Why anti Muslim bias is so profound among Hindutva supporters?

[The Bald Eagle]

Atherva veda book 9 Hymn 4 verses 37-38-39 gives _expression that
cow's milk and cow's meat are most tasty among all other foods. It
says "The man should not eat before the guest who is Brahmin versed in
holy lore When the guest hath eaten he should eat. Now the sweetest
portion, the produce of cow, milk or flesh, that verily he should not
eat (before the guest)"

according Hindu Scriptures, In Vishnu Dharmottar Puran book 1 chapter
140 verses 49 & 50 says

"Those who do not eat meat served in the ceremony of dead
(Shraddha), will go to hell (narak)".

DID VEDIC HINDUS REALLY EAT BEEF? - part 2

alt.religion.hindu.narkive.com

 

[The Bald Eagle]

Buffaloes have calves.

No one cares about what Manu Smriti says. This is like me pointing to some Zaif Hadiths to prove something regarding Islam. I am sure you will not accept it.

Ok just forget it, answer mahabahrtha, vedac and Vishnu Dharmottar Puran references above

 

[JaDed]

What is the thread about?

 

[Champ_Pal]

Ok just forget it, answer mahabahrtha, vedac and Vishnu Dharmottar Puran references above

Vedic Brahmans used to sacrifice horse and cows and the meat was consumed.
Rigveda has verses of it.

It also has verses that consider cow meat as aghnyā ("not to be eaten" or "inviolable"). There is definite ambiguity there.

Hinduism is an evolving religion. At some point, the concept of Kama Dhenu or sacred cow was introduced. Everything about cow has use in some form.
Milk, curd and Ghee for culinary purposes.
Urine and Dung in Ayurveda()Traditional Indian medicine) and cleansing agents. This is where you get the cowca cola memes.

Cow slaughter was totally banned at some point. My guess is as the idea spread to gangetic plains.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

What is the thread about?

Sorry Guys! I went off topic too but no more off topic discussion from anyone from now onwards

 

[Stewie]

They don’t. No one refers to Vedas to support their faith. Many Hindus don’t even know how many Vedas are there let alone their names. Only scholars refer to it.

Hindus go by Indian secular laws. They can pray to any Gods they want or choose to.

well at least you are honest about your views and it seems like you disagree with the whole silly SACRED cow concept.

 

[Champ_Pal]

What is the thread about?

We were discussing about religion. Claims were made by Pak posters and they were countered. Some got upset.

Now Pak posters are on offensive. Indian posters are countering their arguments on beef consumption in India.

 

[Stewie]

Cows, Mughals and BJP. Are these really your three takeaways from the thread

haha.. this is an interesting observation. how can it not be what you are probably saying in sarcasm?\

Muslims, including Pakistanis love to bash BJP because of Modi and their anti Muslim policies, Mughals are hated by Hindus for being oppressors and conquerors who took their land and now they are getting their revenge by using the Holy Cow defense. Yes, I did use the reference to the if the glove don't fit defense.

This is all there is to Indian Pakistani Hindustva brigade arguments on PP these days. Welcome to the reality!

 

[Stewie]

We were discussing about religion. Claims were made by Pak posters and they were countered. Some got upset.

Now Pak posters are on offensive. Indian posters are countering their arguments on beef consumption in India.

You are forgetting to add the Pakistani request: "Either we stop asking each other to prove our claims while discussing religion or we try and stay consistent with our beliefs and not behave as hypocritical"

 

[Champ_Pal]

well at least you are honest about your views and it seems like you disagree with the whole silly SACRED cow concept.

I don’t think cows are sacred personally. I don’t hold grudges on anyone that eats it. It is their choice.

The concept of sacred cow is part of Indian traditions. A cow is sacred in Buddhism and Jainism too. Certainly all 3 beliefs influenced each other.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Come on, you are being disingenuous on purpose. The poster was inviting me to have beef. You also know what he was trying to do. I did not bother, but other posters saw that he was trying to attack my faith.

No not disingenuous just confused and ignorant about your religion.

You say there are commies, they say you are extreme. Both are Hindus and Hindus are supposedly flexible and open minded unlike Abrahamic. You can worship nothing or rats or Donald Trump it's ok. They say they can eat cow you say it's blasphemy. But it's ok it's all flexible and Abrahamics are narrow minded pushing their beliefs on others.

For an outsider it's hard to keep up because the standards shift until some say they don't.

I mean the above respectfully not to mock or not to put you on trial and ask for verses ( this is mockery too in my opinion).

I am just explaining to someone unfamiliar it's all a bit chaotic.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

I personally believe the right wing parties like BJP are the ones who fuel the anti Muslim hatred among Hindus just for their political mileage. Because no one can change whatever happened in past and thus no community especially Muslim minority in India should be punished for actions of those rulers who lived centuries before them.

