Why Indian Hindutva supporters back Israel on Gaza bombing

[smkk]

If you go by that logic, anyone can make up a story and claim certain site belongs to them. This is like Hindu nuts claiming that Kaba is a Shiva temple. No evidence to back up that any Hindu ruler ever went to Saudia and built the temple there. It will be laughed off.

You are talking about occupation. Last I read, Gaza and Westbank are under the control of Hamas and PA. Israel is not ruling them. So your occupation thesis does not hold. The present day Israel is won by Israel fair and square as they fought wars over it. As you know, winners take the spoils. You can blame the ineptness of Arab states.

While most Arab countries have made peace with Israel, its the Western/subcontinent Muslims, Iran and Qatar that are crying about Israeli occupation.

The entire war would end if Egypt takes over Gaza and Jordan takes over Westbank. But they don't want any part of the radicalized people of Gaza and Westbank.

Yemeni Houthis and Hezbollah are Iranian proxies. Everyone knows that.

Yeah you are right, we can see that even in India just based on the claim that a mosque was situated on the birthplace of a Deity, it was destroyed regardless how strong that claim was and plunged the entire country into riots. People do make absurd claim and then an entire nation have to pay price for years to come.

It seems that you really have no knowledge about the political situation of Gaza and West bank. Gaza is being occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades.

Israel’s Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession

Israel’s military rule disrupts every aspect of daily life in the Occupied Palestinian Territories. It continues to affect whether, when and how Palestinians can travel to work or school, go abroad, visit their relatives, earn a living, attend a protest, access their farmland, or even access electricity or a clean water supply. It means daily humiliation, fear and oppression. People’s entire lives are effectively held hostage by Israel.

That is why many people (including free thinking Jews from West) terms the entire Israel as a military post of the west in the heartland of Middle east. It would be normal if Israel have let the Gaza and West Bank to conduct their own things. But they controls every expect of their life resulting the situation as it is now. By international law, Israel do not have any rights to control these places but they do so anyway. And due to which todays problem have occurred.

It is for this reasons, the entire world except for few nations as it is shown in the recent UN votings are with Palestine to have their own free and sovereign nation. (Even India voted in favour). But what is really devastating for Israel and US, that almost the entirety of Europe is standing with the Palestine as a free country. Israel have lost all the diplomatic control they had on Europe in result. This even shows that US have lost significant hold on her allies in this struggle.

As for Arab countries made peace with Israel, again this shows your surface level of knowledge in this matter. All the hard works that was made for past couple of years by US for Abraham accord have ended up in wastes due to Netanyahu's hard line.

War in Gaza Forces Tough Choices on Israel's Arab Partners

So far, the two main signatories of Abraham accord - Bahrain and the United Arab Emirates - have made opposite choices, with the former halting economic ties and recalling its ambassador and the latter reiterating its commitment to the accords.

Sudan, which signed onto the accords in 2021, has expressed support for the legitimate rights of the Palestinian people to have their independent state, but it is too consumed with its own civil war to have said much more.

Morocco, meanwhile, has strongly denounced Israel’s bombing campaign across Gaza and deplored what it sees as inaction by the international community. However, it has yet to act on demands that it sever diplomatic relations with Israel.

As for recent UAE:
Gaza war cools Israel's once red-hot business ties with UAE

The war has fractured the UAE's relationship with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, according to four sources familiar with the matter.

They said that the UAE now rarely speaks directly with Netanyahu and that President Isaac Herzog was a key interlocutor in the Israel-UAE relationship.

As for Saudi Arabia where main effort was made to join the Abrham Accord, have been stated officially from the very begining that without the state of Palestine, there would be no normalization. And without the recognition of SA, no other muslim country will normalize with Israel. So the US and Israel dreams of having peace has been shattered in this region for the time being

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Same way Pakistan never criticized china for uyghur Muslim .

This comparison makes no sense. OP is about hindutva supporters not India as a nation. I don't recall many Muslims supporting China over Uyghur policies.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

They are trouble makers with sole aim of destroying Israel. You will understand it when you read about Hamas Charter. They don't want peace. They just want the destruction of Israel.

Lol. You seem so logical on Hamas and it's charter, yet completely clueless on PRO ISRAEL and it's GREATER Israel plan.
Then again, like I said, emotions can take over, when one is a product or following of a oppressive regime

 

[Champ_Pal]

Yeah you are right, we can see that even in India just based on the claim that a mosque was situated on the birthplace of a Deity, it was destroyed regardless how strong that claim was and plunged the entire country into riots. People do make absurd claim and then an entire nation have to pay price for years to come.

It seems that you really have no knowledge about the political situation of Gaza and West bank. Gaza is being occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades.

Israel’s Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession


That is why many people (including free thinking Jews from West) terms the entire Israel as a military post of the west in the heartland of Middle east. It would be normal if Israel have let the Gaza and West Bank to conduct their own things. But they controls every expect of their life resulting the situation as it is now. By international law, Israel do not have any rights to control these places but they do so anyway. And due to which todays problem have occurred.

It is for this reasons, the entire world except for few nations as it is shown in the recent UN votings are with Palestine to have their own free and sovereign nation. (Even India voted in favour). But what is really devastating for Israel and US, that almost the entirety of Europe is standing with the Palestine as a free country. Israel have lost all the diplomatic control they had on Europe in result. This even shows that US have lost significant hold on her allies in this struggle.

As for Arab countries made peace with Israel, again this shows your surface level of knowledge in this matter. All the hard works that was made for past couple of years by US for Abraham accord have ended up in wastes due to Netanyahu's hard line.

War in Gaza Forces Tough Choices on Israel's Arab Partners


As for recent UAE:
Gaza war cools Israel's once red-hot business ties with UAE




As for Saudi Arabia where main effort was made to join the Abrham Accord, have been stated officially from the very begining that without the state of Palestine, there would be no normalization. And without the recognition of SA, no other muslim country will normalize with Israel. So the US and Israel dreams of having peace has been shattered in this region for the time being

Gaza is occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades? Last I checked, Hamas was controlling Gaza since 2004 IIRC. Millions were given as funds for Hamas for the development of the place. They used all of it to build tunnels and wage war against Israel.

