair to say that junaid and amir are equal talent wise. BUT junaid will be as good as amir if not better with his hardwork. Every person who has played with or coached junaid says that he is the most hardworking guy and nobody needs to push him. Thats what will take junaid ahead. And junaid has way better stats than amir in SC. But as far as ONLY talent is concerned, amir was better than wasim akram when wasim was his age. Dnt forget amir was just 17-18 when he was running through english and aussie sides.
 
Sankalp said:
The conditions in India where Junaid bowled were favorable for seam bowling though.
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Junaid has 2 5-fors on srilankan roads against the likes of sangakara and jaya. And one on dead UAE track. Sanga went as far as saying that junaid was the hardest bowler to face. When a batsman of sangakara's class names junaid and not ajmal, you know he is something special.
 
Sankalp said:
The conditions in India where Junaid bowled were favorable for seam bowling though.
Click to expand...

They weren't, they were roads. Even the Pakistani batsmen managed 200-250 on them consistently, bar the last game where they showed their true colours.
 
The rule for conditions to be deemed seam friendly being if Kohli or Sehwag fail to score.
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They weren't, they were roads. Even the Pakistani batsmen managed 200-250 on them consistently, bar the last game where they showed their true colours.
Click to expand...


Except the 2nd TOI in Ahmedabad all were seam friendly wicket where even Bhuv Kumar and I Sharma were looking dangerous.
 
endymion248 said:
The rule for conditions to be deemed seam friendly being if Kohli or Sehwag fail to score.
Click to expand...
Dont show your frustration. No one dominated Pakistani bowlers like Sehwag did...so 1 series dosent matter. Avg over 80+ in test matches against so called phaaast bowlers is a fantastic effort. Jealousy may be...dont know
 
Sankalp said:
Except the 2nd TOI in Ahmedabad all were seam friendly wicket where even Bhuv Kumar and I Sharma were looking dangerous.
Click to expand...

Ishant never looked dangerous. Then again, he was bowling to their batsmen.

And you need to catch some games in South Africa or New Zealand or the like, to actually realize what 'seam' is.
 
^^ Have you seen the Chennai and the Delhi game?? Will you call it a flat track?? It was rainy cold windy day and ball was seaming swinging like nothing. Jeez whats wrong with people here. For the sake of argument they just go on
 
this comparison would have been fair, IF Amir was honest and still part of team.
now Junaid wins it without a shadow of doubt
 
Sankalp said:
^^ Have you seen the Chennai and the Delhi game?? Will you call it a flat track?? It was rainy cold windy day and ball was seaming swinging like nothing. Jeez whats wrong with people here. For the sake of argument they just go on
Click to expand...

Yep, true.
 
Sankalp said:
^^ Have you seen the Chennai and the Delhi game?? Will you call it a flat track?? It was rainy cold windy day and ball was seaming swinging like nothing. Jeez whats wrong with people here. For the sake of argument they just go on
Click to expand...

Not sure if you actually watch matches played outside India. But Nasir Jamshed would appreciate your post nonetheless.
 
Sankalp said:
Dont show your frustration. No one dominated Pakistani bowlers like Sehwag did...so 1 series dosent matter. Avg over 80+ in test matches against so called phaaast bowlers is a fantastic effort. Jealousy may be...dont know
Click to expand...

That is what I am saying, Sehwag never failed against any team. When he didn't score, the conditions were extraordinary and ball was seaming like never before in the history of the game so it is easily forgivable, hardly can we call that failure.

It is also from there that Indians have developped the science of pitch analysis on the basis of cricinfo scorecards.
 
Varun said:
Yep, true.
Click to expand...
:)))

the first ODI did have some help for the bowlers but i dnt think anyone can disagree that it requires something special to have a great ODI batting line up struggling at 29-5 in their own backyard in a pressure game. As far as bhuvneshwar kumar looking dangerous is concerned, Pakistani batsmen are not the toughest to bowl to no offence to kumar he is good too. Only jamshed has class and he negotiated him with little problems.
 
why this comparison? both are our assets one day we will have both of them performing for us and by then zia and aftab will also be ready....anxiously waiting for that time
 
^ You think 4 left arm quicks can together make it to the team?
 
Only current bowler who is even comparable(in terms of raw talent) to Amir is Steyn, even then i would say Amir was well ahead as Steyn took a few years to master accuracy.
 
Why not Mitchell Starc?
What can Amir do that Starc can't?
 
HASHAM2 said:
what Starc has done in India
Click to expand...

Amir didn't play any tests in India.
He averaged 40+ in Asia.

PlanetPakistan said:
oh bhai yeh kia bol dia...