 

[Stewie]

I don’t think cows are sacred personally. I don’t hold grudges on anyone that eats it. It is their choice.

The concept of sacred cow is part of Indian traditions. A cow is sacred in Buddhism and Jainism too. Certainly all 3 beliefs influenced each other.

well you need to make up your mind. is it sacred or not sacred. you are saying some Hindu book claims eat the cow. now you are saying its sacred in buddhism and Jainism too, so you implied its sacred in Hinduism.

What countries in the world have a lot of Buddhists living there? are there laws prohibiting the killing of cows there? from what I can tell the Koreas for sure.. Nepal might be another.


they all seem to love their juicy steaks and Bulgogi

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Says tons of Hindus who have no caste. They just identify of caste. Ever heard of Arya Samaj?

Its the Government that wants to know everyone's caste for various reasons.

I haven't heard of it. I didn't know about the current status manu smirti either until you mentioned it's not authoritative or followed.

I don't know anything about these topics so will defer to those who do. It's not my position to argue on your beliefs since I am a layman.

However I notice you seem happy to randomly copy paste Quran ayat or Hadith and act like you authoritatively know the meaning with very little study.

You should accept the same position that superficial understanding isn't enough to form an opinion.

 

[RexRex]

Now Pak posters are on offensive. Indian posters are countering their arguments on beef consumption in India.

That's an amusing way of putting it - they've gone from roberto carlos mode to ronaldo.

 

[Stewie]

I personally believe the right wing parties like BJP are the ones who fuel the anti Muslim hatred among Hindus just for their political mileage. Because no one can change whatever happened in past and thus no community especially Muslim minority in India should be punished for actions of those rulers who lived centuries before them.

I second that view. I think BJP has done this to weaponize religion and get votes like Congress did, they provided the anti thesis to it except they have made it truly difficult for muslims. They have also invented new ways to make it look like all the religions in the land are on one side and are one, the new definition of Santana Dharma and Muslims are the outsiders or exceptions. This even shows in their legislation they love to spread propaganda about.

I say propaganda because when it was time for them to use this act to help Bangladeshi Hindus, they did not do anything at all (shame on them)


At the end of the day Hindus are not even that religious and their religion has a very very loosely defined structure, its like silly putty you can shape it the way you want but unfortunately when it comes to antagonizing Muslims, it becomes very rigid all of a sudden. Who would have thought!

 

[RexRex]

At the end of the day Hindus are not even that religious and their religion has a very very loosely defined structure, its like silly putty you can shape it the way you want but unfortunately when it comes to antagonizing Muslims, it becomes very rigid all of a sudden. Who would have thought!

On the whole, they are open-minded and that is a very good quality to have.

 

[Stewie]

On the whole, they are open-minded and that is a very good quality to have.

I actually agree with it. It is a good quality to generally not force your religion on others or ask them to prove their belief/views.

 

[Champ_Pal]

I haven't heard of it. I didn't know about the current status manu smirti either until you mentioned it's not authoritative or followed.

I don't know anything about these topics so will defer to those who do. It's not my position to argue on your beliefs since I am a layman.

However I notice you seem happy to randomly copy paste Quran ayat or Hadith and act like you authoritatively know the meaning with very little study.

You should accept the same position that superficial understanding isn't enough to form an opinion.

Hinduism is an amalgamation of many cults. This is why it appears weird to outsiders. Vedas are considered to be the supreme authority. But less than 5% of Hindus read Vedas. Majority only heard about it. I myself was never taught Vedas. I had to go out of my way to research and gain some knowledge about it.

Quran is clear cut as it claims itself to be. There is enough online material from verifiable sources unlike Hinduism. There is no single website that hosts all the info with good translations.

There is Quran and Sahih Hadiths. To some extent the life story of Prophet PBUH seerat. Very limited compared to the vastness of Hindu scriptures. I read the translations of authentic sources like Quran.com, Sunnah.com and Sahih-Bukhari.com websites. I always post references whenever I counter something.
I understand Muslims get very defensive when it comes to Islam. But as a rationalist, I cannot stop myself from questioning whenever a claim is made and it looks outrageous to me.

 

[Champ_Pal]

On the whole, they are open-minded and that is a very good quality to have.

Hinduism can add Jesus to the pantheon if needed. We already have a big party in India. Just one more foreign dignitary will not hurt. I know Christians and Muslims reject the invite. The offer is still valid.

 

[RexRex]

Hinduism can add Jesus to the pantheon if needed. We already have a big party in India. Just one more foreign dignitary will not hurt. I know Christians and Muslims reject the invite. The offer is still valid.

Funny you say that.. in the Bible, the New Testament starts with the story of how Jesus was born and then for the next chapter, it fast forwards to him at age 33 when he starts becoming famous. Nobody knows what happened in the intervening 30 years, no record of it exists. Some say he went to India and that is where he got all his wisdom and teachings from..