Abraham accord is still in place. Arab countries are all still in good relations with Israel. You hear nothing from them regarding the war other than lip service. On the ground level, there is no support for Palestine.

Palestinians already got their own free nations. Its called Gaza and Westbank. Israel does not control both those places. More land was offered to Palestinians in the past and they rejected it every time. Palestinians wanted the entire land of Israel. The current borders are due to the wars lost by Arab countries in the past.

Palestinians are not victims of Israel. They are victims of Arab leadership of the past and the current Hamas. You cannot deny Hamas charter of a few decades ago. That means they have been waging war against Israel for many decades. Their stance only marginally changed in the last few years. Even then the leadership of Hamas wants the total destruction of Israel.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Lol. You seem so logical on Hamas and it's charter, yet completely clueless on PRO ISRAEL and it's GREATER Israel plan.
Then again, like I said, emotions can take over, when one is a product or following of a oppressive regime

Israel voluntarily gave Gaza to Palestinians. It was the land they won during the war, but gave it away to Palestinians. If Greater Israel was indeed their plan, they would have never given Gaza and Westbank to Palestinians.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Israel voluntarily gave Gaza to Palestinians. It was the land they won during the war, but gave it away to Palestinians. If Greater Israel was indeed their plan, they would have never given Gaza and Westbank to Palestinians.

Lol. Where ever your getting your info from, must have a stamp of approval of the RSS brigade.

Like I said Muslims and Jews lived in peace for centuries.

It's the toxic regimes like Nazis before, and currently the pro israel and to a lesser extent the RSS hindutwa brigade who have toxicated peace, and are hell bent on approving of opression!

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Lol. Where ever your getting your info from, must have a stamp of approval of the RSS brigade.

Like I said Muslims and Jews lived in peace for centuries.

It's the toxic regimes like Nazis before, and currently the pro israel and to a lesser extent the RSS hindutwa brigade who have toxicated peace, and are hell bent on approving of opression!

Look at the thread title and look at how vehemently the hindutvas are defending the genocide despite this having nothing to do with them for all ostensible reasons. I don't think Israelis themselves would fight harder for the right to massacre whole populations then settle the lands with invaders from all corners of the globe.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Lol. Where ever your getting your info from, must have a stamp of approval of the RSS brigade.

Like I said Muslims and Jews lived in peace for centuries.

It's the toxic regimes like Nazis before, and currently the pro israel and to a lesser extent the RSS hindutwa brigade who have toxicated peace, and are hell bent on approving of opression!

So who gave Gaza to Palestinians? I would like to know this knowledge nugget from you.

 

[HalBass9]

Same way Pakistan never criticized china for uyghur Muslim .

I am sorry what?

I am genuinely intrigued to know if you genuinely believe what you've typed or if you merely felt compelled to defend 'Hindutva'. Why are we graced with a 'Hindutva' crowd that can't even adequately defend their support for genocide?

Pakistan has rendered itself insignificant when it comes to criticizing China, thanks to its self-inflicted economic crisis. Imran Khan had no choice but to conjure up incoherent excuses because he simply does not know how to defend what's 'wrong'. Even Indian politicians aren't openly attempting to defend genocide; rather, the official stance of the Indian government is against it.

It's the 'Hindutva' supporters who are scrambling to find any excuse to justify the genocide in Gaza. It can't simply be about economic benefits, as India is the 5th largest economy, and Indians proudly proclaim that they do not need anyone in terms of the economy. Even if it were about economic benefits, one could still condemn the perpetrators of genocide instead of concocting every excuse under the sun to lend support to the genocide. Some even go so far as to distort history, acting as if everything began on October 7th, as if Palestinians were living freely, as if occupation never existed in Palestine, as if settlers aren't a real presence there. It's literally called 'The settlement' when they build new houses for settlers, as if none of us possess basic common sense.

The only thing that makes sense regarding their support for the Gaza genocide is that almost every person from the Global South is condemning it, except for 'the Hindutva' crowd.

 

[HalBass9]

So who gave Gaza to Palestinians? I would like to know this knowledge nugget from you.

Gaza is occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades? Last I checked, Hamas was controlling Gaza since 2004 IIRC. Millions were given as funds for Hamas for the development of the place. They used all of it to build tunnels and wage war against Israel.

Abraham accord is still in place. Arab countries are all still in good relations with Israel. You hear nothing from them regarding the war other than lip service. On the ground level, there is no support for Palestine.

Palestinians already got their own free nations. Its called Gaza and Westbank. Israel does not control both those places. More land was offered to Palestinians in the past and they rejected it every time. Palestinians wanted the entire land of Israel. The current borders are due to the wars lost by Arab countries in the past.

Palestinians are not victims of Israel. They are victims of Arab leadership of the past and the current Hamas. You cannot deny Hamas charter of a few decades ago. That means they have been waging war against Israel for many decades. Their stance only marginally changed in the last few years. Even then the leadership of Hamas wants the total destruction of Israel.

For whom are you composing this? Your fellow Indians who are unable to condemn genocide? If so, then that's commendable. However, why do you anticipate that anyone with a pulse, who isn't a follower of Hindutva ideology or a promoter of Gaza genocide, would believe it? Most individuals can readily verify the facts that you have attempted to distort with your repeated dishonest comments.

 

[smkk]

Gaza is occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades? Last I checked, Hamas was controlling Gaza since 2004 IIRC. Millions were given as funds for Hamas for the development of the place. They used all of it to build tunnels and wage war against Israel.

Abraham accord is still in place. Arab countries are all still in good relations with Israel. You hear nothing from them regarding the war other than lip service. On the ground level, there is no support for Palestine.

Palestinians already got their own free nations. Its called Gaza and Westbank. Israel does not control both those places. More land was offered to Palestinians in the past and they rejected it every time. Palestinians wanted the entire land of Israel. The current borders are due to the wars lost by Arab countries in the past.

Palestinians are not victims of Israel. They are victims of Arab leadership of the past and the current Hamas. You cannot deny Hamas charter of a few decades ago. That means they have been waging war against Israel for many decades. Their stance only marginally changed in the last few years. Even then the leadership of Hamas wants the total destruction of Israel.