Starc is a fine bowler but even at the age of 23 he is no where near as good as Amir was at the age of 18.
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Not saying that Starc is as good as Amir, i am just saying that Starc is equally skillfull as Amir was when he was banned.
Late swing, average pace of 145s, good yorker and the ability to bowl round the wickets.
And they both equally good with the bat.

Skill wise Starc(23) and Amir(18) are almost the same.
 
IMO Starc is a better batsman than Amir. Amir did nearly give us a heart attack with that epic 70 odd but Starc seems like a future all rounder.
 
Tbh u can't say whether starc the batsman is better than amir or not. Amir showed great batting potential just like starc but again the age factor comes in. We tend to forget Amir was 17 when he was showing so much promise. At 23 only God knows how good amir could have become. Thats ofcourse if he wasn't banned.
 
ahmed778 said:
Amir didn't play any tests in India.
He averaged 40+ in Asia.



Not saying that Starc is as good as Amir, i am just saying that Starc is equally skillfull as Amir was when he was banned.
Late swing, average pace of 145s, good yorker and the ability to bowl round the wickets.
And they both equally good with the bat.

Skill wise Starc(23) and Amir(18) are almost the same.
Click to expand...

if performances in only SC matter, junaid is miles ahead of both amir and starc.
 
ahmed778 said:
Amir didn't play any tests in India.
He averaged 40+ in Asia.
Click to expand...

Averages are very overrated, a few years ago Ishant had an excellent series in AUS and had a rather dismal average of 60. Similarly, Amir was far far better than an average of 29 suggests (Starc's average is 34).

ahmed778 said:
Not saying that Starc is as good as Amir, i am just saying that Starc is equally skillfull as Amir was when he was banned.
Late swing, average pace of 145s, good yorker and the ability to bowl round the wickets.
And they both equally good with the bat.

Skill wise Starc(23) and Amir(18) are almost the same.
Click to expand...
Starc's biggest strength is his physique. Other than that he does most things right with out being spectacular.
 
HASHAM2 said:
Remember Amir Inning vs NL
Click to expand...

I mentioned that. But apart from that, he hasn't done anything of note with the bat. Starc nearly got a test hundred on a turner and got a fifty and some useful runs in ODIs too. Starc >>> Amir with the bat.
 
Madplayer said:
if performances in only SC matter, junaid is miles ahead of both amir and starc.
Click to expand...

amir played a handful of matches in the SC. If he played more, he would have had more success than junaid, starc and pattinson
 
leatherface58 said:
I mentioned that. But apart from that, he hasn't done anything of note with the bat. Starc nearly got a test hundred on a turner and got a fifty and some useful runs in ODIs too. Starc >>> Amir with the bat.
Click to expand...

Starc Toured Pakistan in 2008 with Australia Under-19
Aus Under-19 lost 5/0
Junaid khan/Mohammad Rameez and Amir smashed AUS-under-19 badly
 
HASHAM2 said:
Starc Toured Pakistan in 2008 with Australia Under-19
Aus Under-19 lost 5/0
Junaid khan/Mohammad Rameez and Amir smashed AUS-under-19 badly
Click to expand...

Don't give me under-19 stats. So many superstars in under-19 fade away as they grow up. A chief example is your own Anwar Ali who was so good there but can't even get into the eleven over Malik and Afridi.
 
Executioner said:
amir played a handful of matches in the SC. If he played more, he would have had more success than junaid, starc and pattinson
Click to expand...

maybe. But fact remains, Junaid is miles ahead of amir, starc ,pattinson or any upcoming fast bowler as far as performances in SC are concerned.
 
leatherface58 said:
Don't give me under-19 stats. So many superstars in under-19 fade away as they grow up. A chief example is your own Anwar Ali who was so good there but can't even get into the eleven over Malik and Afridi.
Click to expand...

In countries like Aus/SA , under-19 more guys improve with time. That is expected because you are supposed to be raw at under 19 and you can improve a lot in next few years. Decent talented guy from Aus/SA seems to show greater improvement after 3-4 years.

I am not sure how many from India/Pakistan are really under 19? They do play like superstar but often fail to improve from there. Pakistan more so than India. Some of it can be structure in each country but how much is the case of players hiding their age?
 
Junaid is so underrated by Amir-maniacs it's horrible. You got possibly the next great in your lap and you are awaiting the arrival of a convicted fixer :facepalm:. Screw talent. Junaid is really good and is clean to boot.

Junaid> Amir >>Starc.
 
leatherface58 said:
Junaid is so underrated by Amir-maniacs it's horrible. You got possibly the next great in your lap and you are awaiting the arrival of a convicted fixer :facepalm:. Screw talent. Junaid is really good and is clean to boot.

Junaid> Amir >>Starc.
Click to expand...

I personally think Junaid is as good as Amir.
 