 

[Stewie]

Hinduism is an amalgamation of many cults. This is why it appears weird to outsiders. Vedas are considered to be the supreme authority. But less than 5% of Hindus read Vedas. Majority only heard about it. I myself was never taught Vedas. I had to go out of my way to research and gain some knowledge about it.

Quran is clear cut as it claims itself to be. There is enough online material from verifiable sources unlike Hinduism. There is no single website that hosts all the info with good translations.

There is Quran and Sahih Hadiths. To some extent the life story of Prophet PBUH seerat. Very limited compared to the vastness of Hindu scriptures. I read the translations of authentic sources like Quran.com, Sunnah.com and Sahih-Bukhari.com websites. I always post references whenever I counter something.
I understand Muslims get very defensive when it comes to Islam. But as a rationalist, I cannot stop myself from questioning whenever a claim is made and it looks outrageous to me.

I think ram, Krishna, etc were all some of the 124,000 messengers of God according to Muslim tradition and they were incorrectly turned into gods. They all brought forth message of Allah for their times. They weee Muslims.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I don’t think cows are sacred personally. I don’t hold grudges on anyone that eats it. It is their choice.

The concept of sacred cow is part of Indian traditions. A cow is sacred in Buddhism and Jainism too. Certainly all 3 beliefs influenced each other.

If you don't believe a cow is sacred then you are no more a hindu than me or the CEO of McDonalds.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Funny you say that.. in the Bible, the New Testament starts with the story of how Jesus was born and then for the next chapter, it fast forwards to him at age 33 when he starts becoming famous. Nobody knows what happened in the intervening 30 years, no record of it exists. Some say he went to India and that is where he got all his wisdom and teachings from..

I don’t believe that story of Jesus coming to India and practicing tantric yoga with Buddhist and Shivite Sadhus and Monks. There is zero evidence that Jesus ever came to India.

 

[Champ_Pal]

If you don't believe a cow is sacred then you are no more a hindu than me or the CEO of McDonalds.

I consider my self a Carvaka. If you have interest, read about it. I came in contact with it a couple of decades ago. Early 2000’s.

Charvaka - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I do consider myself a cultural Hindu. I participate in all festivals and Pujas at home. I appreciate the culture and food.

 

[Champ_Pal]

I think ram, Krishna, etc were all some of the 124,000 messengers of God according to Muslim tradition and they were incorrectly turned into gods. They all brought forth message of Allah for their times. They weee Muslims.

Ram, Krishna are not messengers of any God. They were very influential and popular men of that time. This is why their names pop up in all Indic religions.
Hindus consider them to be special men and the reincarnation of God Vishnu himself. Hence they are worshipped as Gods.
IIRC, Buddhism calls lord Rama as Pratyeka Budha or a unique manifestation of Buddha.
Jainism calls Rama and Krishna as Shalaka Purushas or Worthy Humans. In Jainism, both Rama and Krishna are Jains.

As for Islam, Ram and Krishna never taught about oneness of God or visiting Arabia for a pilgrimage. Calling them Prophets is a bit too much and extremely hard to believe.

 

[Rajdeep]

Let it go @Champ_Pal bro...you ain't gonna convince people who got their heads buried in sand.

The real question OP should be asking is - 'Why is only anti-muslim bias profound in the world and not for any other religion?'

I have asked OP to open a thread on this topic multiple times but he always side tracks it. Probably a topic too inconvenient to discuss.

It is always easy to blame others rather than self introspection.

 

[Champ_Pal]

As I am typing all these responses in PP, my 8 yr old comes and asks me who is better Jesus or Zeus.

I told him, no one prays to Zeus anymore. So may be it is Jesus.

My son took pity on Zeus and said, I will pray to him and folded his hands in prayer

 

[Stewie]

Let it go @Champ_Pal bro...you ain't gonna convince people who got their heads buried in sand.

The real question OP should be asking is - 'Why is only anti-muslim bias profound in the world and not for any other religion?'

I have asked OP to open a thread on this topic multiple times but he always side tracks it. Probably a topic too inconvenient to discuss.

It is always easy to blame others rather than self introspection.

The anti Muslim bias is found only in India and israel. I have never personally seen any anti Muslim bias anywhere else so much. We are equal citizens and enjoy all the freedoms everywhere else except the communist countries where liberties are threatened no matter what.

Israel is an outright apartheid state and India is on its way to becoming one. Your human rights record is as abysmal as Israel, Russia, china, Pakistan, etc. all non democratic and oppressive states.

 

[Stewie]

As I am typing all these responses in PP, my 8 yr old comes and asks me who is better Jesus or Zeus.
I told him, no one prays to Zeus anymore. So may be it is Jesus.
My son took pity on Zeus and said, I will pray to him and folded his hands in prayer

Don’t forget to ask him for proof of Zeus being a god. Also don’t forget Zeus might be a red meat eater himself.

