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Virat Kohli - The Mega Discussion

Big Boss said:
How can a pitch which has grass will not have pace? :uakmal

Do you even understand cricket or just the name 'Virat Kohli' is enough for you to say so? Grass reduces frictional force of the ground and ball skids on to the bat at faster pace. 9th Standard physics bro.
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He's not very intelligent, is he?

Kohli has established that he's horrible against good pace bowling or on pitches that are pace-friendly. Needs to get rid of this tag for this Tendulker comparison to gain legitimacy.

ABD and Amla are better ODI batsmen at the moment and he's arguably not in the top ten test batsmen list. Seems to be regaining his form so watch out Sri Lanka.
 
Big Boss said:
How can a pitch which has grass will not have pace? :uakmal

Do you even understand cricket or just the name 'Virat Kohli' is enough for you to say so? Grass reduces frictional force of the ground and ball skids on to the bat at faster pace. 9th Standard physics bro.
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Ye, just grow grass on SC pitches to make em faster.

Grass hardly makes a difference if the deck is lifeless. When I said it didn't have 'the pace and bounce', I was comparing it to the SA-Aus series 1st match.
 
Fastandfurious said:
^SA pitches were pretty flat, ask the SA posters here.

Didn't watch the NZ tests. [MENTION=132954]Aman[/MENTION] How were the pitches when you guys played India?
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Flat with early assistance for the pacers early on.

The wicket for the second game was green, but it flattened out after the first 2 sessions.
 
Aman said:
Flat with early assistance for the pacers early on.

The wicket for the second game was green, but it flattened out after the first 2 sessions.
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yeah, Nz pitches have changed a lot. I remember when Stephen Fleming was around and we used to get blanked around 100 every inning.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/64021.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/64020.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/64813.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/64818.html
 
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Aman said:
Flat with early assistance for the pacers early on.

The wicket for the second game was green, but it flattened out after the first 2 sessions.
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Then why is Kohlis useless ton in NZ made to be out some special knock?
 
Another Viv Richards record set to be tumble. Fastest to 6k runs.

Viv did in 141 innings.
Virat is playing his 136th and just 16 runs short. :kohli
 
Big Boss said:
Viv scored those runs in tougher wickets and most of Kohli's knocks are on flat decks. Thats all.
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Thats a myth. Not all past greats played on uncovered green tops/bouncy pitches all the time.
 
Big Boss said:
Most of Virat's knock outside Sub continent are also on flat tracks. That Adelaide track where he demolished Malinga for example was an absolute road.
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And thats how all players make their runs.
 
Big Boss said:
Most of Virat's knock outside Sub continent are also on flat tracks. That Adelaide track where he demolished Malinga for example was an absolute road.
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That's the current state of pitches now bro.

Virat is being compared to the rest of this era. If comparison with past eras, I agree these things must be brought into account.

he did average 48 in the 2010 SA tour and the pitches weren't roads. They were very good.
 
Cricfan4eva said:
No point in rebutting them. They know it, they're just sour at his success at this age.
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True we all our Jealous of Kohli like we are of Sachin. People hates Kohli for the same reason they hated Sachin.

Inzimam was nothing as compared to Sachin and now our best talent The Amazing Akmal is nowhere near his indian counterpart Kohli.
 
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aukhan said:
True we all our Jealous of Kohli like we are of Sachin. People hates Kohli for the same reason they hated Sachin.

Inzimam was nothing as compared to Sachin and now our best talent The Amazing Akmal is nowhere near his indian counterpart Kohli.
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At his peak, Inzamam was probably better.
 
She looked very simple and without much makeup. Not usual for bolly stars.

And oh yes, congrats virat for that score.
 
Haz95 said:
He can enjoy it while it lasts :amla
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True that lol, Amla's record has been phenomenal. He's being the fastest at every ODI 1000+ runs. But while Amla would retire with 8-10k runs, Kohli looks set to get 14-15k +
 
freelance_cricketer said:
Another Viv Richards record set to be tumble. Fastest to 6k runs.

Viv did in 141 innings.
Virat is playing his 136th and just 16 runs short. :kohli
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Until :amla breaks it, lol.

sensible-indian-fan said:
Who averages 43 outside SC in ODIs with SR of 87.

What do you have to say about that?
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You expect him to do better. His main competitors, ABD and Amla have very balanced records everywhere.

freelance_cricketer said:
True that lol, Amla's record has been phenomenal. He's being the fastest at every ODI 1000+ runs. But while Amla would retire with 8-10k runs, Kohli looks set to get 14-15k +
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True.
 
Kohli is absolutely lethal in ODIs.

Amla bhai is the most consistent ODI opener since Tendulkar but lacks the cutting edge. He won't chase 320 in 35 overs nor would he score a hundred in 55 or 60 balls to mow down a big target or score a match winning 183 - he'd help you win these games by anchoring the innings but someone else would have to provide the kill.