Again, people fail to realise the things Amir was doing at 18 are unrivalled by any teenager in history. Junaid may be better now than Amir was (still debatable) but Junaid certainly wasn't as good when he was 18/19. Giving the Anwar Ali example is silly because a) let's face it it was one performance and b) unlike Amir he was performing in u19, not internationally.

In all likelihood Amir would have continued to improve but the point is people have to stop comparing bowlers with him unless they too achieve anywhere near the things he did as a teenager.
 
leatherface58 said:
Junaid is so underrated by Amir-maniacs it's horrible. You got possibly the next great in your lap and you are awaiting the arrival of a convicted fixer :facepalm:. Screw talent. Junaid is really good and is clean to boot.

Junaid> Amir >>Starc.
Click to expand...

This.
Honestly I feel Junaid is as good as Amir was.
If you look at this video, Junaid as bowled some equally good deliveries as Amir.

What a sight it would have been to see them bowling in tandem :(

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=0CAF7TZiPxo&desktop_uri=/watch?v=0CAF7TZiPxo
 
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Amir used to swing ball at 148kp/h so he is better than junaid but junaid is also a great bowler
 
well this debate ends right here..Junaid is no where near What Amir was in English conditions.
 
can somebody stop compaing this mediocre joker to one of the best talent one could evver wish to see. Yeah Amir is a cheat but inters of talent Junaid is not even fit to lick his boots.
 
one match and people are quick to write off Junaid :facepalm: yes Amir was better but Junaid has better stats, stop with the knee jerk reactions.
 
Junaid has 3 5fers in test cricket, all on flat decks, one bad performance and people are writing the guy off. typical Pakistani knee jerk reaction.
 
Xoib said:
can somebody stop compaing this mediocre joker to one of the best talent one could evver wish to see. Yeah Amir is a cheat but inters of talent Junaid is not even fit to lick his boots.
Click to expand...

why would a proud man want to lick the boots of a bloody cheat

fazool qoum that hero worships cheaters and looters but disrespects the honest hardworking people


country is in the state it deserves
 
Myrmidon said:
why would a proud man want to lick the boots of a bloody cheat

fazool qoum that hero worships cheaters and looters but disrespects the honest hardworking people


country is in the state it deserves
Click to expand...

Do you apply the same logic to Afghanistan?

Perhaps you're better than an angel having made no mistakes. The young bowler made a mistake, has apologised and admitted his error.

Besides the thread isn't about race or criminal records but to compare their bowling. I'm not sure if you know much about fast bowling?

They are both great finds for Pakistan but Amir is the most naturally gifted pacer Pakistan has produced in the last 15 years. At the age of 18 he could swing it both ways and reserve swing the ball getting it to go away from the right hander around the wicket. In bowling conditions he was nearly unplayable with speeds of over 90mph reguarly. The scary thing is Amir was still improving!

Junaid has improved a lot in the last 12 months but still needs to bring more options to his game, his bouncer could be better along with his slower balls. He's a brilliant yorker bowler but has doesn't seem to bowl as many as he should.
 
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No content between the two, Aamir was a real find who would have very easily lead the bowling attack for years to come, in the Shoaib, Wasim, Waqar league.

Junaid is good bowler, intelligent at times but nothing more then support in the Rana, Gul and Sami mould.
 
KingKhanWC said:
Do you apply the same logic to Afghanistan?

Perhaps you're better than an angel having made no mistakes. The young bowler made a mistake, has apologised and admitted his error.

Besides the thread isn't about race or criminal records but to compare their bowling. I'm not sure if you know much about fast bowling?

They are both great finds for Pakistan but Amir is the most naturally gifted pacer Pakistan has produced in the last 15 years. At the age of 18 he could swing it both ways and reserve swing the ball getting it to go away from the right hander around the wicket. In bowling conditions he was nearly unplayable with speeds of over 90mph reguarly. The scary thing is Amir was still improving!

Junaid has improved a lot in the last 12 months but still needs to bring more options to his game, his bouncer could be better along with his slower balls. He's a brilliant yorker bowler but has doesn't seem to bowl as many as he should.
Click to expand...

Haven't you figured out race matters to Myrmidon more than anything else? His first posts I have read in Cricket section in this thread, and no surprise its about race. I am surprised his constant ethnic nonsense is tolerated here.

As for his ''country is in the state it is'', what country? Afghanistan?
 
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Honestly, he was disappointing in the CT and I expected more. Should've exploited the English conditions better.

But he's a very fine prospect who will lead Pakistan's attack for years to come.
 
Ahson Afzal said:
What the ?
Is that Mamoon ?
Click to expand...

yeah he had 'that' moment lol his posts really sings to player's performances. I was just praising him for criticizing Junaid in the other thread but then I found this gem.
 
I don't understand how can people even suggest that.