 

[Rajdeep]

The anti Muslim bias is found only in India and israel. I have never personally seen any anti Muslim bias anywhere else so much. We are equal citizens and enjoy all the freedoms everywhere else except the communist countries where liberties are threatened no matter what.

Israel is an outright apartheid state and India is on its way to becoming one. Your human rights record is as abysmal as Israel, Russia, china, Pakistan, etc. all non democratic and oppressive states.

That is factually not true.

Why do you think British Parliament had an Islamophobia day educating people led by MP Rupa Haq? Britain is not apartheid state like Israel and would be apartheid state like India right?

That is why I have requested OP @The Bald Eagle multiple times to open a thread on this topic so that we can discuss it properly.

Chalo bhai everyone is bad - Israel (Jews), India (Hindus), UK (Christians), America (Christians) ...everyone. But why they are bad only towards one religion? Why no Hinduphobia, Sikhophobia, Jainophobia, Buddhophobia etc.

Kuch to baat hai na sir...lets discuss that first. Correct na?

 

[Stewie]

That is factually not true.

Why do you think British Parliament had an Islamophobia day educating people led by MP Rupa Haq? Britain is not apartheid state like Israel and would be apartheid state like India right?

That is why I have requested OP @The Bald Eagle multiple times to open a thread on this topic so that we can discuss it properly.

Chalo bhai everyone is bad - Israel (Jews), India (Hindus), UK (Christians), America (Christians) ...everyone. But why they are bad only towards one religion? Why no Hinduphobia, Sikhophobia, Jainophobia, Buddhophobia etc.

Kuch to baat hai na sir...lets discuss that first. Correct na?

Islamophobia is there, anti semitism is there, racism is there, these are all there in one form or another in the world. They bring out the worst impulses of men. I have seen Hindus or Indians being labeled “curry munchers” verbally and physically abused by whites because of the way they might smell or look. That happens too quite frequently.

Koi bat to hai na phir uss mein bhi?

There is always some excuse. But most often it is unjustifiable

 

[Rajdeep]

Islamophobia is there, anti semitism is there, racism is there, these are all there in one form or another in the world. They bring out the worst impulses of men. I have seen Hindus or Indians being labeled “curry munchers” verbally and physically abused by whites because of the way they might smell or look. That happens too quite frequently.

Koi bat to hai na phir uss mein bhi?

There is always some excuse. But most often it is unjustifiable

Hindus are called Curry munchers in how many countries sir? It is not for Hindus only BTW but a term associated with South Asians in UK. Normally South Asian people who eats a lots of curry made of garlic and smells are called that. That is nothing to do with religion or hindus...nice try sir. Karahi Chicken is a Pakistani dish right sir?


Anti Semitism in how many countries sir? 99.99% of Indians or non western world has not even heard about that term.

Lets be honest, you take the globe in hand and rotate in any direction and you will see a conflict ion the direction you move that globe associated with muslims only.

Why is that is what we need to address but OP never opens a thread on that topic.

 

[Stewie]

Hindus are called Curry munchers in how many countries sir? It is not for Hindus only BTW but a term associated with South Asians in UK. Normally South Asian people who eats a lots of curry made of garlic and smells are called that. That is nothing to do with religion or hindus...nice try sir. Karahi Chicken is a Pakistani dish right sir?


Anti Semitism in how many countries sir? 99.99% of Indians or non western world has not even heard about that term.

Lets be honest, you take the globe in hand and rotate in any direction and you will see a conflict ion the direction you move that globe associated with muslims only.

Why is that is what we need to address but OP never opens a thread on that topic.

Well if you live with something at home, obviously it seems ubiquitous. Everything foreign no matter how prevalent seems to easily fly under the radar… sir!

 

[HalBass9]

That is factually not true.

Why do you think British Parliament had an Islamophobia day educating people led by MP Rupa Haq? Britain is not apartheid state like Israel and would be apartheid state like India right?

That is why I have requested OP @The Bald Eagle multiple times to open a thread on this topic so that we can discuss it properly.

Chalo bhai everyone is bad - Israel (Jews), India (Hindus), UK (Christians), America (Christians) ...everyone. But why they are bad only towards one religion? Why no Hinduphobia, Sikhophobia, Jainophobia, Buddhophobia etc.

Kuch to baat hai na sir...lets discuss that first. Correct na?

A certain group in Israel is Islamophobic, because, of course, that's how you get a scenario where Polish refugees fleeing Nazis somehow end up kicking Palestinians out of their homes. The irony could not be more palpable if it tried.

As for the UK, the EDL is an inherently racist bunch, no surprise there. Plenty of people, however, have openly stood against your favorite bigot, Mr. Tommy Robinson. He’s not exactly winning hearts and minds across the board.