Please read the links that I posted above properly. They are not from godi media that you can ignore, these are international standard media or organization who have got world wide recognition. One is from Amnesty who have numerous reports regarding Gaza and WestBank's occupation and how Israel have constantly supercede all kinds of sovereign rights that any free country enjoys.

In fact just few weeks ago Israel voted against UN resolution for recognition of Palestine state, and you have gall to come here and say that Israel gave Gaza back to Palestanians. Israel itself do not recognize Palestine and they by their own admission say they intends to keep Gaza under occupation for indefinite future. But you say otherwise. Please provide your source (please do not quote from any godi media as we and the rest of the world do not consider them to be a recognize source of information) where it says that Israel gave the people of Palestine freedom from their occupation. Israel itself do not admit that.

As for Arabs Israel relations, keep dreaming that Israel have got good relations with other Arab nations without any source. I have already gave you source (Reutars) regarding the apprehension of UAE with Netanyahu and how that have strained their relations already. But main factor is Saudi Arabia, without whose mandate and recognition the entire Middle East will not normalize their ties with Israel. Not only Saudi Arabia have recently taken a hard stance against the normalization talks (regardless western media like to say otherwise), they have forwarded three proposals to accept Israel (which would thurst a knife in the very heart of Netanyahu and the Zionist lobby), if Israel do accepts those proposals for acceptance of the entire regions.

1. Recognize the soveriegnity of Palestine.
2. Withdraw all the forces of Israel from the land of Palestine once and for all.
3. Take back all the settlements from the occupied regions of Palestine.

Aceept these 3 deals and the entire Middle East would recognize Israel. Simple and easy. Without these three, no further muslim countries will normalize their ties with Israel anymore. Before Oct 7 there were many possibilties, but after all these forget it anymore. Netanyahu have basically check mate his own countries possibilities with his hard stance in the region.

As for Arab nations supporting Hamas, I rather not discuss this matter with you (because most of this will goes way above over your head) since you have got very surface level knowledge regarding the geopolitics of Middle East. But just to give you a little hint, say at the very early when this struggle was commencing, why did Blinken visit all the Middle East nations numerous times. It was said that all his visits were results in failure, but nonetheless ke keeps visiting to all the Middle East nations for the next 2 months then. What was he trying to achieve with all these visits? what was his purpose? Gathering support for Israel? Why ? Israel does not need Muslim countries support for whatever he is doing with Palestanians as long as Europe and US support them. Was he was trying to gather support for Israel to throw the Palestanians in the Sinai valley in Egypt? But this proposal came months later after this war begins. And for this proposals you do not need to visit the entire Middle East numerous times to gather support. Just visit Saudi Arabia and Egypt and make them to approve this proposal(which they obviously disapprove). So why did he visit the entire Middle East numerous time in the first 2 months ? And more important question is how come Hamas, Hizbullah and Houtis weapons are lasting for more than 7 months now ? These are not nations and they do not have an extensive weapons manufacturing industries. They are only Iranian proxies. How come Iran have got such deep pockets to provide them with all these dispensible weapons for more than 7 months now? Just based on Russia and China?

 

[Champ_Pal]

For whom are you composing this? Your fellow Indians who are unable to condemn genocide? If so, then that's commendable. However, why do you anticipate that anyone with a pulse, who isn't a follower of Hindutva ideology or a promoter of Gaza genocide, would believe it? Most individuals can readily verify the facts that you have attempted to distort with your repeated dishonest comments.

It is not a genocide. It is civilian deaths that always happen during wars. Of course no one wants civilian casualties. What choice is Israel left with when Hamas hides behind women and children and shoot from their shoulders?

Hamas very well knows that their strategy of hiding among civilians is harming ordinary Arab Muslim in Gaza. But they don't care. They are watching all these deaths on tv sipping coffee from Qatar.

Can you tell me what facts I have distorted? Isn't it true that Israel vacated Gaza and gave it to Palestinians? What did Palestinians do after that? They voted in Hamas which is a terrorist organization and since then there are no elections there. Its been 2 decades since an ordinary Palestinian was allowed to raise their opinions.

 

[smkk]

Forget about Arab nations recognition, Israel is loosing its European allies which is much bigger concern for them then whether Middle East will recognize them or not.

Spain denies port of call to ship carrying arms to Israel
====
Foreign ministry says it will reject all such stopovers because ‘the Middle East does not need more weapons, it needs more peace’

Spain has refused permission for a ship carrying arms to Israel to dock at a Spanish port, its foreign minister, José Manuel Albares, said on Thursday.

“This is the first time we have done this because it is the first time we have detected a ship carrying a shipment of arms to Israel that wants to call at a Spanish port,” he told reporters in Brussels.

“This will be a consistent policy with any ship carrying arms to Israel that wants to call at Spanish ports. The foreign ministry will systematically reject such stopovers for one obvious reason: the Middle East does not need more weapons, it needs more peace.”

Albares did not provide details on the ship but the transport minister, Óscar Puente, said it was the Marianne Danica that had requested permission to call at the south-eastern port of Cartagena on 21 May.

El País said the Danish-flagged ship was carrying 27 tonnes of explosive material from Chennai in India to the port of Haifa in Israel.

Source: The Guardian

Foreign ministry says it will reject all such stopovers because ‘the Middle East does not need more weapons, it needs more peace’

 

[Mesozoic]

Indians have always had a positive impression of Russia and Israel for decades due to their support for us at key stages of our post independence history.

But i guess it's only fair for Pakistanis to have a moan about it considering the fact that those two countries were on India's side when they got chopped into two pieces.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Please read the links that I posted above properly. They are not from godi media that you can ignore, these are international standard media or organization who have got world wide recognition. One is from Amnesty who have numerous reports regarding Gaza and WestBank's occupation and how Israel have constantly supercede all kinds of sovereign rights that any free country enjoys.

In fact just few weeks ago Israel voted against UN resolution for recognition of Palestine state, and you have gall to come here and say that Israel gave Gaza back to Palestanians. Israel itself do not recognize Palestine and they by their own admission say they intends to keep Gaza under occupation for indefinite future. But you say otherwise. Please provide your source (please do not quote from any godi media as we and the rest of the world do not consider them to be a recognize source of information) where it says that Israel gave the people of Palestine freedom from their occupation. Israel itself do not admit that.