Due to his inability to turn the tables on the opposition, grab the game by the scruff of its neck and change the dimensions in the space of a few overs, I'd rank him a rung below Kohli, Dhoni and de Villiers in ODIs.

de Villiers needs some more brutal match winning innings especially while chasing.

The Indian duo's ability to finish off games, make a 300 total look like 150 and the regularly with which they have done that over the years has been simply remarkable - definitely the the alpha ODI batsmen in the game.
 
Bilal7 said:
You expect him to do better. His main competitors, ABD and Amla have very balanced records everywhere.
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Him and Dhoni are the best among Asian batsmen to perform outside SC. Average and SR combo wise.

He has balanced records too.

What is their average and SR in the subcontinent?
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Him and Dhoni are the best among Asian batsmen to perform outside SC. Average and SR combo wise.

He has balanced records too.

What is their average and SR in the subcontinent?
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Amla's is 52 at 92, ABD has similar numbers, most probably.

Its not just stats though, these two have scored runs against good bowlers, pacers or spinners, in tough batting conditions. Kohli is a shadow of himself against good pacers in bowling friendly conditions.
 
Kohli is one of the best of his era. Can't be compared to Viv who scored majority runs on massive grounds, testing pitches and never struggled against quality pace bowling. We've all seen the recent struggles of Kohli in SA and England against quality bowling.
 
Amla bhai is in a class of his own when it comes to rotating the strike and the art of accumulation.

Has no big shots like Kohli, de Villiers and Dhoni but milks every bowler like a spring goat.

However because of his one paced batting, he lacks impact. His SR is the same as the other three, but he's practically useless (unlike them) if you need 50 from 30 balls.
 
Bilal7 said:
Amla's is 52 at 92, ABD has similar numbers, most probably.

Its not just stats though, these two have scored runs against good bowlers, pacers or spinners, in tough batting conditions. Kohli is a shadow of himself against good pacers in bowling friendly conditions.
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Good stats. I agree with your point.

But Kohli and Dhoni are clutch. Those guys aren't.

We need more sample set.
 
Kohli got exposed in SA ODI's. Couldn't buy a run. Pitches were tough to bat on. This week 2 weeks after Shehzad scored a match winning ton in SA. We all thought that pitches for tests would be similar and then BOOOOOM, BCCI came into it and the pitches for SA tests were pancakes. Flattest pitches you'll ever see in SA. Even Geoff Boycott said that they were ultra flat. I reckon even Hafeez would have scored against Dale on those pitches.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Good stats. I agree with your point.

But Kohli and Dhoni are clutch. Those guys aren't.

We need more sample set.
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Both average more than Kohli in WC's so this "big game" argument isn't a convincing one. Both did quite well in the most recent T20 WC to further discredit that accusation.

All of them have their strengths:

ABD: Versatility.
Amla: Consistency.
Kohli: Domination.
Dhoni: Clutch-factor.

But the last two have more weaknesses than the top two. All future greats in ODIs though, possibly ATG's.
 
Bullet Drive said:
Kohli got exposed in SA ODI's. Couldn't buy a run. Pitches were tough to bat on. This week 2 weeks after Shehzad scored a match winning ton in SA. We all thought that pitches for tests would be similar and then BOOOOOM, BCCI came into it and the pitches for SA tests were pancakes. Flattest pitches you'll ever see in SA. Even Geoff Boycott said that they were ultra flat. I reckon even Hafeez would have scored against Dale on those pitches.
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What about last SA tour in 2010 where he averaged 49. 5 match series that was.

What about that?

Fluke?

2 innings is what he played in that recent SA odi series. Third match was abandoned.

In Joberg green track (the ODI track was super green) Kohli did score 31 at 88 SR.

Failing in one innings is can't buy a run? In England, he failed. I agree.
 
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Bullet Drive said:
Kohli got exposed in SA ODI's. Couldn't buy a run. Pitches were tough to bat on. This week 2 weeks after Shehzad scored a match winning ton in SA. We all thought that pitches for tests would be similar and then BOOOOOM, BCCI came into it and the pitches for SA tests were pancakes. Flattest pitches you'll ever see in SA. Even Geoff Boycott said that they were ultra flat. I reckon even Hafeez would have scored against Dale on those pitches.
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The first test first inninngs (we played) it was NOT flat.

Even SA were bundled out for 250 by our pacers.

After that it eased out.

yes, Hafeeez would have scored a 100 and 96 in those 2 innings. Makes sense.
 
Bilal7 said:
Both average more than Kohli in WC's so this "big game" argument isn't a convincing one. Both did quite well in the most recent T20 WC to further discredit that accusation.

All of them have their strengths:

ABD: Versatility.
Amla: Consistency.
Kohli: Domination.
Dhoni: Clutch-factor.

But the last two have more weaknesses than the top two. All future greats in ODIs though, possibly ATG's.
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Kohli performed in WC finals (that crucial 30 though not match winning took us out of dumps from 30-2 to 110-3).
Performed in CT2013 finals (in the context of the game).
Performed in semifinals WC T20 2014.
Performed in finals WC T20 2014.

He is big time clutch dude.