Now, American Christians. If you’re talking about the inbred, evangelical types from Alabama, the kind who watch Fox News like it’s the Gospel, then yes, they’re terrified of Muslims. But if you hang out with the non-bigoted, the majority in America, you’ll find they have no such issues. It’s all about where you’re looking.

Even in India, I’d like to think only the Hindutva extremists are inherently Islamophobic, but hey, it’s India, so who really knows what’s going on over there?

Using bigots to make your point is, to put it mildly, bizarre. But it seems to be a common trait among bigots everywhere, whether it’s a Hindutva extremist, a Tommy Robinson supporter, or an Alabama Christian with an unsettling fondness for his sister.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Don’t forget to ask him for proof of Zeus being a god. Also don’t forget Zeus might be a red meat eater himself.

Thank you. He is too young to understand complex questions like evidence for God. If he asks the same when he is a teen, I will give him my Gyan.

He felt bad that no one prays to Zeus anymore. Lord Zeus earned himself a little follower.

 

[HalBass9]

I genuinely can't wrap my head around why Hindutva supporters move to multicultural countries when they can't stand other cultures and religions. It's time to assimilate and embrace diversity. If that's too much to handle, maybe it's best they stay back in India.

 

[Red-Indian]

You are forgetting to add the Pakistani request: "Either we stop asking each other to prove our claims while discussing religion (put up or shut up) or we try and stay consistent with our beliefs and not behave as hypcritical"

I agree. When my daughter used to claim (she's grown out of it now) that the tooth fairy would pay for her tooth, I didn't use to make fun of her and ask her to prove which line of her fairy tale books made this specific claim. I used to quietly sneak in at night, take the tooth and leave 10 rupees.

Why can't religious folks offer each other the same respect? If the other side seems to believe that the cow is sacred or it's wrong to insult the prophet, why not refrain from insulting the prophet and eating one of the many meat choices available?

Why this need to have the other person find some proof of their faith? It's a minor matter.

Of course if it the religious folks demand too much of a sacrifice, like say religious impositions on women in Iran, fight back or leave quietly.

 

[RexRex]

I agree. When my daughter used to claim (she's grown out of it now) that the tooth fairy would pay for her tooth, I didn't use to make fun of her and ask her to prove which line of her fairy tale books made this specific claim. I used to quietly sneak in at night, take the tooth and leave 10 rupees.
Why can't religious folks offer each other the same respect?

This is a subtle dig at religious people when you compare them to a having the undeveloped mind of an innocent toddler.

 

[RexRex]

Why can't religious folks offer each other the same respect? If the other side seems to believe that the cow is sacred or it's wrong to insult the prophet, why not refrain from insulting the prophet and eating one of the many meat choices available?

Nothing wrong with religious people having their beliefs as long as they keep it private or if they restrict it to their homeland, but when you take these beliefs to the land that you immigrate to .. that becomes a problem for the host nation. You are restricting their freedom.

For example, do you think Western countries should start banning cow slaughter now that they are starting to develop a sizable hindu population ?

 

[CricketCartoons]

Nothing wrong with religious people having their beliefs as long as they keep it private or if they restrict it to their homeland, but when you take these beliefs to the land that you immigrate to .. that becomes a problem for the host nation. You are restricting their freedom.

For example, do you think Western countries should start banning cow slaughter now that they are starting to develop a sizable hindu population ?

LOL, Don't stretch your imagination that far. First get cow slaughter ban implemented in India itself before thinking of anywhere else.

 

[CricketCartoons]

This is a subtle dig at religious people when you compare them to a having the undeveloped mind of an innocent toddler.

Most of the scientific achievements have been made by religious people.

 

[RexRex]

LOL, Don't stretch your imagination that far. First get cow slaughter ban implemented in India itself before thinking of anywhere else.

Cow is a cow whether it is american cow or chinese cow or an indian cow. They are all holy.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Cow is a cow whether it is american cow or chinese cow or an indian cow. They are all holy.

Then why don't you support a ban on their slaughter?

 

[RexRex]

Then why don't you support a ban on their slaughter?

Why should I ? They are not holy for me, they are for you.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Why should I ? They are not holy for me, they are for you.

Oh so you know they are holy to me and you still attack my faith. Very classy.

 

[BouncerGuy]

This thread is not about COW SLAUGHTER BAN STUFF.

No more irrelevant talk now.

 

[Red-Indian]

This is a subtle dig at religious people when you compare them to a having the undeveloped mind of an innocent toddler.

Well yes but in this context, acknowledging also that this is a matter of faith not of specific wordings in books.

As an atheist, I could say it won't be proof that a specific instruction is holy however old they are unless your god has written it across the sky in indelible, physics defying golden letters. I won't believe any of your books written on paper.