As for Arabs Israel relations, keep dreaming that Israel have got good relations with other Arab nations without any source. I have already gave you source (Reutars) regarding the apprehension of UAE with Netanyahu and how that have strained their relations already. But main factor is Saudi Arabia, without whose mandate and recognition the entire Middle East will not normalize their ties with Israel. Not only Saudi Arabia have recently taken a hard stance against the normalization talks (regardless western media like to say otherwise), they have forwarded three proposals to accept Israel (which would thurst a knife in the very heart of Netanyahu and the Zionist lobby), if Israel do accepts those proposals for acceptance of the entire regions.

1. Recognize the soveriegnity of Palestine.

Does Palestine recognize the existence of Israel?

2. Withdraw all the forces of Israel from the land of Palestine once and for all.

Gaza is ruled by Hamas and West bank by PA.

3. Take back all the settlements from the occupied regions of Palestine.

What you call occupied are won by Israel during the wars. Arabs waged wars. They lost them and now the land is not theirs.
If they wanted peace, all Arab countries would not have attacked Israel as a united front. Even then they lost the war badly.

Aceept these 3 deals and the entire Middle East would recognize Israel. Simple and easy. Without these three, no further muslim countries will normalize their ties with Israel anymore. Before Oct 7 there were many possibilties, but after all these forget it anymore. Netanyahu have basically check mate his own countries possibilities with his hard stance in the region.

As for Arab nations supporting Hamas, I rather not discuss this matter with you (because most of this will goes way above over your head) since you have got very surface level knowledge regarding the geopolitics of Middle East. But just to give you a little hint, say at the very early when this struggle was commencing, why did Blinken visit all the Middle East nations numerous times. It was said that all his visits were results in failure, but nonetheless ke keeps visiting to all the Middle East nations for the next 2 months then. What was he trying to achieve with all these visits? what was his purpose? Gathering support for Israel? Why ? Israel does not need Muslim countries support for whatever he is doing with Palestanians as long as Europe and US support them. Was he was trying to gather support for Israel to throw the Palestanians in the Sinai valley in Egypt? But this proposal came months later after this war begins. And for this proposals you do not need to visit the entire Middle East numerous times to gather support. Just visit Saudi Arabia and Egypt and make them to approve this proposal(which they obviously disapprove). So why did he visit the entire Middle East numerous time in the first 2 months ? And more important question is how come Hamas, Hizbullah and Houtis weapons are lasting for more than 7 months now ? These are not nations and they do not have an extensive weapons manufacturing industries. They are only Iranian proxies. How come Iran have got such deep pockets to provide them with all these dispensible weapons for more than 7 months now? Just based on Russia and China?

Funny how you say I will not understand why Arab nations support or not support Hamas. We can see how no Arab nation is helping Hamas other than Qatar. All Arab countries know the truth behind Hamas and who is supporting them.

 

[HalBass9]

It is not a genocide. It is civilian deaths that always happen during wars. Of course no one wants civilian casualties. What choice is Israel left with when Hamas hides behind women and children and shoot from their shoulders?

Hamas very well knows that their strategy of hiding among civilians is harming ordinary Arab Muslim in Gaza. But they don't care. They are watching all these deaths on tv sipping coffee from Qatar.

Can you tell me what facts I have distorted? Isn't it true that Israel vacated Gaza and gave it to Palestinians? What did Palestinians do after that? They voted in Hamas which is a terrorist organization and since then there are no elections there. Its been 2 decades since an ordinary Palestinian was allowed to raise their opinions.

Every comment of yours is distorted fact to support Genocide.

Man! it is an occupation, Israel never vacated Gaza when they control what enters Gaza, it is an occupation no matter how many attempts you take to deny it, Occupation is an Occupation, if it looks like an Occupation then it has to be Occupation.

You are distorting facts, as if none of us aware of the reality. Your talking points are good for Indian media and those who support Genocide in Gaza, but here they drop flat as quick as Israel bombs drop many innocent kids death in Gaza daily.

It isn't a war, it has always been an occupation. Everyone except Israeli and Hindutva agrees.

Every occupation had reaction, a historical fact that you can't ignore. The global south agree it is an occupation and here we have to believe a random Hindutva apologists because he/she, they/them or whatever disagree.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Every comment of yours is distorted fact to support Genocide.

Man! it is an occupation, Israel never vacated Gaza when they control what enters Gaza, it is an occupation no matter how many attempts you take to deny it, Occupation is an Occupation, if it looks like an Occupation then it has to be Occupation.

You are distorting facts, as if none of us aware of the reality. Your talking points are good for Indian media and those who support Genocide in Gaza, but here they drop flat as quick as Israel bombs drop many innocent kids death in Gaza daily.

It isn't a war, it has always been an occupation. Everyone except Israeli and Hindutva agrees.

Every occupation had reaction, a historical fact that you can't ignore. The global south agree it is an occupation and here we have to believe a random Hindutva apologists because he/she, they/them or whatever disagree.

Him to agree with your points, is like questioning the ideology he worships.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

You are distorting facts, as if none of us aware of the reality. Your talking points are good for Indian media and those who support Genocide in Gaza, but here they drop flat as quick as Israel bombs drop many innocent kids death in Gaza daily.

It isn't a war, it has always been an occupation. Everyone except Israeli and Hindutva agrees.

Every occupation had reaction, a historical fact that you can't ignore. The global south agree it is an occupation and here we have to believe a random Hindutva apologists because he/she, they/them or whatever disagree.

This is the perplexing part, why does India need to take israeli side when most of the rest of the world deplores the genocide? Is India drowning in masses of debt due to israel where they are forced to support them in case the debt is called in?

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

The answer is straightforward: Hindutva supporters back Israel because Indian Muslims oppose it.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The answer is straightforward: Hindutva supporters back Israel because Indian Muslims oppose it.

I know the answer I just enjoy watching the hindutvas dancing in circles pretending it's some other reason.