Junaid was a Gul 2.0 with no new ball skills and used to bowl gun barrel straight at great accuracy and decent pace. He has lost his pace, so is no more effective.

Amir was a world class talent who could swing the ball both ways with control, seam it, good accuracy and all at good pace.
 
Wow who knew Mamoon actually rated him so highly at one stage.

On topic, it's a shame to see how injuries have got the better of Junaid. The back is probably the most important part of a fast bowler's body and once it gets affected it's hard to give 100% and risk it again.

I think Junaid has until the end of this series after which Rahat will certainly be back and Amir will probably be back soon too.
 
Mamoon said:
I personally think Junaid is as good as Amir.
Click to expand...

Lol i am shocked, you kept saying you never rated Junaid in every thread and you even listed not rating Junaid amongst the predictions you got right . Did you forget this post or were you lying in that thread?
 
Trundler Khan has 9 wickets in 11 innings across all formats this year at an average of 60+ and a SR of nearly 90. Has to be the most rubbish bowler going in international cricket at the moment Indian trundlers included.
 
Dios said:
Trundler Khan has 9 wickets in 11 innings across all formats this year at an average of 60+ and a SR of nearly 90. Has to be the most rubbish bowler going in international cricket at the moment Indian trundlers included.
Click to expand...

Amir's return should be the end of Junaid's career. Although I personally feel Amir won't live up to the hype. Wahab will be the spearhead for Pakistan in the years to come.
 
Dios said:
Trundler Khan has 9 wickets in 11 innings across all formats this year at an average of 60+ and a SR of nearly 90. Has to be the most rubbish bowler going in international cricket at the moment Indian trundlers included.
Click to expand...

Do you even know what a trundler is? Shami, Yadav,Aaron and Sharma can all ball 140+ they are genuine pacers. On the other hand BD's and Pakistan's factory of 130 pacers is the definition of trundlers.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
Do you even know what a trundler is? Shami, Yadav,Aaron and Sharma can all ball 140+ they are genuine pacers. On the other hand BD's and Pakistan's factory of 130 pacers is the definition of trundlers.
Click to expand...

Irfan and Wahab and even Rahat have been bowling 140+ bro. Not sure what you are smoking.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
All of them are out with injury, at this moment the leader of your attack bowls in the high 120s and low 130s.
Click to expand...

I'm sure Wahab will recover soon and will be back for the next series. Amir is due a comeback soon. Amir+Wahab+Rahat won't be that bad of a bowling attack.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
All of them are out with injury, at this moment the leader of your attack bowls in the high 120s and low 130s.
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also you are overrating your fast bowlers. If only you listened to What Dhoni said in the match presentation about your fast bowlers.
 
So what. Who cares? People are always making incorrect statements about players. Mamoon ain't the first and won't be the last. Atleast he doesn't sit on the fence like half this forum.
 
Saqs said:
So what. Who cares? People are always making incorrect statements about players. Mamoon ain't the first and won't be the last. Atleast he doesn't sit on the fence like half this forum.
Click to expand...

I believe the main point is the lying. He went on another thread and proudly claimed that he never rated Junaid. I used to be a huge fan of him as was every other Indian on this forum but me( and half of India) have been hurt by this.
 
Guys lets keep the thread on topic and not make it about a poster
 
Junaid was lucky enough to start his career in conditions that really suit him in Sri Lanka and India. He mainly got the ball to seam around a lot. But ever since then, he's been exposed, and his true skill is showing now.

He can't move the new ball an inch, except seaming the odd delivery. His seam position and wrist position don't allow swing. His only strength is bowling with the old ball, but he seems to be losing that now.

Injury hasn't helped his case, and he has lost all accuracy too.

He has only bowled 2 quality new ball spells in his whole career. One vs India, the other vs Sri Lanka. The rest of his small sample of good spells are with the old ball.

I think we were all decieved by Junaid at the start of his career, but we have now all seen him in length, and come to the realization that he really isn't that great, and is not built for this level.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
I believe the main point is the lying. He went on another thread and proudly claimed that he never rated Junaid. I used to be a huge fan of him as was every other Indian on this forum but me( and half of India) have been hurt by this.
Click to expand...

You sound like someone who has just been created for posting against Mamoon.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
Lol i am shocked, you kept saying you never rated Junaid in every thread and you even listed not rating Junaid amongst the predictions you got right . Did you forget this post or were you lying in that thread?
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It happens. All of us have erred at some point while judging various players.
 
Cricket_Fan93 said:
Lol i am shocked, you kept saying you never rated Junaid in every thread and you even listed not rating Junaid amongst the predictions you got right . Did you forget this post or were you lying in that thread?
Click to expand...

Lol.. yes, he rated Bhuvneshwar better than Junaid, so by that logic Bhuvi is better than Amir too.
 
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