I don't and I respect your beliefs and the fact that you hold them as long as you don't use those beliefs to hurt me or severely restrict my freedoms.

 

[SM1989]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1829626460992164151

Elderly Muslim man thrown off a train and killed by Hindu passengers due to “having meat” in his food.

Hindutva is a terrible cancer on humanity

 

[IndoorCricket]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1829626460992164151

Elderly Muslim man thrown off a train and killed by Hindu passengers due to “having meat” in his food.

Hindutva is a terrible cancer on humanity

You posted random video. Please post a primary source.

 

[CricketCartoons]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1829626460992164151

Elderly Muslim man thrown off a train and killed by Hindu passengers due to “having meat” in his food.

Hindutva is a terrible cancer on humanity

Fake news. He is alive.

Targeting elderly is wrong every way. They should pick people of their age.

 

[Champ_Pal]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1829626460992164151

Elderly Muslim man thrown off a train and killed by Hindu passengers due to “having meat” in his food.

Hindutva is a terrible cancer on humanity

Where is this? Is it in West Bengal?

This is pathetic and the aggressors must be arrested and put away in prison.

 

[Champ_Pal]

I just went to the twitter page of this person Emilia who claims to be a Nordic Girl. It is full of propaganda and antisemitic trope.

We need more info on it from a verifiable source.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Where is this? Is it in West Bengal?

This is pathetic and the aggressors must be arrested and put away in prison.

Talk like @sweep_shot . That this is isolated incident, and fake news (although in this case the murder part is really fake news), and that they would have assaulted any one of any religion, so it is secular assault.

They will deny, downplay and gaslight any violence on hindus, and expect you to be answerable and ashamed for violence on muslims.

Be like them.

 

[RexRex]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1829626460992164151

Elderly Muslim man thrown off a train and killed by Hindu passengers due to “having meat” in his food.

Hindutva is a terrible cancer on humanity

That is an astonishing video, to think that young people can be so feral and savage and that too against an old man. Sad state of affairs. Hindutva.

 

[Champ_Pal]

That is an astonishing video, to think that young people can be so feral and savage and that too against an old man. Sad state of affairs. Hindutva.

The fault lines between religions is getting wider by the day.

 

[CricketCartoons]

That is an astonishing video, to think that young people can be so feral and savage and that too against an old man. Sad state of affairs. Hindutva.

I can present videos of assault for the religion of your choice. Will you generalize them by the same standards?

 

[CricketCartoons]

The fault lines between religions is getting wider by the day.

It was never narrow. Just that one side was ignoring it.

 

[RexRex]

I can present videos of assault for the religion of your choice. Will you generalize them by the same standards?

I said hindutva, not hinduism.

 

[CricketCartoons]

I said hindutva, not hinduism.

That is still a generalization.

Why will you give religions a free pass, when they have violence in their scriptures and their people can be violent.

Why not use the same standard to judge religions?

 

[RexRex]

Why will you give religions a free pass, when they have violence in their scriptures and their people can be violent.

Why not use the same standard to judge religions?

Which religion am I giving a free pass to and for which incident ? No idea what you're on about.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Which religion am I giving a free pass to and for which incident ? No idea what you're on about.

All major religions. They have some violent verses and their followers have committed violence. So why giving them a free pass. If you generalize for Hindutva, why not hinduism, islam and christianity?

 

[Stewie]

I agree. When my daughter used to claim (she's grown out of it now) that the tooth fairy would pay for her tooth, I didn't use to make fun of her and ask her to prove which line of her fairy tale books made this specific claim. I used to quietly sneak in at night, take the tooth and leave 10 rupees.

Why can't religious folks offer each other the same respect? If the other side seems to believe that the cow is sacred or it's wrong to insult the prophet, why not refrain from insulting the prophet and eating one of the many meat choices available?

Why this need to have the other person find some proof of their faith? It's a minor matter.

Of course if it the religious folks demand too much of a sacrifice, like say religious impositions on women in Iran, fight back or leave quietly.

hahaha, so now you think I should change my dietary habits because cow is sacred for some?

You cannot equate insulting someone with eating something that is considered normal in the other 99% of the countries world wide.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

All major religions. They have some violent verses and their followers have committed violence. So why giving them a free pass. If you generalize for Hindutva, why not hinduism, islam and christianity?

I always think the standards should be upheld by the majority, since it is the minorities who will inevitably suffer. So in India the Hindus need to show responsibility towards their minorities, and the same should hold true for Muslims in Pakistan.

 

[Stewie]

Nothing wrong with religious people having their beliefs as long as they keep it private or if they restrict it to their homeland, but when you take these beliefs to the land that you immigrate to .. that becomes a problem for the host nation. You are restricting their freedom.

For example, do you think Western countries should start banning cow slaughter now that they are starting to develop a sizable hindu population ?

That is ridiculous. Why do you have to "keep it private"?