 

[RexRex]

It is not a genocide. It is civilian deaths that always happen during wars. Of course no one wants civilian casualties. What choice is Israel left with when Hamas hides behind women and children and shoot from their shoulders?

Killing civilians is not the answer, that is barbaric. What Israel should have done is invade Gaza and take over its administration instead of bombing the place to smithereens.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Killing civilians is not the answer, that is barbaric. What Israel should have done is invade Gaza and take over its administration instead of bombing the place to smithereens.

Hamas does not have an office or army base that can be attacked. They live in tunnels under the ground which crisscross under the houses of civilians. It seems the tunnels total length is 500 kms+.

While civilian deaths are terrible, what can Israel do when Hamas keeps firing rockets from civilian buildings and then run underground?

At least now Hamas has to accept the current borders and give up their violent ways. But I doubt Hamas will change their goals. They will not relent until they wipe Israel off the map.

 

[HalBass9]

Hamas does not have an office or army base that can be attacked. They live in tunnels under the ground which crisscross under the houses of civilians. It seems the tunnels total length is 500 kms+.

While civilian deaths are terrible, what can Israel do when Hamas keeps firing rockets from civilian buildings and then run underground?

At least now Hamas has to accept the current borders and give up their violent ways. But I doubt Hamas will change their goals. They will not relent until they wipe Israel off the map.

Israel has been accused of attempting to erase Palestinians from the map. Ethnic cleansing has been ongoing since 1948, a term Israeli authorities have dubbed 'mow the lawn.' They seem to be pursuing a similar course of action to avoid being labeled an apartheid state. However, Palestinians are unwilling to leave their land, prompting Israel to resort to violence against individuals ranging from newborns to the deceased.

Every one of your posts appears to be a distorted fantasy masquerading as factual evidence, advocating for genocide against Muslims.

 

[HalBass9]

I know the answer I just enjoy watching the hindutvas dancing in circles pretending it's some other reason.

Everyone knows it; I simply don't understand why they can't openly profess their true love for anti-Muslim sentiments and genocide.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Israel has been accused of attempting to erase Palestinians from the map. Ethnic cleansing has been ongoing since 1948, a term Israeli authorities have dubbed 'mow the lawn.' They seem to be pursuing a similar course of action to avoid being labeled an apartheid state. However, Palestinians are unwilling to leave their land, prompting Israel to resort to violence against individuals ranging from newborns to the deceased.

Every one of your posts appears to be a distorted fantasy masquerading as factual evidence, advocating for genocide against Muslims.

I am all for 2 state solution or 3 state solution with current borders. Everyone should accept it and move on. This is the only way peace will prevail.

 

[RexRex]

Hamas does not have an office or army base that can be attacked. They live in tunnels under the ground which crisscross under the houses of civilians. It seems the tunnels total length is 500 kms+.

While civilian deaths are terrible, what can Israel do when Hamas keeps firing rockets from civilian buildings and then run underground?

At least now Hamas has to accept the current borders and give up their violent ways. But I doubt Hamas will change their goals. They will not relent until they wipe Israel off the map.

Israel lost 1200 civilians in the Oct 7 attack. This Gaza war has had what - 30,000 civilians dead ? That should shock you. I don't think this is mere collateral damage, Israelis are out for revenge.

 

[HalBass9]

I am all for 2 state solution or 3 state solution with current borders. Everyone should accept it and move on. This is the only way peace will prevail.

Certainly, what we are observing is not a pursuit of a two-state solution, but rather a manifestation of ethnic cleansing, a lamentable reality persisting since 1948. It is evident that only one party in this conflict has adamantly refused to embrace the prospect of coexistence through a dual-state framework. The displacement of Palestinians from Gaza is being enforced through the relentless bombardment and indiscriminate loss of life. Even the most uninformed observer could discern the dire circumstances unfolding in Gaza.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Certainly, what we are observing is not a pursuit of a two-state solution, but rather a manifestation of ethnic cleansing, a lamentable reality persisting since 1948. It is evident that only one party in this conflict has adamantly refused to embrace the prospect of coexistence through a dual-state framework. The displacement of Palestinians from Gaza is being enforced through the relentless bombardment and indiscriminate loss of life. Even the most uninformed observer could discern the dire circumstances unfolding in Gaza.

I will agree with the ethnic cleansing argument if Israel continues to bomb Gaza even after Hamas surrenders.

First Hamas needs to surrender. Then only any solution will come out of this.

 

[PakLFC]

What do they consider them to be then? Chimpanzees?

Subhuman is what Saudi's of Palestinians.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Subhuman is what Saudi's of Palestinians.

That must be why the Saudis have killed 40,000 Palestinians in the last 6 months.

 

[Markhor]

Gaza is occupied by Israel for the last 2 decades? Last I checked, Hamas was controlling Gaza since 2004 IIRC. Millions were given as funds for Hamas for the development of the place. They used all of it to build tunnels and wage war against Israel.

Abraham accord is still in place. Arab countries are all still in good relations with Israel. You hear nothing from them regarding the war other than lip service. On the ground level, there is no support for Palestine.

Palestinians already got their own free nations. Its called Gaza and Westbank. Israel does not control both those places. More land was offered to Palestinians in the past and they rejected it every time. Palestinians wanted the entire land of Israel. The current borders are due to the wars lost by Arab countries in the past.

Palestinians are not victims of Israel. They are victims of Arab leadership of the past and the current Hamas. You cannot deny Hamas charter of a few decades ago. That means they have been waging war against Israel for many decades. Their stance only marginally changed in the last few years. Even then the leadership of Hamas wants the total destruction of Israel.

Israel voluntarily gave Gaza to Palestinians. It was the land they won during the war, but gave it away to Palestinians. If Greater Israel was indeed their plan, they would have never given Gaza and Westbank to Palestinians.

Some misconceptions that needs addressing.

1) The West Bank and Gaza are not free nations by any definition. The Palestinians under the 1993 Oslo Accords gained limited autonomy in those areas.

2) The PA control only 40% of the West Bank. The rest (Area C) is under full Israeli civil and military control.

Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005 but still control the airspace, two of the three border crossings and territorial waters. They even control the Palestinian population registry so not a single birth, marriage or death evades their approval. Former British PM David Cameron likened Gaza to an open air prison. If that's freedom what does occupation look like ?

3) Greater Israel remains the dream of the right who dominate Israeli politics. Several members of Israel's government attended a conference in January calling for the resettlement of Gaza, including their far-right National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir who's spoken of "voluntary emigration" of Gazans.

Meanwhile around 700,000 inhabit settlements in the West Bank which are in violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention. The land grabs have worsened since Oct 7th as rampaging settlers seize more Palestinian farmland with IDF collusion. It's akin to agreeing to share a pizza only for one party to gobble up the other person's slice.

Bar one highly caveated speech in 2009, Netanyahu has repeatedly opposed a Palestinian state. How many times must he or other Israeli politicians say it before people like yourselves believe it ?

 

[aboveandbeyond]

I am all for 2 state solution or 3 state solution with current borders. Everyone should accept it and move on. This is the only way peace will prevail.

No you are not. You have not condemned the zionests Genocidal actions, which has let to the massacering of 40k innocent civilians.

On that basis alone, how can you support a 2 state solution! You seriously have more faces than big Ben!

 

[cricketjoshila]

Israel lost 1200 civilians in the Oct 7 attack. This Gaza war has had what - 30,000 civilians dead ? That should shock you. I don't think this is mere collateral damage, Israelis are out for revenge.

If someone slaps you once, can he expect only one slap in return? What if you kick him twice?


US lost 5000 civilians in 9/11. How many civilians died in Afghanistan and Iraq?

This is a war. Not the first war nor the last one. And this is the reality of war.

This is why everytime you decide to provoke a country with asymmetric warfare, think again.

US responded with disproportionate force.

Srilanka wiped off LTTE with disproportionate force.

Now its Israel.

Asymmetric warfare has lost its significance.

A ceasefire with complete dismantling of Hamas is needed. Hamas leadership cannot be sitting comfortably and expect Israel to stop.

 

[Hitman]

No you are not. You have not condemned the zionests Genocidal actions, which has let to the massacering of 40k innocent civilians.

On that basis alone, how can you support a 2 state solution! You seriously have more faces than big Ben!

So what do you suggest for long term peace?

 

[uppercut]

No you are not. You have not condemned the zionests Genocidal actions, which has let to the massacering of 40k innocent civilians.

Have you ever condemned the acts of the terrorist org like Hamas?

 

[Champ_Pal]

No you are not. You have not condemned the zionests Genocidal actions, which has let to the massacering of 40k innocent civilians.

On that basis alone, how can you support a 2 state solution! You seriously have more faces than big Ben!

I condemn the death of innocent civilians. But the blame goes on Hamas as much as on IDF.

Why haven't Hamas surrendered yet? They are the ones who is supposed to protect their people. But they are hiding among common people and firing rockets and bullets from civilian areas.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Israel has been accused of attempting to erase Palestinians from the map. Ethnic cleansing has been ongoing since 1948, a term Israeli authorities have dubbed 'mow the lawn.' They seem to be pursuing a similar course of action to avoid being labeled an apartheid state. However, Palestinians are unwilling to leave their land, prompting Israel to resort to violence against individuals ranging from newborns to the deceased.

Every one of your posts appears to be a distorted fantasy masquerading as factual evidence, advocating for genocide against Muslims.

Lots of accusations in your post.

Ethnic cleansing is what Arabs tried to do to Israel in 1948 war and then in 1967 war. But Arab nations failed badly. In between there were many other wars that Israel fought.

Each time, the war was started by Arab countries. So the Ethnic cleansing allegation does not hold.

Your allegation of Apartheid state also does not hold. 21% of Israel population is Arab. What is the Jewish population in Palestine areas? Arabs can hold any job or office in Israel. So how is Israel apartheid?

 

[IMMY69]

Lots of accusations in your post.

Ethnic cleansing is what Arabs tried to do to Israel in 1948 war and then in 1967 war. But Arab nations failed badly. In between there were many other wars that Israel fought.

Each time, the war was started by Arab countries. So the Ethnic cleansing allegation does not hold.

Your allegation of Apartheid state also does not hold. 21% of Israel population is Arab. What is the Jewish population in Palestine areas? Arabs can hold any job or office in Israel. So how is Israel apartheid?

There are pro israel and then there are those that practice Judaism.
You do know that before Hitler the Jews, Christians and Muslims lived together harmoniously in Palestine?

 

[RexRex]

If someone slaps you once, can he expect only one slap in return? What if you kick him twice?


US lost 5000 civilians in 9/11. How many civilians died in Afghanistan and Iraq?

This is a war. Not the first war nor the last one. And this is the reality of war.

This is why everytime you decide to provoke a country with asymmetric warfare, think again.

US responded with disproportionate force.

Srilanka wiped off LTTE with disproportionate force.

Now its Israel.

Asymmetric warfare has lost its significance.

A ceasefire with complete dismantling of Hamas is needed. Hamas leadership cannot be sitting comfortably and expect Israel to stop.

Don't be so flippant about human life. These are 30,000 innocent civilians who had nothing to do with the Oct 7 attack. If it was your family who got stuck in a war-torn region, your opinion would be different.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Lots of accusations in your post.

Ethnic cleansing is what Arabs tried to do to Israel in 1948 war and then in 1967 war. But Arab nations failed badly. In between there were many other wars that Israel fought.

Each time, the war was started by Arab countries. So the Ethnic cleansing allegation does not hold.

Your allegation of Apartheid state also does not hold. 21% of Israel population is Arab. What is the Jewish population in Palestine areas? Arabs can hold any job or office in Israel. So how is Israel apartheid?

Going to war with another nation is not ethnic cleansing. If you can't even distinguish then it is pointless calling this a debate, it is just an attempt to push fake agendas for no apparent purpose.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Don't be so flippant about human life. These are 30,000 innocent civilians who had nothing to do with the Oct 7 attack. If it was your family who got stuck in a war-torn region, your opinion would be different.

Tell this to the family of the 1200 who lost their lives or the thousands who have lost their lives to Hamas attacks.