With all being said, we need more sample set. WC 2015 would be a good place to see who stands where.
 
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sensible-indian-fan said:
Kohli performed in WC finals (that crucial 30 though not match winning took us out of dumps from 30-2 to 110-3).
Performed in CT2013 finals (in the context of the game).
Performed in semifinals WC T20 2014.
Performed in finals WC T20 2014.

He is big time clutch dude.

With all being said, we need more sample set. WC 2015 would be a good place to see who stands where.
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Agreed 100%
 
Nice to see a decent discussion between Bilal7 and sensible-Indian-fan , rarely happening nowadays.
On the topic till Kohli plays against swing in bowling conditions he will be below ABD. Amla even though very good doesn't have much impact in LOI and i would rate him below the three cricketers being discussed here.I would still rate Dhoni above Kohli in LOI as he has played good knocks against quality bowlers and imo greatest finisher after Bevan in ODI.
 
JaDed said:
Nice to see a decent discussion between Bilal7 and sensible-Indian-fan , rarely happening nowadays.
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Bilal7 is a good poster overall aside from the occasions where you provoke him about Amla or Moeen Ali. :amla
 
If he retires tomorrow, he will already be an ATG in ODI cricket. Champion cricketer.
 
What a shot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


what a shot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :six
 
he cant do that against other countries in their own backyard. Only does it against SL, especially in India
 
This is why he is the best ODI batsman in the world. Amla and de Villiers simply cannot play an innings like this.
 
^ Amla cant . DeVilliers can probably play better innings than this one I think. Does anyone even rate this SL bowling attack?
 
Glen77 said:
he cant do that against other countries in their own backyard. Only does it against SL, especially in India
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To an extent I do agree, but please tell me which player does that in others backyard? Amla is not a clutch player (always flops in pressure situations.) AB is good I agree. Rest are either not ATG material or home track bullies.
 
Fastandfurious said:
De villiers can and he's won it for SA so many times in tougher conditions. Shut yo trap.
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Like today when he got out playing a stupid shot and SA almost lost? Or against NZ in WC2011? Or for that matter in any ODI of some value/ big tourney (aka CT)? You calling that pother poster stupid while your own posts are pretty dumb.
 
Tridibans_16 said:
Like today when he got out playing a stupid shot and SA almost lost? Or against NZ in WC2011? Or for that matter in any ODI of some value/ big tourney (aka CT)? You calling that pother poster stupid while your own posts are pretty dumb.
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Sachinista like the knocks he played against Australia in Zimbabwe. Last time I saw, this was a bilateral series.
 
Fastandfurious said:
De villiers can and he's won it for SA so many times in tougher conditions. Shut yo trap.
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Provide me with a list of ODIs that de Villiers has single handedly won for South Africa while chasing a big total. The recent one vs Australia in Zimbabwe was a massive partnership between him and du Plessis.

He is the most talented batsman in the world but he is not a pressure player.
 
Amla bhai and ABD cant dream of pulling something like that out of the hat.
 
Mamoon said:
Provide me with a list of ODIs that de Villiers has single handedly won for South Africa while chasing a big total. The recent one vs Australia in Zimbabwe was a massive partnership between him and du Plessis.

He is the most talented batsman in the world but he is not a pressure player.
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Lol because it was a partnership, it doesn't count? He's proven himself in bilaterals but hasn't in big tourneys.
 
Ab played something like this in Ipl, not in Odis. 14 centuries in chasing and 13 wins. Are you kidding me?
 
Fastandfurious said:
Lol because it was a partnership, it doesn't count? He's proven himself in bilaterals but hasn't in big tourneys.
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Two batsmen scoring hundreds cannot be compared to a batsman scoring 139* in 288 chase with the next top score of 57. This is not the first time he has played a knock like this, come back when de Villiers produces something like this on any stage.

de Villiers is the best scorer of 'soft' runs in ODIs today, of that there is no doubt. The moment the heat is on, he will get caught on long on to an Ashwin long hop which he will bury for a 100 meter six otherwise.
 
Fastandfurious said:
Nothing to burn about, just waiting for the time he does it in adverse conditions against quality bowling.
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Top scored in CT 2013 final against England in England in overcast conditions. The attack consisted of Broad and Anderson among others. Hell even Bopara was a handful in those conditions.
 
Fastandfurious said:
Nothing to burn about, just waiting for the time he does it in adverse conditions against quality bowling.
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Everyone struggles in adverse conditions, let it be SRT or Don Bradman.

A player who knows to capitalize when things going your way is the hall mark of an ATG. Kohli does exactly that and TBH no player even comes close to him. But yes, we find it tough to accept :)
 
Big Boss said:
Everyone struggles in adverse conditions, let it be SRT or Don Bradman.

A player who knows to capitalize when things going your way is the hall mark of an ATG. Kohli does exactly that and TBH no player even comes close to him. But yes, we find it tough to accept :)
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No, not everyone struggles in adverse conditions. I've hardly seen AB struggle in any condition, the only thing that goes against AB are his performances in big tourneys.
 
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