Religious beliefs and traditions are nothing to be ashamed of. My take is "as long as it is not imposed on anyone" it should be ok.

I am not imposing others don't drink alcohol and don't eat pork. I am fine if those who want to do it do it. I am not imposing on anyone to not worship idols.

Same way if Hindus don't want to kill cows and eat meat, I respect that.. but don't "impose" this stuff on anyone.

Its rather a simple concept if you finally decide the verbal and mental gymnastics to force cow laughter ban do little to hide its anti-secular and anti-democratic nature.

 

[CricketCartoons]

I always think the standards should be upheld by the majority, since it is the minorities who will inevitably suffer. So in India the Hindus need to show responsibility towards their minorities, and the same should hold true for Muslims in Pakistan.

Not when one set of minority become so ungrateful that they want majority to bend and keep bending, and don't want to give an inch. It has to be both ways.

 

[CricketCartoons]

That is ridiculous. Why do you have to "keep it private"?

Religious beliefs and traditions are nothing to be ashamed of. My take is "as long as it is not imposed on anyone" it should be ok.

I am not imposing others don't drink alcohol and don't eat pork. I am fine if those who want to do it do it. I am not imposing on anyone to not worship idols.

Same way if Hindus don't want to kill cows and eat meat, I respect that.. but don't "impose" this stuff on anyone.

Its rather a simple concept if you finally decide the verbal and mental gymnastics to force cow laughter ban do little to hide its anti-secular and anti-democratic nature.

So you are fine with charlie hebdo?

 

[Champ_Pal]

That is ridiculous. Why do you have to "keep it private"?

Religious beliefs and traditions are nothing to be ashamed of. My take is "as long as it is not imposed on anyone" it should be ok.

I am not imposing others don't drink alcohol and don't eat pork. I am fine if those who want to do it do it. I am not imposing on anyone to not worship idols.

Same way if Hindus don't want to kill cows and eat meat, I respect that.. but don't "impose" this stuff on anyone.

Its rather a simple concept if you finally decide the verbal and mental gymnastics to force cow laughter ban do little to hide its anti-secular and anti-democratic nature.

In that case, your coreligionists offer prayers on streets blocking traffic, in Parks where kids are playing and blast out prayers in loud speakers 5 times a day. Is that on applying your religion forcibly on others?

Islam is not just about doing prayers in private and eating beef behind closed doors.

 

[Champ_Pal]

It was never narrow. Just that one side was ignoring it.

You have to thank Gandhian pacifist philosophy. He used say Hey Ram for everything, but followed Buddha and Jains for all practical purposes

 

[Stewie]

In that case, your coreligionists offer prayers on streets blocking traffic, in Parks where kids are playing and blast out prayers in loud speakers 5 times a day. Is that on applying your religion forcibly on others?

Islam is not just about doing prayers in private and eating beef behind closed doors.

I would never ever be ok with any of that. I have always maintained that your views about Islam and Muslims are based on your experiences in India which are vastly different from Muslims of the rest of the world. The Muslims of the subcontinent are a terrible breed, I have to admit.

Even when I was a wee lad in Pakistan, I hated the fact there were so many mosques blaring out on loud speakers to compete with each other and I wanted to speak out against it and the impact of noise pollution but was warned to stay quiet for fear of being labelled an infidel.

The concept of Adhaan is to inform people that its prayer time, and it made sense till we invented electricity and TVs, radios, and now these wonderful Adhaan apps for mobile devices. I think this practice should be banned or be limited to non loud speaker based methods.

Same with unsanctioned blocking of streets and traffic. That should only happen with permission.

 

[Red-Indian]

hahaha, so now you think I should change my dietary habits because cow is sacred for some?

You cannot equate insulting someone with eating something that is considered normal in the other 99% of the countries world wide.

I'm open to a 'nothing is sacred, every animal, book and historic figure should be fair game for eating, abuse and ridicule' kind of society. I don't know if all of you religious folks would enjoy it though.

 

[Stewie]

I'm open to a 'nothing is sacred, every animal, book and historic figure should be fair game for eating, abuse and ridicule' kind of society. I don't know if all of you religious folks would enjoy it though.

see here you go again going to t..it... for t..a...at stuff.
you are clearly referencing the urge to scratch the itch for insulting our Prophet. It is quite clear that one urge is emanating from malicious intent and one is simply about conducting a regular dietary need. I love to have nihari once in a while. I don't eat it every day.

Do you love to insult our Holy Prophet, @Red-Indian?

 

[SM1989]

Fake news. He is alive.

Targeting elderly is wrong every way. They should pick people of their age.

Glad he is alive. But you cannot deny the large number of those who aren’t due to Hindutva goons.

 

[Champ_Pal]

I would never ever be ok with any of that. I have always maintained that your views about Islam and Muslims are based on your experiences in India which are vastly different from Muslims of the rest of the world. The Muslims of the subcontinent are a terrible breed, I have to admit.