Sitting comfortably in western city and giving sermons on peace is easy.

A large part of my family survived the partition and a later perished in 1971. Don't tell me about war.

 

[Hitman]

Going to war with another nation is not ethnic cleansing. If you can't even distinguish then it is pointless calling this a debate, it is just an attempt to push fake agendas for no apparent purpose.

I agree! Ethnic cleansing is something like Operation Searchlight that was launched on East Pakistan in 1971.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I agree! Ethnic cleansing is something like Operation Searchlight that was launched on East Pakistan in 1971.

Maybe it was but since we are not talking about east Pakistan in 1971, this is just another attempt to sidestep the topic.

FYI the topic is hindutva support for israeli genocide in Palestine.

 

[FearlessRoar]

I agree! Ethnic cleansing is something like Operation Searchlight that was launched on East Pakistan in 1971.

I guess you have forgotten the 1984 anti-Sikh riots. so let me remind you it was genocide

 

[Hitman]

I guess you have forgotten the 1984 anti-Sikh riots. so let me remind you it was genocide

It was shameful. But it wasn’t state sponsored. That’s the difference.

 

[HalBass9]

Lots of accusations in your post.

Ethnic cleansing is what Arabs tried to do to Israel in 1948 war and then in 1967 war. But Arab nations failed badly. In between there were many other wars that Israel fought.

Each time, the war was started by Arab countries. So the Ethnic cleansing allegation does not hold.

Your allegation of Apartheid state also does not hold. 21% of Israel population is Arab. What is the Jewish population in Palestine areas? Arabs can hold any job or office in Israel. So how is Israel apartheid?

Amusing, I give up, you've won sir. Enjoy.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

I condemn the death of innocent civilians. But the blame goes on Hamas as much as on IDF.

Why haven't Hamas surrendered yet? They are the ones who is supposed to protect their people. But they are hiding among common people and firing rockets and bullets from civilian areas.

I know it's hard for you to speak with facts as that would be pretty much hypocritical on one hand condemning the zionest terrorists yet worshipping a ideology which is pretty much similar

 

[Hitman]

I guess you have forgotten the 1984 anti-Sikh riots. so let me remind you it was genocide

Anyways, the 1984 anti Sikh riots and the 2002 Gujarat riots are two darkest spots on Indian democracy.

 

[HalBass9]

Please pay attention to this thread. The only individuals endorsing the Hindutva defense for the genocide are those affiliated with the BJP Hindutva ideology. The remainder of the Indian populace is aligned with the morally justifiable stance. As someone has already pointed out, this support is rooted solely in anti-Muslim sentiment. Therefore, there is no further need for discussion within this thread.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Have you ever condemned the acts of the terrorist org like Hamas?

Why should i condem freedom fighters who are the product of 76 years of brutal occupation and oppression.

But for your ilk, regimes that carry out opression against the helpless are deemed normal

 

[aboveandbeyond]

So what do you suggest for long term peace?

The zionest state has made sure of NO two state solution by bombing everything in to rubble or are these lies as well.

The zionest illegal settlers from Europe, USA, are already drawing plans about the rebuild for their own ilk in illegal occupation territories.

IDF never had the intention of a two state solution.

 

[uppercut]

Why should i condem freedom fighters who are the product of 76 years of brutal occupation and oppression.

But for your ilk, regimes that carry out opression against the helpless are deemed normal

I see ... maybe you want to explain how the jewish community that used to have significant population in the entire middle east got almost completely wiped out from there ? Who do you hold responsible for that?

Act of Martians I suppose?

 

[Hitman]

The zionest state has made sure of NO two state solution by bombing everything in to rubble or are these lies as well.

The zionest illegal settlers from Europe, USA, are already drawing plans about the rebuild for their own ilk in illegal occupation territories.

IDF never had the intention of a two state solution.

You didn't answer my question. What's your solution to long term peace in the region?

 

[HalBass9]

Here you go with same repeated argument from the followers of Hindutava. Israelites have a right to commit Genocide because Jews once lived on the same land.

 

[Hitman]

Here you go with same repeated argument from the followers of Hindutava. Zionist have a right to commit Genocide because Jews once lived on the same land.

No country has the right to commit genocide. But do you agree that Israel has the right to exist?

 

[HalBass9]

No country has the right to commit genocide. But do you agree that Israel has the right to exist?

Of course it does.

 

[Hitman]

Of course it does.

Thanks for replying! Anyways, the world detests peace and love war.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

No country has the right to commit genocide. But do you agree that Israel has the right to exist?

I don't think it does but that is just a personal opinion. Jews should have continued co-existing peacefully in Palestine, there was no need for Israel which was imposed on the middle east by western colonial powers. But that's history now and can't be undone without untold damage. I could never condone genocide of the Jews as they are conducting genocide of Palestinians.

 

[Hitman]

I don't think it does but that is just a personal opinion. Jews should have continued co-existing peacefully in Palestine, there was no need for Israel which was imposed on the middle east by western colonial powers. But that's history now and can't be undone without untold damage. I could never condone genocide of the Jews as they are conducting genocide of Palestinians.

And then you defend the creation of Pakistan?

 

[Hitman]

Why should i condem freedom fighters who are the product of 76 years of brutal occupation and oppression.

But for your ilk, regimes that carry out opression against the helpless are deemed normal

These are your freedom fighters?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1791903302235369604

 

[aboveandbeyond]

I see ... maybe you want to explain how the jewish community that used to have significant population in the entire middle east got almost completely wiped out from there ? Who do you hold responsible for that?

Act of Martians I suppose?

Muslims, orthodox Jews, Christians all lived in peace until the evil forces of the zionests turned up. Orthodox Jews, Christians, as well as the palastanian muslims were a deliberate target of the zionests who quickly realised their evil practices where comprehensively rejected.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

These are your freedom fighters?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1791903302235369604

Any American pro zionest source has to be taken as a pinch of salt. Who have flip flopped ample times.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

You didn't answer my question. What's your solution to long term peace in the region?

To live in peace like they always did before the zionests from Europe and usa turned up. They were, and are the root cause of the problem.

And they have shown their hypocrisy in open to.make sure there will be no peace for the palastanians.

 

[HalBass9]

These are your freedom fighters?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1791903302235369604

I'm surprise see she didn't mentioned 50 beheaded babies.

Please stop propagating zionest propaganda. Beside taking hostages pretty much all other claims from Zionest have put to rest months ago.

 

[uppercut]

Muslims, orthodox Jews, Christians all lived in peace until the evil forces of the zionests turned up. Orthodox Jews, Christians, as well as the palastanian muslims were a deliberate target of the zionests who quickly realised their evil practices where comprehensively rejected.

We will come to that in a moment.... first lets establish who drove them away from a whole bunch of Muslim countries? Whats your take how that came to be?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

And then you defend the creation of Pakistan?

Nope, this is where you are making assumptions, I don't agree with the creation of Pakistan, although seeing India veering towards the anti-Muslim radical hindutva state it is headed, I can see why Jinnah felt it was necessary to fight for it. From what I know initially he was not a proponent of partition.

 

[PakLFC]

That must be why the Saudis have killed 40,000 Palestinians in the last 6 months.

They don't need to do that. Instead they are watching the zionest do that from the sidelines.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

We will come to that in a moment.... first lets establish who drove them away from a whole bunch of Muslim countries? Whats your take how that came to be?

What. Orthodox Jews still exist in Palastine. The USA European zionests had no right to this land. The Balfor declaration gave them the green light to forcfully occupy, and then begin the eventual Genocide

 

[uppercut]

What. Orthodox Jews still exist in Palastine.

Iam talking about all countries OUTSIDE of CURRENT day Israel and Palestine in the entire Middle east. Don't try to play the dead beat card.

 

[big_gamer007]

And then you defend the creation of Pakistan?

Religion is the strongest force which drives thinking for a lot of Muslims.

If the shoe was on the other foot the tune of most people here would have been different.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Going to war with another nation is not ethnic cleansing. If you can't even distinguish then it is pointless calling this a debate, it is just an attempt to push fake agendas for no apparent purpose.

Arab nations wanted to end the Jewish state. Jews wanted a land where they can practice their religion freely without any fear.

 

[BouncerGuy]

How can anyone justify the killing of almost 8000 children in Gaza? More than 35000 people have died till now. How can anybody support this?

 

[uppercut]

How can anyone justify the killing of almost 8000 children in Gaza? More than 35000 people have died till now. How can anybody support this?

Nobody is justifying anything ... the point is that had Hamas not done what they did last October the situation wouldnt have come to this. And Palestinians are not exactly the innocent doodh sey dhule hua types. Israel knows what it is to survive... the only option for them is to use disproportionate force. Don't like it ? Well the options are very simple. Don't start what you cannot end.

But its quite ironic to see people who glorify abominable rulers like Aurangzeb etc. now cry about what Israel does. There are people here who And actually take pride in their achievements and openly claim that it was the best thing to have happened to Indian subcontinent!!! ... Just because these animals lived a long time ago does not mean that in 21st century we eulogize them.

And BTW how many people here have condemned the actions of Hamas?

 

[BouncerGuy]

condemned the actions of Hamas?

Do you see Hamas specifically targeting children? Please let me know the source so I can watch it myself because I have not heard a single news where the media is saying that Hamas has fired rockets on a camp with children and women in it, or people trying to flee away from this crisis. Have you heard any such news?

 

[uppercut]

Do you see Hamas specifically targeting children? Please let me know the source so I can watch it myself because I have not heard a single news where the media is saying that Hamas has fired rockets on a camp with children and women in it, or people trying to flee away from this crisis. Have you heard any such news?

What is Hamas and why is it fighting with Israel in Gaza?

Hamas attacked Israel on 7 October 2023, killing about 1,200 people and taking over 250 hostages.

www.google.com

From that link:

What happened during the Hamas attacks on Israel?
On the morning of 7 October, waves of Hamas gunmen stormed across Gaza's border into Israel, killing about 1,200 people. Hamas also fired thousands of rockets.


Those killed included children, the elderly and 364 young people at a music festival. 

Hamas took more than 250 others to Gaza as hostages.

The BBC has also seen evidence of rape and sexual violence during the Hamas attacks

 

[BouncerGuy]

What is Hamas and why is it fighting with Israel in Gaza?

Hamas attacked Israel on 7 October 2023, killing about 1,200 people and taking over 250 hostages.

www.google.com

From that link:

What happened during the Hamas attacks on Israel?
On the morning of 7 October, waves of Hamas gunmen stormed across Gaza's border into Israel, killing about 1,200 people. Hamas also fired thousands of rockets.


Those killed included children, the elderly and 364 young people at a music festival. 

Hamas took more than 250 others to Gaza as hostages.

The BBC has also seen evidence of rape and sexual violence during the Hamas attacks

I guess you missed this part.

More than 33,000 Palestinians have been killed, and tens of thousands injured by Israeli strikes since the start of the war, according to Gaza's Hamas-run health ministry. It says most were women and children.

 

[Hitman]

Any American pro zionest source has to be taken as a pinch of salt. Who have flip flopped ample times.

"Allah O' Akbar" .... what was that in that video?

 

[uppercut]

I guess you missed this part.

More than 33,000 Palestinians have been killed, and tens of thousands injured by Israeli strikes since the start of the war, according to Gaza's Hamas-run health ministry. It says most were women and children.

Nope I didnt ... Iwas merely giving you the facts that Hamas initiated the violence, killed women and children and elderly, raped ...So therefore Israel is out to properly decimate them and they openly made that clear before taking military action.

So who started this?

 

[BouncerGuy]

Nope I didnt ... Iwas merely giving you the facts that Hamas initiated the violence, killed women and children and elderly, raped ...So therefore Israel is out to properly decimate them and they openly made that clear before taking military action.

So who started this?

Tell me how many hamas guys isreal have killed till now compared to children till date. Israel is just targeting children and women now. Why????

 

[uppercut]

Tell me how many hamas guys isreal have killed till now compared to children till date. Israel is just targeting children and women now. Why????

Well lets start from the beginning of this episode on Oct 7th. Explain why Hamas killed even one single Israeli civilian never mind women children.

Go ahead lets see your reasoning.