Even when I was a wee lad in Pakistan, I hated the fact there were so many mosques blaring out on loud speakers to compete with each other and I wanted to speak out against it and the impact of noise pollution but was warned to stay quiet for fear of being labelled an infidel.

The concept of Adhaan is to inform people that its prayer time, and it made sense till we invented electricity and TVs, radios, and now these wonderful Adhaan apps for mobile devices. I think this practice should be banned or be limited to non loud speaker based methods.

Same with unsanctioned blocking of streets and traffic. That should only happen with permission.

Last month I went to Niagara. I saw a large group of Bangladeshis(they were speaking bangla) offer prayers in the park adjacent to it. Kids who were playing there were staring at the people offering prayers.

There are enough videos on YouTube to see even in the west, Muslims offer prayers on streets blocking traffic. What I am saying is not just anecdotal.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Glad he is alive. But you cannot deny the large number of those who aren’t due to Hindutva goons.

Some hindus are just like any other, where they take matter in hand when it comes to religion. I am not denying it, not am I expecting it to be any different.

 

[CricketCartoons]

see here you go again going to t..it... for t..a...at stuff.
you are clearly referencing the urge to scratch the itch for insulting our Prophet. It is quite clear that one urge is emanating from malicious intent and one is simply about conducting a regular dietary need. I love to have nihari once in a while. I don't eat it every day.

Do you love to insult our Holy Prophet, @Red-Indian?

After reading many hadiths, I think muslims will do well to follow the sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w). He had a sense of humour, he was romantic, he was good with kids and he liked things in moderation.

Most muslims only copy the sunnah of wearing ankle length clothes, or maybe use miswaak, but they are opposite in other values.

 

[Red-Indian]

see here you go again going to t..it... for t..a...at stuff.
you are clearly referencing the urge to scratch the itch for insulting our Prophet. It is quite clear that one urge is emanating from malicious intent and one is simply about conducting a regular dietary need. I love to have nihari once in a while. I don't eat it every day.

Do you love to insult our Holy Prophet, @Red-Indian?

If I'm being really honest, I'd love to have the ability to make jokes on every religious figure. They seem too solemn and often claim ridiculous things.

I'd also love to have the ability to eat beef in my home state (I love a nice steak medium-rare).

However unlike you, I recognise that both of these would cause hurt to people and I don't mind refraining.

 

[Stewie]

Last month I went to Niagara. I saw a large group of Bangladeshis(they were speaking bangla) offer prayers in the park adjacent to it. Kids who were playing there were staring at the people offering prayers.

There are enough videos on YouTube to see even in the west, Muslims offer prayers on streets blocking traffic. What I am saying is not just anecdotal.

I have been to Niagara, although it was years ago. There are vast open spaces there. I don't believe you are violating any laws or restricting any public activity if there is a jamaat of upto 50 people there. Kids and adults starting at them does not necessarily make it an illegal activity, now does it? it may seem odd to some, but they are not hurting anybody.

Now if you the same thing happened at peak hours with a lot of traffic and with the crowd of hundreds of people who are blocking traffic and creating general public issues, I will be against it. I am sure you are breaking a few laws by doing that. Praying at a huge park at Niagara Falls is not doing any of that in my view. If they prayed right in front of the falls and blocked the general view of the public out there trying to get a closer look, then yes. Were they doing that?

 

[Stewie]

If I'm being really honest, I'd love to have the ability to make jokes on every religious figure. They seem too solemn and often claim ridiculous things.

I'd also love to have the ability to eat beef in my home state (I love a nice steak medium-rare).

However unlike you, I recognise that both of these would cause hurt to people and I don't mind refraining.

well then you have those freedoms in a free society. Regardless of how much disdain I have for such stuff, unfortunately you are protected under free speech in a free country. Legally, I would expend all resources to oppose your activity, and I will b e exercising my legal right as well.

Its not as if the Muslim disagreement has stopped any atheist, Islamophobe, etc to not try and hurl such filth at our beliefs. So I don't know why this is even being brought up. The difference is one is allowed legally in proper secular and free countries and one activity is not allowed in a so-called secular and free state. Hope you catch my drift.

P.S I am still appalled at your attempts to somehow equate the two situations. They are not the same. I should be able to eat in the privacy of my home and you can do whatever it is you want in the privacy of your home.

 

[RexRex]

All major religions. They have some violent verses and their followers have committed violence. So why giving them a free pass. If you generalize for Hindutva, why not hinduism, islam and christianity?

What matters is how the mainstream majority followers of that religion interprets those verses. If they interpret them in a manner that sanctions violence in this day and age, then there is no free pass for them .. their religion is absolutely responsible.

So do you have examples of this ? You must have otherwise you wouldn't have brought it up.